Relationship Christmas Wish List – Need Help!

[EF2511]

Ok, so Christmas in our home is usually bad… My sufferer does not have fond memories during this time of year. On the other hand I don’t have any negative ones until we got together 3 years ago. My family in spite of all their dysfunction had good Christmas’s and they always seemed to find a way to get us nice things. I try to do the same for my family. It’s probably why my only child gets very spoiled this time of year. But anyway on with my post…

I know her stress level is elevated. She’s recently changed her sleep schedule to be opposite mine. I work nights but do well financially and she doesn’t work. So we don’t really sleep together now and it was one of the few times I feel close to her and i've told her this concern, we usually go to sleep with my arms around her, which she also doesn’t want anymore, causes her neck pain now. She’s also has withdrawn affectionately. By that I mean I have to ask for it most times and am met with a small amount that she feels fills her obligation. She sometimes gives it but I feel it’s due to this sense of obligation – a kiss goodbye, good morning, etc. Any sexual urges in her are gone… asking for it one night ruined an otherwise wonderful weekend last week. Been hell ever since. I don't put pressure on her in that sense, i stop asking when i see certain signs!

She had said that on Sunday night she didn’t really want me to take the night off… said she wanted to have alone time n recharge. I understand that but also thought I’d try to get her in a good mood since it was a nice weekend. Came up to the bedroom and watched the rest of a movie with her. She responded positively, smiling and being somewhat affectionate. It felt good and I was sort of put in the mood. That’s when it went kaput!

She emailed me several days later and it started a disastrous week. While she was telling me about her state of mind in an email it felt like she pulled me into it somehow and it is almost impossible for me to not get defensive. There were literally 10 pages to every one I wrote back in the chain… I won't go on about every detail. So here are some of the things she said in the first one that just can’t seem to be resolved and a basis of all others that followed:

- it seems you're taking it personally, and pushing away from me now. I haven't seen you smile in a few days like you're glad I'm here. (Me: we just didn’t sync up – work and I was sick, she was gone too, But I had not said anything at all to make her feel this way…)

- Sunday night I decided to take that time for myself anyway, and it seems you're not happy about that at all. That disappoints me. When you asked for sex, I thought "Wow, you can't get any more personal than that, and I was very clear that I wanted time to myself". (Me: I just felt we were having a moment and didn’t have any intention other than making her feel better that night, the request was spontaneous. Afterwards I kissed her goodnight, reassured her it was OK that she said no, and left her alone)

- Giving in to your need that night, when I had a need of my own, was like saying to myself "I don't matter. The bigger priority is pleasing you". (Me: I responded saying that in a relationship there is some expectation that we make each other feel good, not necessarily sex, but anything like a foot rub. It’s not a bad thing. I understand not being in the mood, but it’s not a battle of giving in. Major repercussions from saying that.)

- I'm feeling a ton of performance "pressure" just in the look on your face every day. (Me: I didn’t know what to say)

- I got your note this morning, and it confuses me too. I asked you to bring the laundry down two days ago, but you waited until after 8pm to carry it down….I feel like a child afraid of a beating when Daddy comes home for not cleaning my room. I hate that! I also feel that the things I'm doing aren't going to be appreciated or even acknowledged in any way, and that makes me angry subconsciously while I'm doing them. That's my issue, but you're not helping any by taking the same attitude that Chuck did; "I didn't do it fast enough" or "What I did wasn't on his priority list". (Me: I NEVER say those things. I was admittedly irritated with her the day of the note. She asked to bring laundry down days ago, I did it within two hours, also said I needed clothes for work. So she waited two days to do mine. I left a note: “Can you please do laundry today, I need underwear and jeans for work, thanks.” I got the not respecting PTSD card thrown at me for that one, I said I think it’s more personality… she lets things go and is notoriously late, than being a PTSD effect. Not a good thing to say to her either, but I know her, you know?)

- When you came upstairs on Sunday, I was not happy about it at first (only a few minutes), and then I was kind of pleased with it when you stated that you understood my need for "Meli time". (Me: I did and was very sweet, but am still at a loss as to why she only focused on the request for sex)

- I don't feel appreciated, I don't feel truly loved, and I don't feel worthy of your time. (Me: I just want her to keep her responsibilities, I give a ton of slack to her… but to say nothing isn’t going to fix things in my opinion. I am not mean when the subject of getting housework done comes up. But i always say i love you, when she does do a nice job cleaning the kitchen or with dinner i tell her.. i know i sound defensive huh. But how do i not feel that way?)

