Controlling Relationships...

[BloomInWinter]

((((brat)))))

You HAVE changed the cycle.

You have shown them what recovery means. You have shown them that it is ok to seek help, to move on, to stand up for yourself.

Did you see any of this in your growing up years?

I relate to your middle daughter a LOT. In my teen years, I felt like I hated my Mom.

I didn't know my dad was gaslighting me into that. Once I realized he was invalidating her, it was too late for us. She was dying of cancer and I never got to show her that I got away from him, BECAUSE of her.

We never got to see our relationship come 'through' to the place you are already at. Someday, she will see your sacrifices and be grateful.

It may not be shared with you but she will know. Because she'll see the ones whose parents truly didn't even try for a recovery and she'll see their lives and know....you did your best in a situation where there were no easy choices.

You HAVE made that difference in her life, and I honor your selflessness. You have much to be proud of.

Your kids will have to find their paths to deal with what the abusers did but you did the loving thing. You make a living amends every time you keep trying.

Good for you!

 

[mamachick]

Unfortunate update-----

Just before this incident, I had deposited a check from my daughter into my bank account as she had just gotten her financial aid check.

Three days after this incident, she called me 12 times in an hour until I finally talked to her. She never said she was sorry. She talked....blah blah blah defending her position.Finally I asked her what she would do if she were I, she said she would apologize. We left it on speaking terms. She said she would not come her though because I am inconsiderate-I said I understand her position. It was left this way.

The next day she called to tell me about good grades and a summer job offer. All good. Then she tells me that her landlord never received her check so she had to cancel it, but she did not know the number, and hopes she didnt cancel the wrong one-the one she wrote me. Ahhhhh If this happened, she assured me it was an accident and she would replace it. I told her that I suspect this sounds like a story and if she was mad and thought she would do this to get even, just tell me now so I can take care of it. She denied that and swore it was the truth. (I know this is the kind of mess she makes for me if I stand up for myself.)

Yesterday I only had $11 in my account, today-I am $689 over plus a bunch of fees. I believe my daugter did this with the attitude of "Ill fix her". She has been this way since she was 15 and her father and I seperated. She has lied and been dramatic if she does not get her way.

I have spent over $40,000 on her in the past 2 years, besides the home that I provide, and the car that I provide her with.

I called her and told her that the money was removed from my account and that I am overdrawn. She said she would get me a new check. I told her that I would need to see the letter from the landlord that said they did not receive the rent check and the stop payment receipt or I was going to need her car back and that I would sell it. She hung up on me.

I then spoke with her father about this as I knew she had told him, and he screamed at me that I should trust her, and that if I touched her car, he would take the utilities out of his name and have them shut off. (that is a whole story in itself) He said that if she said it was an accident, that it is-she would not lie, its just a mistake. I told him that I do not want her car, she needs to come clean about the behavior, and if I am wrong, I will promptly apologize.

I know in my heart that she did this deliberately. This is how my life has been since I seperated from her father. She will take out anyone who doesnt abide to her rules or give her what she wants.

I feel so beaten down by this girl and by her dad.

 

[Queen Boudica]

Oh I am so sorry ((((brat17)))). You know your gut is telling you what happened and you know you are right. What she has done is controlling and spiteful. Sounds just like her father.

I would say you really need to separate yourself from the 2 of them as much as you can to give yourself time to take stock. They are bringing you down.

She needs to pay her own way, or, if her father believes her so much he can give her a car and pay her rent. Surely the money you save from not paying her, you can afford to pay the utilities yourself (sorry if I am misunderstandign the situation)

 

[simplekindofgirl]

Oh ((((Brat17))))- I hope that she does give you proof of the mistake, for the sake of your peace of mind. To intentionally do something like that seems so cruel to me. What a horrible game to play.

I only want to add- when you get the replacement check which I hope arrives promptly (like yesterday)- you can go to the bank and speak with someone, often they will reverse the majority of fees and charges when something has occurred that was an accident as you explained. It was not your fault that she cancelled the check, and they may be willing to work with you on that (saving you a lot of money in pointless fees) when you bring in a new one.

