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Am I A Trigger?

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don't call me don't text me, get out or I call the police kind of thing.
@Aching65 - That sounds like a pretty bright and clear boundary... but you keep talking about reaching out to her in a week, two weeks, sending her info... Has she said it's ok for you to contact her? Are you two talking still? I know you intentions are very good but please keep in mind it could be taken as a boundary invasion to be contacting someone who has said don't contact me or I will call the police... this is especially true for someone with PTSD. People who have been through trauma take their boundaries VERY seriously. If you invade her clear boundary, and contact her before she contacts you, she will take that as a further invasion and you will trigger the heck out of her all over again. When she says no, respect the heck out of it. Trauma happens when no doesn't mean no to people...

I know you mean well, and I can tell you care about her very much. I can see how hard you are working to understand and it is commendable! You deserve big kudos for your willingness to learn and see things another way. MANY people are not as willing or as humble as you are. You made a mistake. If you let her go right now, and give her all the space in the world that you can, and keep working on your stuff in therapy, and wait for her to reach out to you, I think that is your best chance at getting her back. Give her time. The more you can respect what she says she needs, and what she says she doesn't need, the less you will unintentionally trigger her and perhaps be seen as a safe person again.

You sound like a very sweet guy, who made some big mistakes.... and we all make mistakes. Be kind to yourself and keep learning and you will be a great catch!
 
@Justmehere..... It is easy , I just love her. I think I just did not have the right translation tablet to be able to navigate this hurting world.... Thanks for the advise with regards to contacting her. The police thing was the last time I was talking her and trying to explain how hard I was trying and how much she meant to me, and to try to make her understand that I just try to collect all the information I can get to help her.... Us. I now know how futile I was, as I was speaking in the wrong dimension.....
 
I will give her space, deal with myself, continue to educate myself, and maybe in 3-4 weeks, I could try to show her what I have learned.....

Maybe I should direct her to this web site, and give her my handle, so she sees what I have not been able to express with my actions and words?

No, when a person says that they want to be left alone, and says that they don't want you to discuss their issues, they mean they want to be left alone and not have you discuss their issues.

Understanding and/or supporting someone with PTSD really is as simple as listening.

Too often people tend to get caught up in the idea of themselves being a supporter, and equate that position with having to know whats best. And somehow in all of that, the person/the partner becomes an object called PTSD, and their understanding of their own condition, experiences and needs get dismissed as 'just being PTSD talking' rather than the person talking. So if she is asking you not to help, accept that she does know best..
 
OMG. I really F***** up. I think I see it. Thank you so much girls. Now I wonder why the therapist did not arrange for both of us to be seen. It might have been a choice for her to be seen in a safe environment, without me being involved. But I thought it would have been so appropriate to have someone explain all the implications of PTSD. Believe me I have read plenty, but never really understood that part.....

I will give her space, deal with myself, continue to educate myself, and maybe in 3-4 weeks, I could try to show her what I have learned.....

@Aching65
She doesn't want or need to know what you've learned. That's all about YOU.

She needs to feel 100% safe with you, about you and your actions concerning her. You have demonstrated clearly that you are not trustworthy. (FWIW, if my relatively new partner had spoken with a psychiatrist about me, I'd dump him immediately. It's MY information, MY pain. Two powerful third parties talking about things they cannot possibly understand and with only a sketchy outline of the details...then coming up with sketchy remedies...??! Apart from ludicrous and self-interested, it's patronising and a total usurpation of her already compromised power and control over her own life. )

There is no room for mistakes in PTSD.[DOUBLEPOST=1401534035,1401533919][/DOUBLEPOST]
No, when a person says that they want to be left alone, and says that they don't want you to discuss their issues, they mean they want to be left alone and not have you discuss their issues.

Understanding and/or supporting someone with PTSD really is as simple as listening.

Too often people tend to get caught up in the idea of themselves being a supporter, and equate that position with having to know whats best. And somehow in all of that, the person/the partner becomes an object called PTSD, and their understanding of their own condition, experiences and needs get dismissed as 'just being PTSD talking' rather than the person talking. So if she is asking you not to help, accept that she does know best..