What I sent her back in response was the following in full. And the basis for a ton anger in her.

I don't feel good.

But i know that isn't gonna fly...

And I know you are trying to say everything in a way that is not taken as attacking or anything other than a caring girlfriend. But what i read is all about you and i can not help but feel defensive.

That's how it usually is and how i see it is your explaining why your the one who is being 'wronged'. I know you feel like you are just being concerned so i will try to answer with a quick comment in your email... and I know you don't like hearing that either. But i have to call it like i see it.

love you!

So long story short I got an 8 page email back…, then a 10 page one I never read ugh! I made a commitment to myself that I will tell her how she is being even though I knew it would not go well. I have been reading about PTSD and trying very hard to understand it. I see things in her she feels are PTSD related but I’m pretty sure are just her personality traits and I’ve been strong in saying don’t use the PTSD card when it does not apply. She fights that one tooth and nail. But again, she has to be responsable for what she can control.

Among other things I tried to explain to her that her recent changes make me feel like she is more like another child (should have said roommate) I have to support than a girlfriend. Citing the not sleeping together, withdrawal of affection, and not having sexual relations. Some things she does also seem childish in nature too lately. I wanted to know what she was, either my partner or another dependant because I too have needs.

She’s broke my heart before when she took off with another guy for a couple months, she was behaving the same then so I need a little reassurance from time to time too when i see similar patterns.

Well that was a bomb that blew up. I still feel even if it kills the relationship she needs to know how I really feel. She also can’t dismiss that PTSD affects us both and sometimes things that are said just need let go. I told her I was ‘full’ early on and to stop but she just couldn’t stop. Dealing with PTSD everyday wears on us both and this is one occasion when I asked that I use the PTSD card to move on and let it go. I want us to have a nice Christmas.

So my question to all of you, both carers and sufferers.

What should I do to save Christmas?

Should I cave like I usually do to right the ship or hold firm?

Any discussion of the weeks events ends with her yelling so I really can’t talk to her about about it. She feels I trashed her personality and called her worthless. i love her dearly... but help!

Please tell me your thoughts even if it's that i'm being a dolt or dense headed oaf if that is how you feel... i just need a little help to know what it is that seems to be going wrong here!

 

[lovinbiker]

What should I do to save Christmas?

EF if only someone could give you an easy answer to that. but I feel sadly there isnt gonna be any one good answer to that.
I would like to say that I feel for you trying to work through this difficult time.

I would suggest that you did the right thing by not reading the last 10 page email.wouldnt have done any good in my opinion. I really dont think I can offer any good advise other than to say. I would learn from your mistakes ( like the bringing up sex) and try and make the best of the situation.
Somebody said to me that I was trying to find logic and understanding when there was none.. I couldnt understand or see any logic in what was been said to me by my sufferer. Truth is that a ptsd wired brain will see things differently and that trying to reason and find logic will often make things worse. Sometimes I think you just gotta let them ride it out a bit, and most certainly try not to take anything personal. In my opinion any way.
Im curious to see what other responses you get
Take care
LB

 

[intothelight]

Hi EF,

This is tough, but there were some things I noticed I am going to throw out as food for thought. Please do not take offense, they are just a third party observation:

When you came upstairs on Sunday, I was not happy about it at first (only a few minutes), and then I was kind of pleased with it when you stated that you understood my need for "Meli time". (Me: I did and was very sweet, but am still at a loss as to why she only focused on the request for sex)

EF, she actually answered that question for you:

Sunday night I decided to take that time for myself anyway, and it seems you're not happy about that at all. That disappoints me. When you asked for sex, I thought "Wow, you can't get any more personal than that, and I was very clear that I wanted time to myself". (Me: I just felt we were having a moment and didn’t have any intention other than making her feel better that night, the request was spontaneous. Afterwards I kissed her goodnight, reassured her it was OK that she said no, and left her alone)

When a person asks for time alone, others should honor the request period. It is not a matter of PTSD, it is a matter of respecting someone's wishes. My husband does not have PTSD and he likes to take time to himself to play the guitar, banjo, piano, etc. Music is his way of decompressing. I would never dream of intruding on his private space. It would be extremely rude if I did.

