Bad Day In My Marriage

[Leah123]

I'm waiting to hear from my therapist, sent her an email about today, am losing hope she'll reply. I could use some support maybe. My husband was in a bad temper this morning. He and my daughter have a difficult relationship, very volatile. She's eight. Sometimes... I think he acts like he's eight too. I was scared today, anxious, hearing them yell at each other. I get triggered by yelling, so even a two or three minute fight takes me a long time to process emotionally. I realized I was so anxious that I was (maybe irrationally) scared to even let him see that I was trying a technique online to calm down.

After their five minute fight was over, he was upset. She was in her room, and he was in another room: cursing, yelling, muttering to himself, storming around. (I will admit, I've yelled and cursed too, so I got into intensive therapy to fix it and am doing much better. I keep trying to get him to find some type of help, make some type of change, but... he doesn't think anything will help. I guess I could try an ultimatum, counseling or divorce, I just do not know what I want to do right now.)

I've been working on our relationship and trying to make their relationship better for years, but... it's not going so well. He says I don't understand him, how much my daughter hurts his feelings. He gets upset, doesn't like the way I parent her. Of course, I have room for improvement, but I try so hard to meet in the middle and support him and understand him and sometimes I feel it's never good enough. I have certainly complicated matters with my reactions, which I've been working on in therapy.

He was my rock... before I had a daughter. Easy to get along with, but... maybe not the greatest ever husband, but... calm, mild, kinda fun, funny, interesting, fairly smart. He was depressed though, I think he has depression, and stuck... he is stuck in the way he feels and what he believes. I don't know that I like him anymore. He doesn't take good enough care of himself, and... well, it's a struggle to be in love with him lately. We've been married 15 years.

Tonight she tried to squeeze out the front door and he was in the doorway: he leaned into her, to keep her from going out, and her cheek got hurt because of it, not enough to leave a mark. I told him tonight he's acting like a bullying brother, not a father. He's hurt her before, trying to control her, nothing to leave marks or scrapes or bruises , but unacceptable. I have had serious talks with him about this, that I'll leave him if he lays hands on her. I did leave him briefly once, because I told him I would. He has a hard time not using his hands to control her: he was raised where spanking was fine, but I do not allow it, or any other type of force.

I'm afraid my emotions are affected by the PTSD too, see... the fear, upset, it's hard to... deescalate, be calm, be objective. But PTSD or not, this just isn't right. I'm anxious in my own home and my husband is not doing great as a father, at least not in some ways. He is very good in other ways, takes care of her, works to support her, encourages her activities, but he's pessimistic and has bad communication skills and can't manage his frustration.

I am so sad tonight. It's been a bad day.

 

[Seasounds]

Glad to see your thread. I'd be upset and frightened too, if I heard and saw my husband be violent with my daughter.
With PTSD, any aggressive behavior is disturbing. Abusive behavior is easy to label; working it out in a family is another thing. Speaking out is a good thing!

In witnessing your husband be abusive to your daughter, you must feel so many feelings. I hope you get some space to sort things out. Can you spend the night at a friend's house? Do you want to report it?

As you can't count on your husband to change, I'd take actions to physically distance your daughter from your husband. She is not safe. Can she go to a friend's house?

You are smart, to be aware that your husband's temper, is dangerous. You and your daughter deserve to be treated respectfully.

Hope you hear from your therapist soon. Hope your daughter considers talking to a therapist. Huggs!

 

[nursenurse]

I am so sorry for all that you are going through. But here's the thing. Your daughter did not sign up for this. I don't know how old she is, and for those who believe in corporal punishment, there is a difference between a swat on the butt compared to what you are describing. Her face got hurt, he has physically punished her in ways that make you uncomfortable. It is time for you to think of her first - is this the legacy you want to leave her, that it is okay to live in fear, that it is okay to be physically abused, it is okay to live in emotional anguish? What you bring her up with is more than likely what she will accept out of life for herself. Is this what you want for her?

