A Question About Anger And Anxiety

[quaintpapercut]

I know. I'm a work in progress .

 

[The Albatross]

Now I had to look back at the original topic.

Hmmm.

Fears I sort into rational or irrational... justified/healty or based on experiences or irrational/unjustified. But the main problem with fears for me is the anxiety they produce. It is like taking hold of a live wire and feeling the amps or volts without a breaker tripping.

I need to find a way to bring the two closer together.

I can recommend personally, a series of well thought out timed and controlled stress events. That is how I've been approaching this whole thing. I frame up a challenge, I set a time limit. I give my self permission to reassess it after the initial period is met every 15-30 minutes dependent on my stress level. I pull the plug before I hit the panic/freak out/act out/self destruct button.

 

[The Albatross]

I think it has been key though to become acutely aware of my cues... before episodes. Medical people say now that I am "extremely" body aware. I find that to be a necessary thing, because of dis-associative type eppisodes. Just like I needed to learn and then learn how to heed the warnings about fainting... I am learning how to learn and heed the cues about disassociation.

 

[Hashi]

It's a throwback from fight of flight. We get the adrenaline shot to initiate change.

I agree that anger can be from the "fight" response. I don't think the fight response is to initiate change. It's purely an autonomic, animal response to help us survive in the moment. It's literally to fight, wound and - if necessary - kill rather than be killed.

I don't think all anger is this type of anger. If I'm angry because a beautiful heritage building has been knocked down to build a car park, that isn't autonomic fight energy. If I get angry thinking about what someone did 10 years ago, that can be a justified and appropriate emotion but it isn't survival instinct in the face of immediate threat to life.

What people are saying here about doing things with their anger reinforces for me that this isn't what I mean here by anger. Maybe it's not just intensity. I'm wondering if people are talking about different types:

- Anger from fight energy. This could also be rage triggered inappropriately (ie the threat isn't actually there but we respond as if it is), or when fight energy that has been frozen in the body from the time of trauma is suddenly released later. (What happened to me when I was touched in the street and tried to kill the man.)

- Anger as an emotional reaction to people and circumstances. We are reacting emotionally to wrongness, cruelty, injustice, hurt etc but we are not reacting from the autonomic nervous system in order to survive a threat to our lives or physical integrity.

Both give you adrenaline, but they're different and the amount is different. The amount of adrenaline the body gets flooded with to save our lives isn't the same as the amount in other cases.

The anger that people are talking about channelling and using... I think that's emotional (mammalian brain) and not from fight energy (reptilian brain). It's like the difference between the sort of anxiety anyone might have over whether they'll pass an examination, and anxiety in a traumatised person who feels unsafe, up to and including thinking they're going to die. The first type of anxiety can be managed, and channelled to make you work hard and revise. The second one is not so beneficial or easy to deal with.

Fight energy doesn't lead you to improve things. It primes you only for violence and aggression, to hurt or kill. Animals don't fight their way from a predator then immediately start building a better den or whatever with that energy, so the danger won't happen again (although at other times they might improve their den). Afterwards, all they can do with the anger is shake, be active, mock fight or act aggressively. Fight energy is the anger I'm talking about, and this is what I find unbearable.

 

[The Albatross]

I disagree, the most beneficial use of the adrenaline shot is to CHANGE. NOW. If you are angry because a beautiful heritage building has been knocked down and made into a parking lot, then you have more levity perhaps than a rage response and may have no adrenaline response to your body to initiate change. No shot, no threat / initiating change response. One is intellectual, the other is real and a physical body reaction. Those things that occur in day to day living where no body reaction is present isn't really what is being discussed here is it?

I don't have to think about whether it benefits animals. I know it from direct personal experience. It benefits me. If I am angry I can choose to act, to avoid, or to react. I am a rational being. Many in the animal kingdom are not. I am a sentient being. I have a choice.

 

[The Albatross]

Here is more likely what you may be interested in. The only problematic body reaction to anger for me is most often fight or flight.

http://www.angermanagementgroups.com/AngerIsntAlwaysBad.html

And this bit (though the article is worthwhile): " ...the effective identification and use of anger can simultaneously create at least 2 positive outcomes; i) emotional relief for the relationship and ii) emotional relief for the individual.

Before positive personal and interpersonal outcomes can be achieved, however, a person must develop a precisely-timed ability to identify anger in the moment and harness its energy for a positive personal and interpersonal function. By use of a case illustration, we will see how a person uses the powerful force of this particular emotion for good."

(Link: Dead Link Removed )

 

[The Albatross]

I presumed that only adverse anger reactions were being discussed. Not petite peeves.

 

[Pencil]

Not petite peeves.

Alba, you should know that normal peeves turn into rage when PTSD is involved :D

 

[Hashi]

I'm not sure I understand what you mean about the "petite peeves". My anger at what someone did 10 years ago might be far from petite.

I think emotional anger can be huge, have adverse reactions and bring physical reactions including adrenaline which help us initiate change. I'm just saying it's not fight or flight energy - how can it be if you're bringing your intellect into it, rationalising and choosing whether to act or react? Isn't it an oxymoron to say you're making conscious choices to control an autonomic response?

 

[The Albatross]

A heritage building turned car park is a preferential choice/ peeve. Possibly an indignation but not anger... at least not the kind I thought we were speaking about. Of course the subject matter is about as broad as anyone wants to make it to be. I'm off this topic. I've said what I want to say.

 

[The Albatross]

No it isn't an oxymoron. It is a question of the most beneficial and generally satisfying perspectives.

 

[Hashi]

The fight or flight response is a question of the most beneficial and generally satisfying perspectives?

I feel like we must be talking about different things. I've said my point of view, and I'm afraid I can't understand yours but will bow out of this thread now because we could probably do this forever otherwise.