General "civilians"

[Mr Man]

Having worked with ex forces, having forces in my family, having read this thread... using the term civilian is without question, derisive. Just as talking about “non Muslims” or Yanks or Poms is derisive. It puts people in gangs, it sets people against each other, it suggests we’re on different teams. It certainly doesn't foster integration and harmony – it’s as if you’re still up for a fight. So b*ll*cks to the excuses for using it, there is no excuse. You want to harbour and grow prejudice – then keep on calling your neighbours civilians. But don't dress it up as something else. Be man enough to admit what you're doing.

 

[holdenmonty]

@Lemontree going back to the original post. Context does mean a little bit of something but if you don't appreciate him using it then I would say it's safe to politely ask him to stop saying it. I think calling the average non military person a civilian in a jokingly negative connotation is kind of along the lines of how other branches of the military at least here in the U.S. bash eachother such as we tend to call Marines jar heads because we like to think that their head is an empty jar with nothing in it, and I have heard the Army called ground pounders because they are known for having infantry who ends up doing a lot of marching, and I have heard the Air Force called the chair force because pilots sit in their cock pits and there is a lot of jobs that we do sitting in chairs. If I see somebody walking in a door that is suppose to be an exit only door I think to myself silly civilian but at the same time I have seen military do the same stuff as I would say silly civilian to so in all actuality it's not very polite to call somebody a civilian but if you use it in a negative connotation I usually say something like silly or stupid before civilian like I would say damn jar heads if I was frustrated with a marine for some reason.

 

[Lem]

@RussH and @J.L. Pitts

They seem to understand it but mine definetly if a man has never served then he automatically has less of my partners respect.

 

[holdenmonty]

I must admit I tend to be the same way but it feels like it's reasonable at least in my brain. But when you serve in the military and especially when you are deployed you get use to being able to trust the individual next to you that they will have your back when stuff hits the fan (bad things happen) and it's kind of an not verbal agreement when your in the military and it seems like in the "civilian world" everybody is out for only theirselves and instead of helping somebody out when stuff hits the fan they would record it/take pictures with their cell phone and post it all over social media. But in my personal opinion if you are the spouse of somebody that has served/are serving in the military then you are the average "civilian" you understand the concept of having eachothers back to an extent.

I almost forgot to mention that I have noticed though of people that have gone through stuff hitting the fan such as quite a few people that have PTSD and especially a lot of people on this forum understand the concept of helping others when stuff hits the fan because they have been through it and realize how much helping others truely impacts both them and the individual that they are helping out.

 

[Sighs]

@Lem - my partner definitely has less respect for "a bloke who never put his hand out for a rifle".

As the daughter of a combat vet who was conscripted and the partner of a combat vet who was a career soldier by choice, I do believe that they have seen and done things most civilians cannot imagine. If they behave as if they have lived on another level - well, frankly they have!

Eg: Civilian says they want to stop working on task because they are hungry. My vet is literally amazed. "But you ate a few hours ago?!" He once spent 9 days in country (ie: outside the wire - in the combat zone) with no rations as the weather meant the airdrop of supplies couldn't happen. On day 3 he came across a dead bird and thought "I'm hungry, but I'm not hungry enough to eat that." On day 8 he went back and found the bird carcass and ate it. Can you see why he has no sympathy for a civilian who complains they are hungry?

If you think vets are just ordinary men and women who happen to have been to war then you are missing the point completely.

PS - I'm not suggesting that no civilian has ever been starving and picking through bins for food etc, but we live in a very wealthy country with good social security and very few civilians in our society would know real hunger. And that is only one example of what my vet has been through.

 

[holdenmonty]

I'm with you there @Sighs I think also staring death in the face everyday for an extended period of time has some impact. Luckily I never went days without food but the chance of death was a daily thing. As morbid add it sounds I created my own memorial of sorts with my weapon, my boots, my helmet and dog tags it was kind of my way of looking death in the face and saying I'm not scared. I know my life is in good hands anyway but it made things go from nice ideas to true reality

 

[Deleted member 28812]

@holdenmonty: you don't have to answer this but do you think that sort of feeling you had back then contributed to your OCD like obsession? You said you feel like you need to sort the plates and the bowls and do you think this feeling of danger contributed to that?

 

[Deleted member 28812]

@Sighs: That's a very shocking story :(

 

[holdenmonty]

@Lemontree It is a good question and it may sound weird but I'm just as interested in the answer as you are. I think my OCD like obsessions probaby contributes to the uncontrolability of just about everything with not knowing if you were going to be alive tomorrow or not or where the next rocket would land. So I think with there being such a lack of control my brain feels like it needs to over compensate and needs lots of control.

 

[Sighs]

@Lemontree - sadly its not even close to the most shocking.

 

[Deleted member 28812]

That's sad :(