Find a women's shelter or an advocate, anyone to help you. You cannot work on this relationship from the confines of your own home should you decide to pursue it, and I would recommend against it. Both you and your daughter are in danger and you need to get out. She does not deserve this, and neither do you. Love of your daughter should conquer all, even if it means losing him. He needs help big time, but you cannot be the one to provide it. Find out your legal rights and remove your child who has no choice in the situation from it. Before it is too late. He seems like an unsprung trap. It is your responsibility to your daughter to protect her. Be the parent. I wish you all the best, it is not easy, but you have a choice as to how you will live. Your daughter does not.

 

[Leah123]

I'm on the fence. He's never seriously hurt her, never hit her, never left a mark, never done anything that qualifies as physical abuse per the laws or common definitions. He basically squeezed against her to keep her from running out the front door, and so her cheek pressed against the door.

I do think of her first, very carefully and methodically. I've given him an ultimatum before, and kept it. He does offer benefits, not just drawbacks.

I'm not afraid to lose him, per se. I'm financially independent and we could certainly manage on our own. It's definitely a question of what is best, now and long term, and of my marriage vows.

It may be that I should go, not a decision to be made lightly, though something I'm seriously considering, but I guess I should have known I'd mostly get opinions and judgements.

 

[radicalgratitude]

She's a child. I don't care what your daughter has said or done. She is a child. Emotional abuse is a form of domestic violence and your daughter is not safe.

 

[Leah123]

I never suggested she had said or done anything to warrant his reaction. I'm also considering the many moments of our family life that are different than the one I described today. I am weighing those too, and many things. I have seen progress with him as well, but not as much or fast as I would like. He has committed to certain things however. He is doing better with her, overall, I guess I could say: it's not fair to overlook the positives: the activities they do together, trips to the library, daddy-daughter day at work, carnivals, trips, the way he keeps her on track with homework, filters her online activities to keep everything age-appropriate, brings her water every night at bedtime, cheers her on at little league, brings her to swim class every week, makes her lunches, all the things they have in common, the way he works so hard to raise her with excellent manners, the time he invests in her.

He supported us for years as well so I could be a stay at home mother.

I am taking this all very seriously, all the good and bad and neutral. It is a lot. I do agree there must be a change. One thing I'm considering is mandatory anger management therapy/class. Another is mandatory family counseling. Another is leaving him.

 

[Abstract]

Hi Leah,

Could you describe in more detail what the anger, fights or other issues look like? In other words what are the type of things that are said and about what? What sets off these situations? How often is there conflict between them? You say he changed after she was born. Do you think he could be a little a self focused. Often people who are are fine when they are getting all the narcissistic fixes they need but as soon as they are not the centre of things they start acting out and the full reality is revealed.

If you had to guess at what is at the centre of his issues with your daughter then what do you think they are? Is it jealousy, challenge to his authority? What? It seems from what you say that he is definitely taking things personally in some way and probably ascribing motives to her that are not age appropriate and more about him than her.

You said he hurt her before? Was that in anger or calmly as a punishment and what happened?

This is obviously a worrying situation but more detail will help us see how much PTSD is involved here and how problematic it is. For me any anger at all feels wrong and frightening and I have to remind myself that some expressions of it are human. If I am not careful I would demand zero expressions of anger or frustration from those around me and that isn't healthy either. It sounds like this is way over that place but detail will help clarify.

I know you have a habit of looking for the positive in things. That is a wonderful quality. For me though it has caused trouble in the past as it stops me focusing on the negative and dealing with it. That may not apply to you. Really the positive can be totally irrelevant if the negative is negative enough.

Very sorry to hear you are in this situation. I know how passionate you are about bringing your daughter up safely.

 

[crazy8]

Could you offer him an ultimatum that he must start therapy to deal with his anger problems?

 

[intothelight]

Leah,

I am taking this all very seriously, all the good and bad and neutral. It is a lot. I do agree there must be a change.

I am glad to read this as it is best to get a full picture. Counseling for the two of you might be a good place to start as having a third party present can keep things focused, and as parents, the two of you need to work out your roles and what you find acceptable and unacceptable in regard to parenting.