EF, it is tough, but relationships are tough. Communication is critical and has been one of the most difficult areas for my husband and I to address. I seems that you both are trying, but kind of stuck at an impass. Here are some things we tried that have really helped.

1. Agree to wipe the slate clean and start fresh with communication. No digging up the past and using it as a weapon or an excuse,
2. Use "I" statements, since you are the only one who knows how you feel and don't assume you know how another thinks or feels.

And I know you are trying to say everything in a way that is not taken as attacking or anything other than a caring girlfriend. But what i read is all about you and i can not help but feel defensive.

Since you know she is trying very hard to not be attacking, then give her the benefit of the doubt and do not be defensive. I statements are not selfish, just the opposite, they facilitate effective communication by minimizing the defensiveness associated with "you" statements.

I am not trying to even suggest I have answers. It is just I see two people trying really hard and they are just not in sync yet. My husband and I struggled with this dance, and it has taken a lot of time and hard work to reduce the amount of times we step on each others toes.

Just a few last thoughts:

PTSD does not change our character, it affects behavior and emotional responses.
Yes, it does mean that a sufferer thinks differently, but the only way you know how someone is thinking is for them to tell you.
Bottom line, men think differently than woman and individuals are all unique. Problems with communication can be found in all relationships, and it all requires work.

I honestly hope this helps and I am wishing the best for you.

Debbie

 

[EF2511]

LB,

I wish i could, i really do! I think that if she could see her contradictions that are everywhere i would be able to diferentiate which is PTSD and what is personality. What i mean is If i don't ask for sex, it will have effect A, if i do it has effect B, sometimes it is normal... much like when i said she wanted to be alone. She did, but she also tells me when she wants to be alone what she really needs is a big hug and love. So if it is PTSD wouldn't the end result usually be the same?

It's like when we are in an argument or even a discussion i will almost always get the one which best suppports her need at the time. Which usually is the one which gets her beliefs validated....

I'm lossing my desire to keep trying with each one....

Thanks for your thoughts!
EF

 

[EF2511]

Debbie,

I get what you are saying, but there was so much more she said...I felt like i put way too much in already but she assures me that a PTSD sufferers who read on here needs a ton of details to make sense of something. What i shared was just one of many examples but the one point about alone time is that there were two different responses by her. One was that she was happy - the expected result b/c she has told me i need to just 'scoop her up and squeeze her' to bring her back when she is going into a zone. The other was i didn't respect her and communication locks up when this happens. Until i appoliogize for doing what she told me to do... it's a maze i am lost in.

I do love my alone time too. We're both somewhat introverted. Time alone to recharge is something she tells me means away from people who are not imediate family. the situation is just really hard to explain i guess. Did you mean that you also understood what i meant about personality/charector being one thing and effects from the dissorder being another. Cause i have to say when ever i have said anything was normal to her it brings out a rage in her. Another topic i suppose though.

We are having a planned one hour discussion tonight. She wants to talk about some things which sound similar to your advice on using 'I' words and a clean slate so she must have seen something here. We set it for an hour, and she agreed that if yelling starts it's done.

Wish me luck!

 

[anni]

Hi,

This is tough for me. I want to see this from her viewpoint more, as someone who has PTSD, but I was married for some time to someone who actively used it against me as a weapon. When I brought it up, he dragged me to 4 differant counselors before he found one who agreed with him that I was some beyond-comprehension, broken and mentally ill, incompetant patient, wasn't he a peach amd martyr for putting up with me. I can at least say I would have loved to have had someone who did look around and ask questions which are genuine. I was disallowed any input whatsoever on anything, on the grounds I had PTSD, and therefore and idiot. I see what she's saying, however, and recognize the reactions to a lot of things. I would have just been fortunate to have had someone willling to come ask questions, not use this against me.

Is it possible, at this short notice, to ask her point blank the same question- phrased sort of benignly, as to how you can have a good Christmas together? She sounds reactive, so yes, I understand might take this badly. It's important to you so worth a shot, perhaps. You do seem to be putting out a great deal of effort, so if it is the wrong effort,then the same could be redirected into what WOULD work, if that makes sense. She does have to let you know what that might be, clearly, I think. As ITL said, agree to wipe the slate clean, agree to be clear, avoid the hell out of 'you' statements and go from there. I can tell you, as a female, AND a PTSD sufferer, even the most kindly worded note ( and even if I should have had that laundry done ) would have sent me into a guilt/shame/ick state, to be sure. Is it also possible, at this short notice, to get someone to help you two maybe sit down together and work something out? A professional, I mean. She might like this, since it does mean you wish to 'hear her', and one would certainly help translate the PTSD-ese for you. As others said, however, PTSD doesn't change one's personality. No matter what becomes clear through a conversation like this would be, it's not going to change some reaction inherant to who she might be as a person, anyway.

