Im I a bad friend for speaking up for her 3 year old?

[Adobe]

Pretty much any time you question someone’s parenting?

You run the very real risk of losing them as a friend. Full stop.

Are you overreacting? Probably. Is she? Nope.


Bullshit.

Tell me how WONDERFUL it would be to be told to f*ck off and die, I hope you die screaming, as you’re raped to death and set on fire, you evil f*cking piece of shit.

That? Is maaaaaaybe 10% of the venom, and hate, and awfulness of what any parent hears when their parenting is questioned. Much less when they’re made out to be a bad parent.

Other Parents? Know that. So they don’t come after other parents the way that nonparents think would be soooo “wonderful”. Unless? Yeah. Raped to death and set on fire, sounds reasonable. Totally commensurate.

To be fair? I know people like that. Who deserve to die. Badly.

Does she? Would you walk into her home and murder her, for the sake of her kids?

If not?

You f*cked up. In a maaaaaajor way. If you want to ever have her, or her kids, in your life… unless she’s f*cking broken, abused, and feels like she’s worth shit? You are out of her life, forever. Because you? Just crossed the f*cking Rubicon.

The only way you could have done worse? Would be to threaten her children.

You DID make her out to be a bad mother.

That is a seeeerious fawking line.

Yep. That makes you a bad friend. A toxic person who should be eliminated from her life, forever.

If you get a second chance? Be very aware of it.

Wow! That was a scathing post. Maybe a rephrase? Education? She was wrong but obviously triggered and needs clarification. She was projecting.

 

[PlainJane]

Mod Note:

Keep the thread on topic. Take what is helpful, leave the rest.
It's unhelpful to assume tone.
When we are conversing on an international mental health forum, we do well to expect different kinds of answers. We open ourselves up to a variety of opinions/responses. We may not always like the responses, in which case ignoring is the best thing to do.

Any further derailment will be thread banned. Any questions or concerns should be directed at the Contact forum.

 

[Adobe]

Mod Note:

Keep the thread on topic. Take what is helpful, leave the rest.
It's unhelpful to assume tone.
When we are conversing on an international mental health forum, we do well to expect different kinds of answers. We open ourselves up to a variety of opinions/responses. We may not always like the responses, in which case ignoring is the best thing to do.

Any further derailment will be thread banned. Any questions or concerns should be directed at the Contact forum.

I was unaware. I see your point. Did not realize there was a contact point for this type of situation.

 

[LeiaFlower]

Me saying, being confrontational is maybe more strong reactivity in hindside. I do have adhd and I used to blurr out everything very direct with 0 cotrol, it took me years to balance it and I was at a very good point using even non violent communication and very calm and considered of others. Now since I started Emdr 2 months ago, it feels like am fully back to 0 impulse control and no room/ eye for the other person and I was taken aback by the drastic change within in me. Not really putting 2 and 2 together as a side affect of the emdr. Wrighting here it makes way more sence, now. Reactivity with anger (that is new to me to express and my body is dying to get it out) missplaced is ofcourse not benifitial to the relationship! And I'll definatly make better expressions more availbe in apropriate places and keep it in in awerenes from now on+ lots of therapy. But I don't consider myself as someone to normalize/ justify this behaviour although I apriciate you mentioning it.

EMDR definitely has an affect on a lot of things. Since you’re targeting past memories sometimes those memories can stay in our forefront so to speak meaning it’ll be easier for us to be triggered especially the same day or day after session. Does that makes sense? I feel like those sentences were wordy lol.

About the part where kids can be harsh/ real trouble/ difficult, I do feel a bit mis understood. But to be fair, I probably didn't explain it very well and/ or left important information out due to language barier.
A bit of what you mentioned about kids in theire development stage was mentioned, yet the otherway around.

the 20 minutes she was complaining about his bad behaviour, she was talking about his potty training gone wrong, when he has to poo. 2 weeks he was doing really good and then he had a relapse. He is really scared of his own poo, so its a big deal to him. And he sits right there next to the entire conversation.
So I mentioned: that although it must be very frustrating for her because she was really proud of the fact he had done 2 weeks really well and it was inconviant for them to do extra laundry, it kinda made sence to me because of all the stress and strangers in the household because of the kichen make over. Since she often makes remarks how senitive he is, it didn't surprise me it would affect him in a way. Well no, that was not taken into in consideration, he should be potty trained and behave better.
Im like, but he is a kid, they can't control theire body like we do. Well yeah she knows that and tries not to get angry at him for it. But she visably was very dissapointed and you could here it in her voice. So a sensitive kid as him would definatly be affected by that.

Yeah, after having more details of the situation I can understand why you were triggered. It’s a difficult situation I can understand both point of views.

