Chauvenistic / Mysogenistic Comments

[Kintsugi]

I'm trying to come to terms with why it is I struggle so much when I hear any kind of womanizing remark. Sure, there's society to blame or whatever, but I also blamed modern culture on my hypervigilance until I realized children under the age of ten don't usually know upon entering a room exactly what potential weapons were available, and I'm thinking there's a similar story here.

I've gone through a lot of phases of understanding with this issue in the past couple of weeks. First I wrote this for PTSD relationships and deleted it, then wrote a new one with the same thing and a new angle in Depression and Suicidal Ideation, and now I am posting it here. The reason is because at first I thought it was a matter of failing to socialize appropriately or maybe it wasn't, then I thought because these comments often make me depressed and feel self-destructive it should be in the second category, but I think I finally understand a little.

These comments are a trigger, and only just now do I realize this. Just a trigger for incredible and extreme panic, making me feel all of these other overwhelming feelings as I allow myself to escalate.

So here is the full story:

I have a friend who lives downstairs from me in my complex. He is great company, except he always makes remarks that are sexual or suggestive... basically every disgusting thought a woman may try to push away from to prevent feeling degraded by imagery or media (at least in my experience/understanding).

Anyway, it's been bothering me every single day (he spends a huge amount of time in my apartment) for about four months, and I'm finally at breaking point.

Just now he said something that was only lightly suggestive and I just decided I had to get up and leave, go to my room and lie down with a book. I wound up just trying some simple breathing exercises to ground myself, but suddenly I realized: I was in full panic mode. My heart was pounding, I felt sick and flushed, shaky, racing thoughts, the works. I tried to relax as much as possible, vaguely wondering why I had never paid attention to this reaction before (in retrospect I would definitely just sit in the situation usually and my anxiety and thoughts would escalate until I got to suicidal or self-mutilating thoughts, feelings of worthlessness, and then I would go quietly break down in my room).

In this quiet moment, all of a sudden it clicked. His language triggers me because throughout my entire childhood and early teenage years, my brother would always make the most inappropriate comment possible while in my company and watching something. I remember the very last one so clearly. I was working on a paper and he was watching TV behind me. There was a commercial on for a Big Brother program. "Become a big brother, make a difference in a child's life." And my brother: "You know what happens to those boys?" and he's twisting and leaning over the back of the couch to speak to me face-to-face. I reluctantly turn to meet his eyes. "They get molested by their big brothers."

I can't handle it. I can't. But now I am conflicted... do I avoid this or try to deal with it head-on? Should any woman consciously put up with these remarks just to work on a trigger, anyway, or am I truly being ridiculous in my discomfort with these things? I know that I overreact, but maybe it's not a bad policy to rid my house of this linguistic plague?

Opinions much appreciated.

 

[The Albatross]

I'm a head on sort of person. Avoidance for me just makes it worse. And I'm finally at a point where I can take the best action for me and stop freaking out about what the other person will think. I take the action necessary for my sense of saftey and try to be courteous... and then how they respond or act is on them.

 

[Heather]

I don't think you're over-reacting at all. The way you feel is the way you feel. Your body is telling you THIS IS NOT OKAY! How can you ignore that?

Besides this is your house right? Why are you going into YOUR room in YOUR house when this asshole is making you uncomfortable? Kick his ass out. It makes no sense to me why you allow him to stay. This is a great time for you to be ASSERTIVE. HE NEEDS TO GO NOW!

Good luck. Hugs. Heather

 

[OKRADLAK]

I had a friend like that. I finally told him after one really disgusting comment how adolescent and inappropriate it was.

But he cannot stop. I realized that something usually triggers this in someone. It is deep and lasting and they cannot stop.

Now I either do not go around him or I simply do not respond in any way to the comments.