They may also place a hold on the availability of funds from her check as well, being that she already cancelled one to you after it had been deposited. Maybe make a copy of it and then go to her bank and cash it. Take the receipts from the transaction and the photocopy of the check with you to your bank and give them cash (for deposit) and the explanation. Then there will be no hold on the funds, and she will not be able to cancel it again, and the bank will see what happened and possibly reverse some or all of those charges.

I do not have any other advice. I can see how to fix the bank issue, but not your daughter issue. All I can say is that we are all here, hoping and wishing for you. I hope that you are ok. Take care of you, and be kind to yourself.

 

[mamachick]

Thank you both lizio and skogirl-I appreciate your responding so much. Sometines you dont know what a difference you make when someone reaches the low point I have.

My daughter gets loans for grad school and she does pay her own rent and food from that. It the other stuff that she does not have enough money for.

I had an accident years ago and received a settlement. I wasted some of it. I was behind on some things and repairs way over due. I settled for a fraction of what I would have received but was being starved out. I gave her a lot. Every months -car repairs $3000 when her timing belt broke, vacations, clothes, hair and nails, laptop, tv, tires, spending, furniture, etc. For the last year, Ive been telling her I cant afford it, my savings ran out a few months ago. So I have only a small disability to live on.

The thing is, she has been controlling for many years, and if she doesnt get her way, she gets her father on the bandwagon. For 8 yrs, he refused to let me sell this house, which is a physical and financial exhauster. He has undermined all parenting and natural consequences for behavior. I have felt trapped for many years. She is the house watch dog. I cant work because of medical problems. Now he says I can sell but wont make profit because the market is bad. I have given up on dating because I only meet jerks and when I have dated, she performs with drama and telling her dad and making him mad, (still part his house), friends dont like to hear her. Im stuck. I have been up all night wishing I was dead, and I am ashamed, but I cant find any reason to be here.

Im not going to do anything, mostly because Im afraid I would just mess that up too. I just dont want to be in this world. I dont have a purpose. I feel like there is no place for me, but what saddens me the most is that my children have not turned out well in spite of my efforts and love I have for them.

The little voice says nothing will ever be better because I dont deserve love or to be treated right. I only deserve abuse. I dont want anymore abuse. I hate myself for being a victim and for not being strong enough. I hate myself that I have given up my life, that I am weak and broken. I want to go to sleep and never wake up.

 

[mamachick]

Why is it when when someone treats me this way, it seems to trigger all the childhood similiarities. One big fat lie.....

 

[Queen Boudica]

(((((((Brat17))))))). I'm so sorry. I hear you.

Are you in therapy, do you have any friends who support you?

I can relate a lot to what you say as I have just separated from my controlling abusive husband. He has kept me so down. Years of control and gaslighting from him and my mother and sister before that. It leaves you very down.

All I can say is that your daughter sounds like she is controlling you big time and I think you need to get her out of your life, at least for a while. I know that is a hard step.

I was very fearful of leaving my ex H as I have 3 young kids and I have not worked for nearly 12 years. I had become completely reliant on him. And I am still not sure what the future will bring, especially as i have complex trauma and back problems.

BUT now I have left him, I can feel the freedom, I feel freer away from his constant control. It is so suffocating, you just don't know who you are anymore, you become their puppet, you live in fear of their reactions. Yes I can so relate to being broken because that is how I feel weak and broken. But not so broken now, not so weak.

It is a very hard step, but you have to tear yourself away from her control. That will empower you.

You do deserve love and you do deserve to be treated right.

It is just you have been under your daughter and your ex husband's control for so long you don't expect any better for yourself. You do deserve better.

Rip the cancer out of your life. Don't give anything to them. Do everything you can to look after yourself. Think as selfish as possible. It is not selfish it just feels that way because you are so used to serving them.

They will try and keep onto their control they will try everything in the book but just don't give in. She needs to learn how to behave like a decent human being. It is not good for her. You are doing her a favour by standing up for yourself.

If there is anyone who you can get help from a counsellor a friend take it. You sound so down and depressed have you talked to your GP? I feel sure they would be getting you into some form of counselling. I hope there is someone there for you.