OH, YES!
A thousand times
 
Just commenting on some of the other posts here, I think you, yourself, need to judge the situation. You know your girlfriend, we don't. We don't know if she is the kind of person to put her foot down at the first sign of mistake. Is she the type of person who takes mistakes seriously and are very affected when a small mistake is made or is she the type of person to be forgiving whilst still being untrustworthy. Everyone is different and whilst it's good everyone is giving their own opinions on what they'd do if they were her, you need to think about how she is. Is she sensitive to any kind of advice or suggestion, does she need that control? It also depends on her trauma on whether she might need the control in the relationship. For instance, my trauma stems over sexual abuse and physical abuse by two different people, so with me and my boyfriend, we have agreed that I have the control in the bedroom - I can say stop whenever, no matter what the reason - and he has the control throughout the relationship (to a degree) due to my own indecisivness and the fact my mind is a bit messed up at the moment. It's all dependent on her and you which is why I stress you NEED to talk to her. Have a serious talk. Very serious.

You need to judge the situation on her and you. You're BOTH in the relationship, you both need to talk it out. You need to ask her if she needs the control, if she will be able to ever trust you again and if there is anything you can do to earn back that trust and you need to listen to her.

It also goes both ways, you need to put your foot down and tell her your own wishes and boundaries in regards to the relationship.

We can tell you all we like about what we would do in your situation, but ultimately, what you do is up to you. And I think you should talk to her, lay it all out and get it sorted. She is a normal person deep down, she does have common sense and feelings which are much like those of someone without PTSD. PTSD has just added on stresses and emotions and such which makes her react in certain ways, but she can still communicate and think (to a degree) like anyone else. So talk to her. That's all I will suggest now, since we are all individuals and all need different attention.
 
Thanks to all, this is very helpful land clarifies lots of things. I focused on trying to help (I am a md, which is probably why), when I should have focused on listening and just support her, be there....

And I see she has not blocked me from her Facebook page, so maybe she is still considering us... But I have to respect her no contact wishes. I just focus on me and try to recognize all the things I have done wrong.

It is a really strange situation, when all my life I have been trained to show compassion, have been given tools to heal (surgeon), and they are hurtful in this case. It seems that what I have to do is to lie on the sofa, and watch the drama unroll right in front of me, while giving her all the love I can. Is that not being selfish?
 
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I have been trained to show compassion, have been given tools to heal (surgeon), and they are hurtful in this case. It seems that what I have to do is to lie on the sofa, and watch the drama unroll right in front of me, while giving her all the love I can. Is that not being selfish?

Well, sofa surfing, watching dramas unfold and not really participating in the life of your partner isn't really being loving, is it?

On the other hand, actively listening intently with an open heart, putting your self aside, and suffering with (which is the actual definition of compassion; it's often muddled up with the simulacrum of 'compassion' which is actually, forgive my bluntness, akin to transitory sympathy) are the hardest, least selfish things in the universe to do. But these hardest things do constitute real love.

The vast majority of people can't or won't do these things or any combination of them.
Mostly people prefer to satisfy their own needs first - which usually includes behaviours based on what they think they know, what they think you should know and do, what they need you to be, how they think you should 'cope' which is designed to ease their anxiety, their 'rules' for living/problem-solving, the rules they've been taught, the techniques they've been taught, conforming to the dictats and tick-boxes of their institutions and colleagues, what their friends and family pressurise them to think and do etc etc.

Thing is, PTSD invariably turns all that groupthink on its head or wipes it all out. As PTSDers, we find that just about all the 'rules', expectations and conventions are either just not true or they are irrelevant. We find that nice people aren't particularly nice behind all their learned behaviours and rules, even good people lie and cheat, that being a genuinely good person is no protection from harm, that people really don't listen no matter how kind they believe themselves to be, that professionals are often dangerously clueless, that the world you thought you knew so well really isn't like that at all and, thus, you're continually surprised at most people's naivete from which they make daft or ill-informed mistakes which can further injure you, that there really isn't anyone or any body out there to protect any of us from traumatising events and their exponential effects - despite huge, costly health&safety industries, civil and criminal justice systems, social work and therapy industries, etc. etc. Indeed, sometimes these industries actually cause the PTSD.

It's like living or, rather, trying to survive on an alien and terrifying planet. In such an environment, unless you're very fortunate enough to have genuinely compassionate family/friends, you know that you absolutely must protect yourself - flight or fight - when people don't hear you and look like they're going to injure you.