 

[Kintsugi]

Thank you SO MUCH for your comments. My fiance apparently told him that there was a road in my past he didn't want to go down or make harder, so he should probably stop. But that was before his actions that finally prompted the anxiety/panic attack post here, so... I'm not really sure that is enough. He's a good guy but I think he shafts me on purpose on repaying our generosity to him (even though I support my fiance and I alone) because he thinks I'm some kind of domineering hell-b*tch just because I leave when he talks about how FINALLY X Y or Z lead role takes off her clothes. *shudder*

I feel like I do need to address this. He's a psyche major and at the very least should understand that PTSD is no fun and if he's not helping that's even worse. For instance, he introduced a movie to us as, "About war, PTSD, general insanity. It's f*cking crazy," so I should at least expect a base understanding of gravity from him. I really value him as a friend and at the same time constantly catch myself wondering, "If I were really f*cked up and B weren't here... Would he try something?" and often my self-response is disturbing. Maybe this adds to it, maybe fabricated from my imagination but adds to it, maybe it doesn't.

The point is is that maybe if I hit this issue head-on enough, he will be overwhelmed by me and just drop it entirely.

I can only say that the good thing coming out of this is that he referenced a close friend of mine who, he says, makes nasty, nasty comments on women. Crying, I asked B what he had said about me before, because he had sworn he was in love with me for over a year and a half. B said, "The nastiest thing he's said about you was that he would try to kick my a*s if I ever said what I said to you during [that fight] ever again."

So, that was soothing to hear. At least this friend of mine respected me enough to never smudge my name. He met me while the last close male friend I rejected went around calling me a whore and a she-devil. I would have been heartbroken to hear otherwise.

Furthermore, B said that this friend had NEVER said anything nasty about girls to him, and he didn't understand what this other friend was referencing. I really just think it's this disgusting guy instigating these horribly degrading situations, not those around him whom he thinks are also having a good time.

Sorry if this is convoluted; I'm really tired. Thanks again. Nice new avatar, Heather.

 

[mysihba]

I know it's not easy but you simply set knew boundaries now. I don't know what your trauma was or triggers but it really doesn't matter. Don't walk away and suffer...tell em to get out and stay out if they have no respect for you (or others)

 

[Srain]

I'm think it's always best for me to address things with people myself so that there is no misunderstanding. I like to make sure I'm as calm as I can be and as clear as possible. It sounds like you have known him quite awhile but he cannot read your mind and that's a mistake I often make thinking that people should be able to, which is why boundaries are very important. It's more difficult once a behavior has been going on for awhile and I can appreciate your position of hesitation at this point. However, this is causing you extreme stress and it is happening in your own home.

You finance has now spoken with him and it seems like a great time to follow up. Be a good friend and let him know you are still friends while letting him in on how this makes you feel when this behavior arises. If he is your friend then he will want what is best for you. I would go from the stand point that he was unaware that he was hurting you in this way. Let him know that if this behavior continues then you will have to ask him to leave because you just can't allow it in your home, that you are sure he understands why now.

This is my opinion only. Good luck, I hope it goes well for you.

Rain

 

[njray]

Miss anti sunshine

First I am proud of you that you are able to recognize the inappropriate behavior of the neighbor friend. My suggestion is to set up boundaries. If you do not want to be around persons that make sexist (in this case i think it goes beyond sexist but anyway) comments that is great. I would suggest discussing that with your BF And tell him why that is (I suspect he knows the deep reason). But I would definitely discuss it again with him so there is no misunderstanding as you are partners and both of you need to be aware of the rules you are creating... I think it is a good rule BTW... BUT not everything is black and white that is the hard thing.... what is appropriate and what is not is a big question here......

For some making a comment like OH Kardashian is "hot" after seeing her in a sketchers commercial might be acceptable to you to others it is not. If the same person said Kardashian is hot and i would like to (blah blah blah descriptive sexual content blah blah blah) her after seeing her in the same commercial that would probably upset more people. But really which is worse. I am not sure to be honest....... Well to be honest I do know that millions of those sneakers are being sold to adult females because they want to feel hot or look like kardashian. Again we have starving people all over the world and we are spending how much for sneakers? That are gonna make me look like who? Unfortunately our society is sending us many mixed signals and quite often it is because of money, wealth and POWER. Not morality! Again, whatever morality is today? Have you seen the wealth and power of churches lately. Morality what really is the church and criminal justice system doing about immoral priests and nuns.......... Hmmmm scary and these are the places we are supposed to learn and respect morality?