It is one thing for a child to have an emotional outburst, but entirely another for a parent to do it on a regular basis. Discipline is to teach a child appropriate behavior and not to intimidate or frighten them. In that state, nothing is learned. If anything, see if some ground rules can be set where your daughter is sent to her room and your husband to another part of the house until he can regain emotional control. Children are great at pushing buttons, but as adults we have to choose not to let those buttons be pushed.

I hope that you and your family can find resolution.

 

[Leah123]

Thank you for the measured reply. I had a deathly serious talk with my husband this morning. After a long, difficult night of thought and upset, I gave him an ultimatum. He has until Friday to research and choose a therapeutic option to manage his anger and parenting issues. It can be individual counseling, family/parent counseling, support groups, workbooks w/support: it needs to be something he's going to commit to seriously and to which he will devote significant weekly time. His alternative is to leave. He has agreed to find a counseling resource.

I had to work through my own issues to be able to sort through where I was going wrong, where he was going wrong, and what was going wrong as a family. When I got my diagnosis, things like my outbursts made more sense, and I've made good progress on them, but am never happy with myself as a parent even though objectively there are many things I do right for her consistently. He and I have room for improvement. Now, it's his turn to do the hard work required and I must have faith that he will. If he does not, I shall leave him, plain and simple. Still, it's been more than 15 years with him, many very good, and even the bad moments and trends are mixed in with good ones, so, I hope that even though I had to push him to it, he will take the commitment seriously.

I appreciate everyone's feedback, the stuff I liked hearing and the stuff I did not. You are all looking out for my daughter's welfare first, and that's exactly the right thing to do.

 

[Leah123]

Abstract, sorry not to reply at length, am a bit stressed at the moment, but I just wanted to briefly thank you for your post: I read it and every line was as if you knew him. You gave me so much food for thought: I just have to have a little time to process everything you know... to settle a bit, so sorry not to say more but thank you so much.

 

[blackemerald1]

Children are great at pushing buttons, but as adults we have to choose not to let those buttons be pushed.

I am very concerned that your lifestyle is blotted with outbursts from your daughter and husband. However, intothelight hit the nail on the head. Your daughter is only 8 and that can be a difficult phase. As I recall with my children, they are constantly changing and challenging authority (see parents) to see how far the boundaries are or if there are indeed any boundaries. Sounds like your daughter gets a great deal of attention from her father and he must enjoy the role he plays in her life otherwise he would be headed for the hills every time your daughter needed some thing.

I am not advocating any type of violence, mental, emotional abuse here, I am just saying this sounds like a solution can be found.

Your PTSD is a separate issue even though your husbands anger outbursts and your daughters behaviour triggers you.

Right now I agree with Abstract, if you feel like it, please let us know how far these fights between father and daughter are going.
It's not easy for you to try and arbitrate between too very close relationships, being your's with husband and husband's with daughter.

Do they know how upset you get when they start fighting, maybe its time to take up the issue with them for a moment and set them straight, both of them together about the lack of respect they show each other and you.

As for ultimatums, I haven't seen too many of those work out well. They can lead to resentment and also force you into a corner that you thought you would not need to back into ie having to carry out the consequence.

I know I will get howled down here but I have never met a family where there has not been disagreements, discipline issues, boundary testing, sometimes yelling and slamming doors and pouting angry kids and frustrated parents. If you answer yes to any of these, I think that yes you need to get family counselling for a few sessions. Let your husband and daughter know exactly why this is necessary.

Anger management or a parenting course for your husband and you may be another very beneficial thing to contemplate too. The help is out there and before you make decisions like leaving your husband again or divorce or any other major life decision I would be trying to look at alternatives first and you could do with some support from maybe a mental health facility in terms of counselling.

Your PTSD is IMHO forcing your hand a bit. No one likes conflicts and that combined with the fragile situation at home is trending you towards an end to a relationship between you all that if addressed could grow to be much better and loving. Remember your daughter and husband will miss each other and will most likely want visitation because deep down in that relationship that they have is a dad who loves his daughter and vice versa but have possibly lost the rule book about concepts such as respect, listening, discipline, caring and kindness and they need a refresher course. To save them, to save you.