Do all your mental health conditions stem from trauma?

[PamelaS]

I have a very hard time with the term "mental illness." In the West, we create pathology out of everything, and medical research is truly in its infancy. But no, some issues that are under that umbrella happen as a result of physiological differences in the brain, drugs that trigger those differences, genetics, and likely a whole lot of other stuff that is not trauma.

Thank you, whiteraven for shedding some light on that for me.

arfity arf arf, arfin arf.

psychology is an infant science, and still inventing itself. rapid cycling name changes to be expected. was "manic depression" a misdiagnosis when the name changed to, "bipolar?" for sure medical doctors were relieved when they no longer had to compete with the likes of winston churchill and stephen spielberg for their acronym. personally, i was kinda relieved for the name change from "civilian shell shock" to "post-traumatic stress disorder," though the acronym, "css" might be cooler than, "ptsd." was i mistreated over the course of being a lab rat for all that scientific development (1972 to present)? i was caught between a proverbial rock and hard place. i thank the unsung heroes who stood with me, taking their best guesses with the information and training which was available. healing happened and they helped the best they could. thank you.

i don't know that i care to have an opinion on the root causes of mental illness. i don't believe that information is currently available. research in progress.

just woofin. . . arfity arf arf arfin arf. thank you for the woof-ortunity, pamela.

Thank you for your humor. Arfi arf arf! It is so valuable. I wish I had such a gift. I’ve always been so serious and sometimes too intense. I appreciate others’ humor, but I struggled to construct it myself. Thanks for lightning my day.

Well, I'll agree to disagree on that point. But even if you talk to doctors and researchers, and read medical/scientific works, you'll see that even the folks who are knee-deep in the research agree that we only know a very small fraction of what there is to know about the human body/brain, and even less about the mind.

And this is exactly why I struggle to agree with the theory of evolution. I have been trained in math and science. Math is an exact science that scientists used to quantify their data. But science is guesswork that scientists try to provide data to support. Sometimes those scientists skew the data to support what they believe to be true, whether intentionally or subconsciously, they only see their side of the story sometimes, and therefore only give creedence to the data that supports their beliefs. Perhaps that’s harsh, but I believe that some “truths” are really not true, they are just supported by a lot of data that can be manipulated to support their position. I believe evolution is one example. And this very thing that you have mentioned provides evidence to the contrary.
My doctors told me after 20 years of treatment, that there was nothing more they could do for me. My son has been suicidal nearly his entire life (going on 24 years) had finally agreed with me that he would not harm himself while I was alive. That provided me with the motivation to work my tail off to learn as much as possible about our bodies and what I could do myself to treat myself. I refused to be part of his excuse for suicide.
I learned an awful lot about our bodies, and that when we give them what they need in order to function properly the way they were designed, and protect them from the things that harm them, they do the job themselves of healing themselves. That’s the way they were designed. And I cannot possibly believe that even that one specific example can be explained away through evolution. It’s simply too complex to imagine everything that our bodies do automatically just to keep us alive. In mathematics, it takes a lot to prove that a property in math is true always. You don’t have to just come up with examples. You have to dive deep and explain how every single step comes together to justify that conclusion. And it only takes one example that does not support it to make it false.
Sorry for that deep dive. But no one can ever convince me that everything that our body can do with all the intricate microscopic pieces that are placed together perfectly in order for our bodies to function properly can be explained away as simply modification on something that was less developed. There is no robot that could ever be created to replace the human body. And the fact that we actually have some control over it by providing what it needs to function was the most freeing and promising thing that I have ever learned. After the doctors gave up on me, the changes I made in my diet and lifestyle, based on everything that I had learned, improved my body’s ability to function. And to know that the same is true about our minds should give us the greatest hope of our future being better.

Thank you all for your input in this thread. It has been very helpful and I am appreciating getting to know you all more. Sorry if I am too nerdy. But we all have our own individual and unique ways about us. I will respect yours, and I ask you to respect mine as we choose to agree to disagree, agreeably and make the world a better place together.

I had a great neurologist for my neuro condition. He was from India and he was just a great guy to chat with. One time I asked him if he could name a time at which looking back 40 years and not think that the treatment of people with neurological or mental health conditions was barbaric. He couldn’t identify such a time so I followed up with asking if there was any reason to think the current time wasn’t the same. He said there was no reason to think the current time was any different. We went on about all the advances in medicine but concluded that if you know 1% about something and you double your knowledge you still only know 2% of what is really going on. I think that is where we are at. I am really grateful for all the advances made but we are really just scratching the surface. Understanding this is just part of the wonder and adventure of life. I am really lucky to live in a town where the neurodiverse are welcome. It is really cool, there is an acceptance of how varied the experience of living a human life can be. Everyone is treated like the full human being that they are. Nobody wastes time talking about diversity or inclusion, everyone just lives it.