I hope the Christmas is salvagable- it's important, I know.Thanks for coming and asking and hoping, too.All the best to you.

Anni

 

[catjudo]

but she also tells me when she wants to be alone what she really needs is a big hug and love.

Perhaps the difference is that it seemed in your first post that this was somewhat scheduled me time that she asked for. That being the case, it might be less likely that it was the kind of reactive me time when she might need a big hug and reassurances. Regardless, if she's told you that sometimes when she needs alone time what she needs is a big hug...this is far different from saying she needs alone time and you asking her for sex. It sounds like she was somewhat receptive to you spending some quiet alone time with her but things went downhill when you asked for sex. I think she does have a point, if she asked for alone time and you asked for sex, the two requests can't get much different from each other.

 

[EF2511]

Catjudo,

When i told her i was taking the night off she said she was kind of looking forward to some alone time. Wanted to watch a movie i had already watched with my daughter when she was on vacation. So i watched a football game for a few hours then went upstairs to see her. she had the movie on, watched it with her... ended up snuggling and she was happy. The arousal just happened and it hasn'st been a problem to initiate intimacy up until the last couple months. Something changed in her and it's been a basis of me feeling like she has pulled away and is now more like a roommate than a girlfriend.

When i express this to her she goes off on how it's part of her recovery and i am not being respectful of her. I call these unknowns that i walk into landmines b/c i never know what has change or when it changed. Tomorrow her sexual desire may return and i would get the same result for not going with the intimacy when it happened you know?

 

[EF2511]

Anni,

I found a place for her to go get more therapy... we're not married so she has to make the call. I did the leg work for her because she is unable, but the last time i set it up and took her to the place to register, drove her there and waited there for the 1st ten sessions. When she started to feel comfortable and no anxiety going i stopped going. I felt she needed to get herself 'independant' in seeking help. I am still supportive, just letting her get comfortable managing it for herself.

i say this b/c i see PTSD recovery as being similar to what an alcoholic goes through sobering up. I was/am an alcoholic, which i prefer to say i had alcoholic behavior because i feel we are not powerless over anything. We have to personally accept what we are doing (behavior) and when we do only then can we begin recovery. I have been sober for 12 years. I one day decided i didn't want to be that way anymore. Only then did i begin to be helped with the aid of a therapist i have been successful... after many failed attempts of course. I can't get her to see this as i try to help her. But in short her making those steps to call the therapist and getting it set up is her saying to herself that she wants to change. Others doing it for her only pacify's the Ptsd feelings. It also means she is not truely ready to accept that she has had all she can take of being that way and may not be capable of the comitment it takes to change yet. It is very difficult, i know form my own experience how hard it can be!

Does that make any sense? I mean when you look at AA it has steps that can apply to PTSD as well and it has proven very successful to millions of alcoholics.

 

[AdamAnt]

Please explain the alcohol / PTSD analogy please?

 

[Meli]

I would sincerely be interested in hearing this further explained as well. What I understand (from a personal discussion on the matter Tuesday) is that PTSD recovery expectations are being based on one personal experience with alocoholism.

In my opinion; timelines are not the same, and neither are the symptoms. If I'm wrong, please correct me, but I have found no evidence that alocoholism is an anxiety disorder. Two very different treatments are required.

~Meli

 

[EF2511]

Meli,

A timeline for any recovery only follows the path the person sets. I also must have been misunderstood about expectations. Treatments may differ for two alcoholics as much as it would for an alcoholic and a PTSD sufferer. Everyone is unique... but the paths are very similar as the damage / effect on ones life and the lives of family/friends/spouses are the same.

I'm sorry if you felt a timeline was precieved in our conversation. Hopefully today's conversation cleared that issue up.

Although today's conversation also ended with you telling me to delete my account on here among other things... i am going to answer this last question in the next and possibly last post i make.