I don't know what else to say, except please don't give up. Rise up from the ashes like a phoenix.

 

[simplekindofgirl]

I truly wish that I had any amount of words that might bring you comfort right now. But the truth is, that I am at a loss of what to say.

I do know how you feel. You are trapped in a situation and it seems like your options are very limited. But you do have options.

What you are doing for yourself? You have described how you have helped your daughter, and how she has behaved. You have spoken about your ex and how he plays these games and is enabling your daughter. What are you doing for you?

Do not hate yourself for giving up on your life, hate the circumstances of your life enough to take your life back. This is not your fault. They have choices, and they are making choices that are damaging for you. What options do you have to create a better life for yourself? I do not mean the emotional response, of- I can not do anything. What viable options can you create and think of to improve the situation?

Example, he says now that you can sell the house but you will not make a profit because of the market, which is not likely to improve any time soon. Sell at a loss, rent a cheaper house that you no longer share with anyone but you, where you can bring your friends and your daughter will no be there to give you grief any more. Hard, I know. But the truth is, it is an option. That is just an example. Not a suggestion.
I am just trying to get the wheels turning, the thought process, so that maybe you can see how damaging this is for you, and how you need to start taking care of yourself first. The only way to do that is if you can see options, and then set your goals.

You are so wonderful. You have done so much for your daughter. And I will not discount your efforts for that. I just do not want you to suffer in this way. It is so hard for me to read it. I feel bad, because I do not know how to help you. Other than to say, you are not alone. Please take care of you, and be kind to yourself, because that is what you deserve. Kindness and compassion.

 

[mamachick]

(((((((Brat17))))))). I'm so sorry. I hear you

lizio
BUT now I have left him, I can feel the freedom, I feel freer away from his constant control. It is so suffocating, you just don't know who you are anymore, you become their puppet, you live in fear of their reactions. Yes I can so relate to being broken because that is how I feel weak and broken. But not so broken now, not so weak.


If there is anyone who you can get help from a counsellor a friend take it. You sound so down and depressed have you talked to your GP? I feel sure they would be getting you into some form of counselling. I hope there is someone there for you.

I don't know what else to say, except please don't give up. Rise up from the ashes like a phoenix.

Thats so true, I dont know who I am anymore. I feel so inhuman sometimes, like a empty shell.

How long with no contact did it take before you started feeling like yourself again? I feel like I am in a game of ping pong and I am the ball.

It was your husband though, so I am assuming he was at it daily. This is my daughter and I dont see her daily because she is away. I am so ashamed at failing so badly at parenting. I just want to disappear.


skogir-I think I dont even realize how damaging it has been anymore. I think I am so use to having to tow the line, that I dont laugh, I dont smile, I dont even engage in real conversation. She is even upset if she see's me on this forum. I dont feel like a living thing, I feel more like an object without feeling much of the time. I have found ways of numbing out a lot. I usually have more humor, but question if that is not just a protective factor for me, right now I cant find any humor at all.

Thank you both for caring, I dont know how to accept help so I am sorry if I am not expressing this right. I do have a T but no appt until end of next week.

 

[BloomInWinter]

Awwww, (((((((brat17))))))). I'm so sorry.

Natural consequences would be to tell her 'You have 3 hours to get me the check plus overdraft fees or I'll call the police, report it, and let them sort it out.'

That's what would happen to her with anyone else. ...and it's a far less painful lesson to learn now than to go on in life and get imprisoned because she decides to do this on someone who won't have ANY concerns about keeping her out of prison.

She did a criminal act. Against you. There is no justification for it. Doesn't matter if it was intentional or no. Her behavior is inappropriate and you have every right to stand your ground.

If you call the police on her, she is unlikely to ever do this again. She'll also know...you are NOT someone to be abused in this manner.

Now, doing that to a loved one...well, that is the thing, isn't it? Especially a child? But having watched co-dependents try to 'easier, softer way' far too many in recovery has made me a believer in boundaries. I've watched too many end up dead because they never had to face the lesser reality of their own behavior.

Don't say it unless you can carry it out but...I hope you'll consider doing it. Setting this boundary, here, now.