If you physically flee then you're thought of generally as weak (if not a total loony), you've lost your ground, when in fact it often takes great strength and presence of mind to walk away - not to mention grace. If you flee into dissociation because there are no safe, physical places for you, then you're dubbed 'psychotic' or 'mad' and treated accordingly. Verbally fighting people who are unkind or clueless and determined not to change their minds because of course they know best and you've got PTSD so you must be mentally disordered is exhausting and very demoralising so you just stop trying to explain in the end. Physically fighting them often lands people in trouble with the law - and, in this alien landscape where very little is as it appears on the surface, the law isn't fair or just or right as often as we're taught it is. The same could be said of our healthcare services too.

To my mind, so much CBT-type intervention, especially as kwik-fix-delivered in our austerity-driven climate, is not much more than attempts to draw one back to the consensus faux reality (which, clearly doesn't work for so many people who are usually described in undermining terms: 'disabled', 'vulnerable', 'the poor', 'the mentally ill', 'the sick' etc.).

Thank you for reading. None of this is a comment on you or your intentions @Aching65 , rather it's a distillation of my experience generally - some of which I know is shared by other PTSDers. Your friend may be experiencing and feeling something of what I've described too.

You've opened your heart to the forum and I admire that. If you can be so open to us, then it's a good bet you can do so with your friend....
 
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I read in your other thread that you started chatting with her while still married to your wife, and that your divorce is not yet finalized. It might be good to take some time off from dating and learn to be ok alone before you jump back into dating her. You are clearly a helper. Maybe right now working through the loss of your marriage and helping yourself get stronger will help both of you.

It's not about sitting on the cough and watching a someone suffer, but it is very different than being her doctor, her helper, her fixer. You sound like you very much need a very co-dependent kind of relationship pattern and that might be very good to work on in therapy right now.

Helping her and loving her means listening to her saying no, stop, don't contact me and taking her at her word that she does not want a relationship with you. Maybe that will change some day, but not blocking you in Facebook doesn't mean anything. Listen to what she is actually saying and don't read between the lines. I know this is painful. Hang in there.
 
Well thanks to everyone on here. You have all helped me to open my eyes to something that I really did not see.

I will take a few days to write her a mail, apologize for all the hurt I have caused her, showing that despite really trying to help her I was doing it from my selfish point of view which was hurtful to her, and was not really giving her what she needed. I have to respect her wishes of no contact, so I think an email is the least invasive approach. She can read it when she wants, when she feels comfortable.

Or maybe I should just wait for her to reach?????

After a lot of reading and work I am finally able to see from her perspective and now understand I was not giving her support as I was hurting her, constantly exposing her to the trauma, and humiliation from talking to third parties. I never mean bad. I now understand the reasons of her withdrawal, isolation which are her coping mechanisms against all those bad emotions.
 
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She asked for no contact. So you are now trying to figure out the least invasive contact?

You are bordering on criminal harassment if you do not respect that no contact means no contact. None. Nada. Zero. Zilch. No email, no postal mail, no text, no calling, no going over there in person.

The best thing you can do right now is SHOW her you respect that no means no... And wait for her to open the door for contact if she chooses she wants that again.

You didn't listen to her say no to you before about talking to others and you did it anyhow. She now has said no again. If you really understand and you really want to show her you have changed, you will listen to her clear "no contact" now.

She will not hear your explanations if you share them with her now. They won't mean anything right now. All she is likely to "hear" is that she can tell you no and it doesn't mean anything. You will do it anyhow. If you want her to "hear" that her saying stop and no doesn't really mean you will stop and say no, and you want to risk her calling the police as she said she would, by all means, contact her and trigger the hell out of her. I do not think the outcome will be what you want, no matter how good your intentions are.
 
@Justmehere. Thanks.... Jeez you are all right. It is a brand new world..... You mean, if she still has a little bit of feelings for me she might contact me once she feels a bit better?
 
@Justmehere
You make some crucial points.

This listening lack is epidemic as far as I can see. It's the #1 complaint I have - no one really listens, thus they don't take anything you say seriously. They translate and diminish what you say to fit into the very inadequate tick boxes on their forms or they somehow change what you've said in their heads to something that isn't so upsetting for them. Now I can spot the process a mile off - you can almost see the cogs turning, whilst often they think they're being so smart in psychopathologising into 'obviously over-reaction' some very simple, if shocking, material fact you've told them.

By a similar token, most of the time with PTSD your back really is up against the wall, and you just don't have anything left with which to play games or manipulate others to follow fancy lines that they have to read between. It's like you're on your death bed, your life is a daily struggle for survival and what's the point of playing these silly faux reality games anymore?
 
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