What a beautiful place to live! I hope and pray that the whole world becomes more like your home. Thanks for sharing.

i think a lot of mental illnesses are, or often are traumagenic. some it’s on paper and others there’s just a strong pattern. trauma (wether violent, sexual, neglect based, a mix, something else) is what has a lot of power to make us/the brain start trying to cope in maladaptive ways. we’re not meant to experience such hardship so there’s only so much you can compensate healthily, especially as a child.
i developed severe OCD following being retraumatised.
a friend of mine with BPD has discovered a strong correlation between her disorder and parental neglect in childhood, as she’s been diagnosed and entered therapy.

of course there are also modifiers to this, pretty sure we know that there is genetic basis to being predisposed to certain mental illnesses. like some people are innately more vulnerable to alcohol addiction/dependency. so when things get hard it’s more likely to tip in that direction/thought pattern than other coping mechanisms.


i think a lot of it is a mix of nature and nurture? some people are born with underlying weaknesses (ie spinal problems) and certain strain can make them finally show up and be an issue, quicker than for another person. both can still develop the herniated disc but one much easier than the other.

traumatic environment lends itself to not being able to manage things like anxiety early in life, so what could’ve been a predisposition that’s developed management/control over in a healthy environment, and isn’t much of an issue in adulthood (and more of a natural human variation), becomes a much more debilitating problem (clinical anxiety disorders?) because of xyz trauma reinforcing it and xyz circumstances not being safe/stable enough to develop and learn/be taught those skills.

stuff runs in families too, wether it’s inherited or learnt/taught or combinations of both…

it's a really interesting topic.
obviously the brain and parts that regulate hormones are physical things so i’m sure genetic or otherwise developed changes in those can affect mood a lot, like TBIs can. but i am really curious what the numbers are in clinically recognised depression, what’s environmental/traumagenic and what’s genetic/developmental? internal and external causes. i don’t think we have surefire ways to measure that but hypothetically i’m super curious.

that’s my thoughts on it, anyway.
there’s a bunch of factors, trauma can definitely be one of or the one for sure, depending on what it is. but sometimes it probably isn’t?

mental illness is a sliding scale, too, we’re not either with x or without it, mental illnesses are natural human thoughts/behaviours at a harmful/debilitating/distressing degree. lots of people get traumatised but don’t “have” PTSD. you can also be dxed with something and potentially not meet criteria anymore in a few years. (and it may or may not still be a significant risk to fall back into (like EDs)) obviously it doesn't apply to everything, especially in traumagenic disorders (like PTSD, DID). but it’s not really the haves and have-nots, more so the “typical/below threshold” and “above threshold” behaviours.

i think i was dxed with anxiety and depression as a child, i would say that those things are very dependent on how i’m doing trauma wise and don’t merit their own thing (anymore?). i don’t think the depression is its own issue that persists independently of that for me, unlike potentially my mother who medicates to function normally. and depending on which parts of my system are around, i’d put the anxiety in general life as a footnote nowadays. i still can get very anxious but it’s very trauma related and interferes with my life very differently than it did when everything was debilitatingly anxiety inducing as a preteen/teen. i think it has much more plasticity and going to therapy to target specifically anxiety and do some CBT would (and has been) pretty useless to me. it definitely helped but not in the heavily trauma-backed territory. But some people i know would extremely benefit from that, because the anxiety is the main issue, not something lurking deep underneath. and they struggle much more than i do with it.

that’s the problem at the moment i think, not understanding the gradient aspect of it. it’s all seen as black and white so pretty much anyone is seen as having a clinically bad problem when it’s not actually like that. often seen in people armchair diagnosing strangers etc. especially online, anyone who is a jerk and/or not well liked is pinned a personality disorder.

Thank you dark.green.feathers for your enlightening and extensive explanation. I’m still processing it, and may need to read it over a few times before I can comprehend it all. This brings back very pleasant memories from my college days of being able to converse very deeply to examine topics that we may or may not agree with. Thanks for the walk back in time that brought me to a pleasant memory instead of the opposite. Have a very pleasant day and weekend.

 

[arfie]

It is so valuable. I wish I had such a gift. I’ve always been so serious and sometimes too intense.

valuable it is. a gift from above it ain't. in the early years of recovery, the stick up my ass had a stick up its ass. learning how to take myself less seriously has been remains a test for me. my most trusted indicator that healing has happened is when i can find the gentle, compassionate humor in my plight. emphasis on gentle compassion.

 

[Susan Jane]

Hi Pamela, I think to diagnose is a best guess most of the time. It isn’t just with mental struggles, but with all illness. I used to want a diagnose and treatment, but it isn’t a straightforward thing. My understanding of PTSD and its effect on my life wasn’t clear when I was diagnosed with it. In fact it was written down on paper but not discussed for 20 years for me. Depression and anxiety were the 2 things above the PTSD, and no matter how I treated it, I have had heavy episodes that leave me paralyzed for many years. I am experiencing it right now. It was an advisor on a mental health service from my employer who explained my struggles to me. It took me another 2 years to believe him. Trauma for me is at the core of the other 2, it sets it off into a vicious cycle. So for me the answer is yes… and knowing that helps me deal better, but it doesn’t make it leave. I sure wish it would. . Susan Jane..

 

[Friday]

It seems that many of us have been diagnosed and re-diagnosed and misdiagnosed and been accordingly mistreated for all of our ailments. I recently saw a post by arfie describing just this. I have often thought and would like to know your thoughts on whether most, if not all mental illness stems from trauma. Thanks for enlightening me with your input from your experience. Looking forward to hearing your thoughts.

Trauma can create, or exacerbate, a whole helluva lotta conditions… but, no. Not of we’re defining “mental health condition” as anything NOT neurotypical. Autism. ADHD. Dyslexia. Dysgraphia. Giftedness Spectrum. Etc. Etc. Etc.. Countless things both in & out of the DMS (aka doesn’t rise to the level of disorder, but is well known & accepted; or is still on the table being debated by experts in various fields, similar to how sexual assault was argued about for decades before being grouped into PTSD, other disorders & conditions & symptom sets are under the same academic & political talk-to-death).

Seeing how soooooo many things, people, events, etc. are affected by trauma? When one has PTSD & is dealing with their own trauma history? Is similar to how addicts in recovery -especially newly in recovery- often see the world painted in addictions. How artists see art, writers see stories, engineers see systems, etc., etc., etc..

The whole “When you have a hammer, everything looks like a nail.”