She WILL respect that, even though she'll hate it. But you aren't responsible for her feelings about HER mess that SHE made. She will need to face this stuff or suffer far worse consequences down the road.

Whatever you choose...be safe. Change your passwords. A person who will do this is not to be trusted until they have worked very hard to earn that trust. Take care of yourself and know you've given her as good a foundation as any Mom could be expected to.

Self-care, now. Gentle talking with yourself. You deserve to be treated with kindness and respect.

 

[Queen Boudica]

How long with no contact did it take before you started feeling like yourself again? I feel like I am in a game of ping pong and I am the ball.

It was your husband though, so I am assuming he was at it daily. This is my daughter and I dont see her daily because she is away. I am so ashamed at failing so badly at parenting. I just want to disappear.

She is even upset if she see's me on this forum.

I do have a T but no appt until end of next week.

I think the mere act of taking back the control, of making the decision that you are not going to accept that behaviour from her, will start the ball rolling.

She is doing it daily, she is in your thoughts, she is terrorising you daily. She does not have to be there. That is how control works, they don't have to be there standing over you anymore, it is in your psyche.

And she can turn up anytime in your house. You don't know when she will be there.

I like SimpleKindofGirl's idea, sell the house, make a break. You don't need a big house anymore, (I'm assuming the other kids have left) that is how your daughter and ex H are controlling you. OR rent the house out and rent a much smaller place. BUT get her out of your environment.

Stick all of her stuff in plastic bags and tell her to come and get it or it goes to charity. OR, better still, sell it so you get back some of the vast amounts of money you have spent on her. Sell the car, sell her TV, electronics, clothes, whatever possessions have any value. And get yourself out of the debt she has got you into.

How dare she get upset at you for being on this forum That is none of her business. She gets upset because it is another form of control. You are reaching out for help and she does not like it. She has no compassion.

Can you get an emergency appt with your T? It sounds like you are at breaking point. Please try. I'm sure he will agree, this has to stop. This pressure on you has to stop.

You are making huge steps by accepting that she is doing this and bringing it out to the open.

Stand firm. Call the police on her as Bloom suggested. But don't go back on it. Stand firm. Your ex H will try to interfere. Don't let him take control. He is the bully that has fuelled all of this. As I said, she can live with him, She is an adult now, she does not need you apart from to bully you. She is perfectly OK on her own. You have done a good job as a mother. She is studying, she is fine. Time to push the cuckoo out of the nest for good before it destroys you. And, I suspect, by doing this you will push out the real controller, your ex H who is still there controlling you via your daughter.

You are in charge of your life. You have the right to date anyone you like, to do whatever you like in YOUR house with them, you have the right to be happy, you have the right to go on your PC and log onto this forum, you deserve this.

She is torturing you. She is a bully and she is abusing your rights as a human, let alone as a mother. How dare she do that to you. I am so angry that a daughter could treat her mother like that. It is not OK.

You can do this. I know it feels like you can't but you have options, they just have made you feel like you don't.

Make a plan of how you can do this, options, call the police, sell her stuff, rent or sell the house. You can do it. And you will feel so much better.

I still have to have contact with my ex H because of my kids and he is around an awful lot, but I know I have taken back control of my life, not all, I am still suffering from years of this, but I will get there and so can you. One step at a time.

 

[BloomInWinter]

When does she see you on this forum?

Why is the way you spend your time any of her business?

Beware...people who would deny others their support systems are controlling and manipulative, hallmarks of abuse. She likely has no self-awareness that any of what she does IS abuse, especially while she is still so enmeshed with the main unsafe abuser in her life.

You deserve to break free and heal. You deserve to develop skills and then reconnect on YOUR terms, with good defenses so the abuse stops. This will teach her some very valuable lessons that she has not gotten yet.

Someday, it is likely she will want to break free from him as well, and you'll be the person she has seen be able to do it. ...and she will have a way out through because you have blazed a recovery trail for her to follow if she wishes.

THAT is truly love in action. Showing our daughters how to take care of ourselves is a gift our parents didn't/couldn't give us.