Saedhilian
New Here
***A note before reading this post...I am aware that many, many people may seek to criticize what I am about to say. Please hold your criticisms as I do not want an argument, I only want to say my piece and hopefully get this out of my head as my heart is pounding right now and I am shaking as I type this. My ability to say this is very important to me as I normally keep silent about this, but I feel that saying this may help me and it's a big leap for me to even talk about this. Again, let me reiterate that my intent here is not to criticize anyone or inspire anger but rather to inspire an open and cautious mind, as well as critical thinking. PLEASE be respectful of this, as I would like to be to everyone else, as this is a VERY sensitive thing for me. If you disagree, that is fine and well, you have every right, but I don't really want to hear about it because it would be very triggering for me, so please don't tag me in a post stating why you disagree.This is solely my opinion and experience. I sincerely hope that this is a safe environment for me to say this. Sorry if I'm repeating this over and over, but it is just that important to me to be understood on this point. Thank you in advance.***
I would like to say that anyone who wants to see both sides of the coin about 12 step groups should read the website Orange-Papers. I was in a cultic relationship that focused very much on the 12 steps and was severely manipulated and abused, kept isolated from friends and family, sleep and food deprived, had to endure hours and hours and nights and nights of criticism and confession sessions, for roughly a year. Bill (the cult leader) also had me going to 2-4 meetings a day. He stole at least 14hrs of my life a day on average. I went with him to be supportive while his father was on his deathbed. Watching a man die in that context, to be supportive of someone who is destroying you and making you believe you're the one doing it, is...difficult. It stayed with me. This past Christmas it was all I could think about. Shortly after his father died, a friend of mine died, and he twisted it around. He said it was a warning. He always twisted the deaths of people that I knew. And one day, I called him because he told me to, and he got angry that I called and hung up. I was done then. I just couldn't take it anymore.
I continued to go to 12 step meetings, but then one night I had a panic attack while I was there. So I started going online, got a new sponsor. She was the one who inadvertently helped me realize I had been in a cult. The only thing I had to start with was the word "brainwashing," because I suddenly remembered that Bill had once said he had been in a Christian cult. And then I researched and researched and felt dead and empty and used, but at least I knew what had happened. It was devastating. But something still felt wrong. I started to question AA, and looked at it from the perspective of cult psychology, and my last hope abandoned me. I didn't want it to be true, but saw that it fulfills the qualifications, although all groups do it differently. This was my breaking point, and I was alone. By the time I started calling the suicide hotlines to try and find a reason not to kill myself, I was going so quickly mentally that when I tried to explain to them that I was having an existential crisis, and WHY I felt suicidal, they told me I was calling the wrong number. I couldn't believe it. How is a suicidal person calling the suicide hotline calling the wrong number? I wound up in a psych facility and had to explain cult psychology to the doctor as there are hardly any professionals who deal with it anywhere, and they are expensive. The worst part is that I could never talk about the AA aspect of the cult (so technically I was in two at once, and there was also a third at one time when Bill just stopped talking to me). I have never been able to talk about that part of things, and I am so tired of it. It is critical to the whole series of events, and I can't even talk about it because the chances that I will receive criticism are so high, and that's not what I want. I don't want an argument, I want understanding.
The way I see it, we are in an age where relying on a "higher power" to help us in a medical environment is silly. I can understand in the 1920s, but not now. We have a better understanding of addictions and should be able to provide people with actual medical help rather than a thought reform program. I know I am not the only person who has been hurt by these programs as there are MANY horror stories, but the people that HAVE been hurt by them are unable to speak out because of the backlash that they will receive. I am not saying that ALL groups are like this, but I am saying that this has been my experience, and not even the full of it. These people had to have had an inkling that something bad was going on with me, but they let it happen. There was no one I could report him to within the group, and even the police wouldn't do anything because we lived in different cities (although only 2 miles apart). Even my case managers had to have seen the changes going on with me and did nothing.
I don't mean to detract from the original post, so forgive me if it seems that I have done so. Also, I may be reacting primarily to trauma at the moment more so than the post. Maybe I will make a thread about this in the future or create a journal here and write about it. I suppose this is my test to see if this is a safe environment to discuss this. Thank you for reading and again, please be respectful of the fact that this is a very sensitive thing for me.
~Saedhilian
I would like to say that anyone who wants to see both sides of the coin about 12 step groups should read the website Orange-Papers. I was in a cultic relationship that focused very much on the 12 steps and was severely manipulated and abused, kept isolated from friends and family, sleep and food deprived, had to endure hours and hours and nights and nights of criticism and confession sessions, for roughly a year. Bill (the cult leader) also had me going to 2-4 meetings a day. He stole at least 14hrs of my life a day on average. I went with him to be supportive while his father was on his deathbed. Watching a man die in that context, to be supportive of someone who is destroying you and making you believe you're the one doing it, is...difficult. It stayed with me. This past Christmas it was all I could think about. Shortly after his father died, a friend of mine died, and he twisted it around. He said it was a warning. He always twisted the deaths of people that I knew. And one day, I called him because he told me to, and he got angry that I called and hung up. I was done then. I just couldn't take it anymore.
I continued to go to 12 step meetings, but then one night I had a panic attack while I was there. So I started going online, got a new sponsor. She was the one who inadvertently helped me realize I had been in a cult. The only thing I had to start with was the word "brainwashing," because I suddenly remembered that Bill had once said he had been in a Christian cult. And then I researched and researched and felt dead and empty and used, but at least I knew what had happened. It was devastating. But something still felt wrong. I started to question AA, and looked at it from the perspective of cult psychology, and my last hope abandoned me. I didn't want it to be true, but saw that it fulfills the qualifications, although all groups do it differently. This was my breaking point, and I was alone. By the time I started calling the suicide hotlines to try and find a reason not to kill myself, I was going so quickly mentally that when I tried to explain to them that I was having an existential crisis, and WHY I felt suicidal, they told me I was calling the wrong number. I couldn't believe it. How is a suicidal person calling the suicide hotline calling the wrong number? I wound up in a psych facility and had to explain cult psychology to the doctor as there are hardly any professionals who deal with it anywhere, and they are expensive. The worst part is that I could never talk about the AA aspect of the cult (so technically I was in two at once, and there was also a third at one time when Bill just stopped talking to me). I have never been able to talk about that part of things, and I am so tired of it. It is critical to the whole series of events, and I can't even talk about it because the chances that I will receive criticism are so high, and that's not what I want. I don't want an argument, I want understanding.
The way I see it, we are in an age where relying on a "higher power" to help us in a medical environment is silly. I can understand in the 1920s, but not now. We have a better understanding of addictions and should be able to provide people with actual medical help rather than a thought reform program. I know I am not the only person who has been hurt by these programs as there are MANY horror stories, but the people that HAVE been hurt by them are unable to speak out because of the backlash that they will receive. I am not saying that ALL groups are like this, but I am saying that this has been my experience, and not even the full of it. These people had to have had an inkling that something bad was going on with me, but they let it happen. There was no one I could report him to within the group, and even the police wouldn't do anything because we lived in different cities (although only 2 miles apart). Even my case managers had to have seen the changes going on with me and did nothing.
I don't mean to detract from the original post, so forgive me if it seems that I have done so. Also, I may be reacting primarily to trauma at the moment more so than the post. Maybe I will make a thread about this in the future or create a journal here and write about it. I suppose this is my test to see if this is a safe environment to discuss this. Thank you for reading and again, please be respectful of the fact that this is a very sensitive thing for me.
~Saedhilian