With yours, I can see why you were triggered because honestly it’s understandable why her kid had a few accidents on himself. He’s not doing it on purpose to spite mom or act out in any way. Potty training is hard! For the child and parent. But the parent should expect slip ups here and there even in the most progressed kid. Adding on that the child has a fear and he still makes progress!! That’s commendable on the kid part. So for the mom to not take into consideration and believe he should behave better that must’ve been a shot to your inner child. Especially if in the past you had a parent who expected more from you despite your young age and/or capabilities.

Her, point of view possibly being disappointed that her son is regressing in his potty training. Sometimes when children “fail” or make mistakes parents can see it as them failing or doing something wrong. With her growing up in a similar household as you maybe she has perfectionist tendencies as well and it’s showing by wanting her life and children to be perfect? It’s hard to tell without having an honest conversation with her. But having a narcissistic parent, sometimes their parenting style can unknowingly show up in your parenting styles in ways. Maybe when things cool down and you guys are on better terms, sitting down and asking how it makes her feel when her kid isn’t good at something might unlock an entirely different perspective about her.

Then he acts out on his younger brother by pushing and he gets punished.
(To me a response to her behaviour and an cry for affection and aproval. The behaviour of pushing is not ok, but the needs below that get ignored and punished atleast thats how this often gets internalized by the kid)

Ecpecially when she says when he is alone with her he listens very well. Doesn't mean she is a bad parent. I just feel the situation is way more nuanced than the black white thinking of he does or doesn't do what she wants, considering his behaviour being "bad" or "good".

But expressing that hits a brick wall, I should shut up and smile and compliment her for being a good parent.
...Im NOT good with that.

Kids act out for a variety of reasons, including like you mentioned for attention. I agree that it’s more than the black and white thinking that he’s either listening or not listening, “good” or “bad”. The only way to understand her kid is by her having a sit down conversation with him which could happen after the punishment of pushing when he’s given space to call down.

I never advise to bottle up feelings. It always backfires. Though sometimes when talking with people of various trauma backgrounds it’s hard to know how to approach topics. The best advice I can give is to ask her, “I’m not trying to overstep or criticized you as parent. Though I’m asking how come the potty training affects you? Why does it affect you? How do you interrupt when he have accidents?” And just listen not trying to think how to rebuttal everything she says but like you’re listening to understand her inner child.

I do notice a patern though. I was a teaching assistent. Ive been told Im really great with kids by the teachers. I can easily read them. But I get in real trouble interacting with adults in combination to kids, I think a trauma respons that even made me stop working in education, because it was so painfull to watch. When teachers especially the older ones, that are really set in theire ways, say this is how it has to go, because they want it that way but it may harm the kid and its often just very minor changes, with big positive impact... uuuugh... it just break my heart!!! Yet Im wrong for saying something, or creating trouble...

Yeah, sometimes when people are stuck in their ways it’s hard to get them to see another perspective.

Since my compulsion to blurr out kicked in, I probably should not give any advice unless asked and figuere out why it’s so painfull to keep it in.

I might send her a WhatsApp (I prefer Phone, but that might be difficult for her with kids), to apollogize again and to adress that since I react like a freakin puffer fish, I really want to aknowllage it can be hard for her to cope with my behaviour and since she expressed about an other friendship that deeply affected her and how hard it was on her, she should be free to make her own choices and not stay in contact out of guilt/ obligation/ fear of leaving me friendless. Her safety, well being, happines should come first. I will work really hard on my behaviour, yet I also know it may take some time to undo my puffer fish mode and if she needs firm boundaries or a break, or no contact. She is very welcome to express her needs. I value her friendship and I hope we can laugh about this in a year. A friendship is ultimatly to enrich life not to make it more difficult...

Would that be ok to write? Or am I still toxic by writing this? I do wonder if this is like attachement stuff... saying "leave me".

Lol, I’m laughing out of nervousness of the realization that I do all of the same things. I mean that in sense of over apologizing when I make a mistake. Though I genuinely don’t know lol. I struggle too with when I’m triggered and I react in a way that could possibly damage the friendship, with the aftermath of over apologizing and starting a shame cycle within myself. I literally just did this with a former friend of mine. You can’t take back what was said and how you reacted. You can just hope that your friend will have empathy in seeing that your reaction isn’t all that you are, and that you offer way more to the friendship table.

I truly look forward to the day I can be more nuanced like you.

Lol I had to look up what the word nuanced mean and I’m far from it though I appreciate the compliment

 

[Adobe]

There is a great article on the header.” How to Use Triggers As A Means To ReCovery?” You might read that.

 

[Friday]

Like I said in my original post to the OP, being a non parent shouldn’t exclude you for having an opinion on something.

Sure. Like people with PTSD are just cowards, crazy, & histrionic drama queens. It’s in the past. Get over it, already. Or? You’re just a Faker. Liar. Malingerer. Leech. Abuser. Hurting everyone around you. By your lies. And your weakness.

