News Doctor-Assisted Death For Those Living With Ptsd

[anthony]

There's no cure for life at large, it's terminal.

Best response ever read.

We're born, we begin dying the same moment born, then we die at some point - no escaping it. End of story.

 

[shimmerz]

Psychotherapy (one on one) does not help to repair/rebuild Maslows Heirachy of Needs.

This is key.

I am going to rant if I hear 'just taking the easy way out' one.more.time.

I know most of the people who are posting on this board. Their situations are not easy. As a matter of fact, they may be hard pressed and it may take decades of therapy to even figure out for themselves what easy actually feels like. Or if it actually exists.

I have almost frozen and broiled to death in my car. I have lost everything and everyone that has been near and dear to me. Shunned because nobody 'gets' it. Humiliated. Abused by health care 'professionals' on a consistent basis. Every freaking day I fight dropping to the ground. And my newfound 'easier' situation is tenuous at best. What happens after that? Lord knows, because there is nobody left. No support. None. Zero. Zilch. And I will be right back at square one within the Maslows scale.

I am not suggesting that I just be able to walk in one day and say 'hey - off me willya?' I am going to suggest that determining this is going to have to be a process. And a process that one is well aware of just by nature of the process. It can't be impulsive. That will weed out those who aren't actually committed to putting an end to a pattern that just keeps repeating itself and repeating itself. Because society, in an of itself doesn't give a shit and has a tendency the way it is set up to retraumatize those who have severe cases of PTSD.

But. If I decide after all of this to 'take the easy way out' rather than die alone in a freaking ditch somewhere then I figure I have done my time of hard and should at least have the option - 1 time in this lifetime - to choose easy.

And I can't recall who said it, and no offense.... but I absolutely have a mind that can decide that for myself or not. I am NOT an imbecile. I know the difference between feeling hopeless and it being hopeless.

Sorry, ended up a short rant but a rant just the same.

Best not to tag me in this posting. There is lots more where that came from inside of me.

 

[EveHarrington]

This is key.

I am going to rant if I hear 'just taking the easy way out' one.more.time.

I know m...

I think a lot of the concern is for state sponsored assisted suicide and the larger implications regarding the understanding and acceptance of mental illness as a whole.

I'm not trying to argue with you. I have a HUGE concern for dying penniless in a ditch. I have a future suicide plan. It's a VERY real fear, even if not immediate.

 

[Tinyflame]

Hi @Otto.

I live in a country where this is now legal for the terminally ill to apply for if their death is reasonably foreseeable; I believe they still have also agreed to look deeper in to the question of those experiencing unbearable psychological pain, as well as inclusion of mature minors. There was a push to include those with degenerative cognitive diseases, like Alzheimer's disease. In my country polls show much support in general for offering it to those near physical death , considered 'unbearable pain'. (Oddly to me, they don't realize emotional suffering often surpasses even physical in terms of what people can bear, speaking from what I've seen working with the ill & dying.)

However, I'm not posting to comment on that, I actually think the issue has become muddied in that everyone has free choice. But even more so, I think it's missing the mark. I think your statement:below hits the nail on the head:

The biochemistry behind the disease is stabilized with a tight support network, loving kind people, touch, reducing stress. Where is that? Where are these kind people?

I think you are very close to finding a way to overcome this (and not by death), because you've noticed something everyone misses. JMHO but it's not the ptsd on it's own that is unbearable, or can't be managed. And I would argue that most people who get to this point have not been slacking but conversely tried so much they feel very despairing.

As far as the 'mentally ill' not being able to make decisions for themselves.

I agree. Those speaking for 'defending' adults in their right mind mean well but I don't think yet understand (fortunately) why the issue exists.However, depression aside, with every amygdala hijacking we are rendered incapable for the most part of higher cogniive functioning. Memory too becomes inaccessible. Within every given moment, the only way we can try to default the hijacking is reducing stress in our body, +/or over-riding thoughts. (Like @EveHarrington saying, even when we think we will die in the ditch- at best- somewhere between the trigger & the end resulting emotions of despair, fear & lack of hope is the behaviour of the picture we've formed- the ditch & ourselves in it- & the thoughts that go with it.)

I think even with therapy, lots of times until puzzle pieces fit or surface, we don't have understanding of or desire to address things we don't realize are important, or don't focus on, or don't remember.

And if we concentrate on the wrong things, we come to the wrong solution. It's not 'why', or even 'how' to not feel this way, or 'how' to solve it through physician assisted death. Though I think it just makes sense- physician assisted death is a solution to focus on when none other has seemed to be working. I think the question is 'where'- where can we really be ourselves- broken, sensitive, gentle, worn-out, angry, exhausted, ptsd-or-not.

And I understand the lack of fear, or how it can feel even more isolating hearing others' family keeps them alive when you have no family, or when others would profess they'd prefer you dead.

But why I came back is just to say (& I apologize for writing it speaking of myself, I just don't know how else to explain it), I tried to remember how or why I ever had hope. I couldn't remember. I tried to do what I used to do when I felt better, that didn't quite work. I questioned why I can't remember good relationships, or forget bad ones, or memories.

Strangely, I had a dream friday night of my mom who died 20 years ago, only 3rd dream with her ever since before her death, & I remembered ('felt') the happiness & love, not just of our relationship but 'being happy'. The fun, living, despite trauma & ptsd. And today I realized some good memories go 'numb' because the loss is too painful to literally remember 'anything'.

And I remembered a suicide my mom knew of, she said 'too sensitive for this world'.

And I saw a girl in church who looked like a friend of mine who died not long ago, & same style of clothes, either was a suicide or OD or complication, Idk, i know only no family came when she was taken to the hospital- life support. And I thought today I wish she had come to me & my sister she knew, she needed people, maybe we could have got through it.