So NO I would not say what was said to you about big brothers was healthy and because of your trauma that was pressed upon you by someone that made these comments and if i get the jist of it had made many sexist chauvinistic and f-ing stupid pig headed remarks setting up bounderies is awesome. And yes I really think (which is tuff for me sometimes) that there is a legitimate reason why when someone makes a chauvinistic or sexist remark it triggers you but I just hope we all follow what we preach though and not selectively create rules for self served needs but for the betterment of all.



Okay miss Anti may I challenge you to help me? Can you keep me informed how you are going to handle this and what can I do as a male and human do to be more sensative or should I say respectful when it comes to issues I described or is there really no issue at all with the Kardashian empires being. I think I know ur opinion on jersey shore girls but then again look at their following....

Now my disclaimer- I am a male.... I admit that I am not perfect....I am not happy that we have set standards well that are confusing. Now I have never done anything like that to those that have been traumatized by very sick people but again I have not be an angel that should be put upon a mountain. I think there are a lot of outwardly attractive woman(I really know nothing more about kardashian than snip its in ads about them) kardashian is not one (Just my opinion). But millions of guys and girls do think she is. Or is it they associate her beauty with how she has gained wealth and power?

 

[KP the nut]

I don't think you are over reacting.

As most have said above, you need to set boundaries and spell it out in clear short sentences that his comments/behaviour is not acceptable. let him know how much it upsets you and that if he persists he will not be welcome in your home. Your home, the place you need to feel safe.

If indeed he is a friend he will take note, if not, ask yourself if you need this trigger in your life.

Not an easy conversation I know, but one I believe you need to have.
Linking arms and sending strength
KP

 

[freakofnurture]

Nope, totally not overreacting. With your background, I find it admirable that you manage to still see his positive qualities and treat him as a friend. Although with him being a psych in the making and having been informed about your history, I'd say he doesn't care that much about you. Hm... are you sure he even really notices what he's doing?

My approach to guys pestering me with suggestive remarks might not be doable for you; however, I have found that when a guy doesn't get the desired response from a woman but is himself put in the position that he intended to maneuver the woman into, he will never ever try that bs again:

If he gets suggestive on me, I go mind molester on him. Like, when he says: "Actress X finally got naked!" I put on an insanely horny face and a breathless voice and then ask him in great detail if he got an erection, if he wanted to have intercourse with the actress, what kind of intercourse, if he masturbated, if it felt good etc. while staring at him. I try to get as graphic and vulgar as possible until I see some kind of fear; then I stop and just smile a condescendingly dirty smile at him.

If that doesn't shock him, he's really sick. Then you should throw him out and avoid him in the future.

It works with non-sexual reactions, too, though not as universally: I had this collegue who liked to say a nasty synonym for 'vagina'; he said it all the time, sang it, whispered it to people. Then he stood in front of me, grinning, saying his word... and I just belched without batting an eyelash. He looked shocked, like a wounded deer. It was kind of heartbreaking, actually. But from then on he shut up when I was around.

 

[OKRADLAK]

He is a PSYCH major?? I am about to pass out. Here is my fantasy regarding him...

I wish we could all get him together in a room. Well, at least 20 of us. He does not know we all have PTSD. You say we are having a party! He comes over with his dumb movies and makes a comment. We ALL stop talking. Look dead at him.

He is thinking, " What the ^$&#?" And says, "What? Are you all F-crazy? HAHA!" But we do not laugh.

He tries to leave. You will not let him, being NICE of course! You tell him we will not hurt him, we want to teach him what it is really like to have PTSD. He decides to stay because he is embarassed. We are there ALL NIGHT, each of us telling him our sordid stories in great detail.

He can hardly take it. He pukes twice and tears are streaming down his face all night because he never felt the emotions attached to psychological problems. He hears of women being abused and of childhood abuse and war trauma and trauma he never knew existed.

As the sun comes up, he is changed. He cannot talk. All he can do is try to offer a sheepish hug to each of us. We are nice to him, of course, but he is now different and will never ever ever ever look at mental health issues without remember that night.He staggers out and tells you he is very sorry for being such a jerk.

Otherwise he is going to be such a prick of a psychologist that I cannot even bear to think about it.

 

[OKRADLAK]

If he gets suggestive on me, I go mind molester on him.

Freak, I like the way you think! The way you describe this........it would shut up anyone who was not thoroughly twisted.......weed out the chaff.......Man, to be able to do this without totally wetting myself!!"