The upshot is I realized, I had hope (& of course a sense of safety) where & with whom I could be myself- sensitive & gentle being part of it- without repercussion. You can find that. It surpasses identity, or being true to yourself, or self-acceptance, or self-worth- though it includes all of those things. But then, no matter what you deal with with the ptsd (which will benefit by reducing stress), you will find hope. You will find those places & people, doing what is true to yourself- they will be where how you are is valued or ok without defenses. :hug:

 

[Gs172003]

I'm sorry that you're suffering so much. Healing is possible though. For some of us we need to go...

Have you read this Otto? Keep working on it til you get there cause this is possible for you too.

Question For Those Who Have Processed Their Trauma

 

[Freedomfighter]

I think that is interesting, actually. Especially your wording, because it doesn't pertain to the capacity o...

I agree with your view, PTSD being a mental illness would mean that the person does not know what they are doing. I would probably say that some cases are so severe that the person may not have another way out of the suffering. From what I have read there are people who do have a very severe form of PTSD so in those cases I would not be qualified to judge that for them.

And then there are some people with PTSD who are also not necessarily good people. I know some veterans who are sexual harassers and would not bat an eyelash while hurting others.

 

[Tinyflame]

This is in the news here again.

I agree it should be about choice, and many people making those choices are not incapable of choosing. A person, for example, can recognize symptoms for what they are, but that doesn't guarantee they'll be able to ever reduce those symptom to what they feel is necessary for a basic quality of life, or even rather, to the point of bearablity. It's easier to talk about it than live it, especially from those unable to relate to it.

I agree resources are necessary to help people to live; I think it's ill-informed and doesn't dove-tail with reality to believe wanting those resources to be present and them actually being present is an option for all or most.

I don't think providing it is a compassionate service, but neither is promoting push back where there is a lack of presence, help or resources. It just is what it is- cost effective and desired by some. When people feel they do not have value living, and much pain, they rarely fear death to the same degree, or they give up , JMHExperience. Whereas those with family/ SO's have significant or even extraordinary will to live. Again, just what I see every day at work, regardless of type of illness.

 

[whiteraven]

I've come to this thread late, and have read about half of the posts. There's a lot I want to say, but for now I just want to comment on one thing. I think the notion that someone who is diagnosed with a "mental illness" - be that depression or PTSD or whatever - means that they are incapable of making a decision about ending their life is something that needs to be reexamined. While it's true, for example, that depression often skews our thinking, and that people often believe things are hopeless when, in fact, the feelings they are having are temporary, it's also true that for some people, things do not ever improve.

I don't know that I believe it should be a burden placed on a 3rd party - an "assisted" suicide - but I do sometimes think that it would be far easier on the folks that suffer endlessly, without help, if suicide were generally more accepted. And yes, I see all the problems with this. But speaking as someone who has suffered for a great many years (53) and who has truly not seen any of the "temporariness" of feelings that everyone talks about for 2-3 years (and who has tried multiple meds and treatments and programs and nutritional changes, etc...and am now in significant debt because of it), it is almost offensive to me when people say folks like me haven't tried hard enough or they just need to hang on or live better. Do people think I am sitting on my ass doing nothing? Because I'm not. I've been working my whole damn life to just feel like I belong in this world. To just be able to get up in the morning and feel like I don't want to die.

I'm all ears for ideas, but people don't have any that I haven't tried. And that is mostly the problem here. When folks get to the point where they've run out of options, they need a soft place to fall. I truly don't think assisted suicide is the best thing, but nobody is coming up with a better one.

 

[shimmerz]

I truly don't think assisted suicide is the best thing, but nobody is coming up with a better one.

1. A commitment towards ending child abuse
2. Severe penalties for child molesters so they can't touch one.more.child
3. A system that does not keep those with PTSD in a poverty striken state thus leaving them unable to help themselves
4. A better look at alternative therapies that may actually help sufferers lives improve (MAPS for instance)
5. Providing health care for those that suffer from trauma so that they can become engaged in society again rather than leaving them to languish

There is more. Lots more, but this would be a start.

 

[Tinyflame]

I was thinking, the argument out here is if we can put our dogs down why not ourselve(s)? Others have said (seriously), 'Well, if you don't qualify, don't worry, there's still suicide'.

I'm not very good at remembering, but I do remember, because I wrote it down, hearing we think of ourselves that way because we think of ourselves as worth less than others for being sick.

There is more. Lots more, but this would be a start.

And, like above, rather than assisted dying we need assisted living, and assisted loving.

And places/things to recover.

I know for myself I did the (only) logical thing for SI a few minutes ago, and baked a cake.. :rolleyes:

 

[ladee]

I absolutely agree with what @shimmerz said, we don't want to die, we want a break from having to do so much 'proving' we have a desire to stay here and do this thing called living, that we have to struggle to do everything, from finding a reliable therapist to eating.
I know part of my depression right now is because I DO want to live,but I have been poor my entire life... always scraping and doing without to have the bare minimum.. I have worked hard my whole life. My body is in chronic pain and i have one more adjustment to make now, from being unable to afford the procedure to make walking so much less painful..

On my very tight limited income, I still have to work to survive... further doing harm to my body... I don't want any one to 'hand' me anything.... I can work, and I can barter, and I can trade....not asking for a hand out.... but a hand up !!!

Seems no matter what country we live in, it is a hard scrabble life...and if I want to die... I don't need help doing that, couldn't afford it anyway...

 

[shimmerz]

baked a cake.. :rolleyes:

What kind of cake?

Are you having a party at your place that you forgot to invite us to?????? Please say no. ;)