Oh. Wait? Is PTSD a real thing? If I don’t have PTSD, should I not have an opinion on what a bunch of f*cking LIARS can slime their way onto sympathy, and public funds, as the lazy pieces of shit they are?

Or does that smart?

Because that’s not you?

Even if it’s a generally held opinion, by people… without PTSD?

Parents? REAL parents? Give a f*ck. For real.

And noooothing limits your circle of friends faster than becoming a parent. Because all of a sudden? Not only does WHO the person is, matter, but HOW they parent their own kids. Parents? As a rule, do not get on with other parents. UNLESS they share the same ethos. Non-parents? Have as much weight as people who think people with PTSD are just full of shit f*cking liars and cowards.

Was I brash? Certainly.

Triggered? Nope.

People “hear” mama-bear and think teddy-bear. Think Smokey. Think exaggeration.

f*ck with someone’s kids? Unleash hell.

In this ÜBER restrained first-world paradigm? They just cut you out of their life, instead of gut you, and wear your entrails as a hat. But? That’s still the instinct. Because most people? Aren’t abusive pieces of shit, who deserve to die screaming. They’re parents. Real parents. Mediocre or amazing, their first instinct is still to kill anyone -quickly or slowly- who even hints at threatening their child, and dance on their ashes.

That’s kind of disheartening that others will rather lose a friend because of something that could be constructive criticism.

Raping children is GREAT!

Would you not distance yourself from someone who held that opinion? I would. But, just because they’re not a parent, they have the RIGHT to that opinion, and it should be held as equal, and constructive, and valuable? Or, if they are a parent, I should acquiesces to their better understanding and send my kids out to be raped, too?

People DO hold these opinions.

Both parents, and nonparents

And they can all die screaming, by my OWN opinion.

We have no way of knowing how the OP would react to certain things.

True.

I am very much assuming they are a caring and reasonable individual who wants the best for the people she cares for. Maybe she’s a lying piece of shit who should kill themselves, and wouldn’t give a f*ck about their kids, like even the most pathetic of parents do. I honestly don’t know, but would still prefer to assume one, than the other.

IF they would care? Even a molecule, much less with her whole heart and soul? Yah. People coming at her like she’s a bad parent, when that’s what she’s given her ALL to? Isn’t like an “I would lose my job” kind of serious. But something 1,000, 1,000,000 times worse.

Unless she really IS an abusive piece of shit. Which is what someone triggered by child abuse will paint her as.

Maybe she should die screaming.

Doesn’t sound like it. Sounds like her so called friend? f*cked. The. Hell. Up. Got triggered, and treated her like an abuser. And needs to BEG, on her knees, for forgiveness. That she wasn’t seeing her friend, but her own parents. And her own life. Not these children. With a mother who is over the moon at her child’s distress over having hurting his sibling. Because we don’t hurt the people we love, full stop, HAS to be taught. It is not innate. And either someone is teaching you that lesson, on purpose, or it’s on accident, as the people around you are hurt. That their friend was teaching it, on purpose, means they give a f*ck. About their kids. About who will be in their lives. It means they are a GOOD parents. Not the piece of shit abuser, their so called friend has treated them like, because their kid. was. Unhappy. They. Hurt. Someone. Due? To their so called friend’s parenting.

 

[LeiaFlower]

There is a great article on the header.” How to Use Triggers As A Means To ReCovery?” You might read that.

Is it on the this website or somewhere else? I was confused on what the header meant, but it sounds like a really good read.

 

[Friday]

Is it on the this website or somewhere else? I was confused on what the header meant, but it sounds like a really good read.

Yep. It’s in Articles

Under How to use triggers as a means to recovery?

 

[Friday]

Wow! That was a scathing post. Maybe a rephrase? Education? She was wrong but obviously triggered and needs clarification. She was projecting.

Yep. I could have just said, You Are In The Wrong. But I expanded, because I assumed she actually cared/cares for this person & their family. If someone asks? I’ll give them my opinion. Kind, harsh, whatever it actually happens to be.

My opinion? Is that she seeeeruously f*cked up. Triggered explains that, but doesn’t excuse it. The opposite, if anything.

 

[Adobe]

Is it on the this website or somewhere else? I was confused on what the header meant, but it sounds like a really good read.

At the top of the website under articles. It helped me very much. I am rarely triggered anymore as I made note
and worked the suggestions. I will say when my jaw becomes tight and my chest tightens, shallow breathing, palms sweaty, and racing thoughts and impulse to speak it is time to move on work on CBT exercises of deep breathing until I am calm and can think. Learn the deep breathing exercise well. You can learn these skills like so many of us use. Time to hang up the phone or leave when your body starts to do these things.

 

[Friday]

At @ Everyone post.. mods are members, first. We post our own opinions, strengths, weaknesses, opinions, experiences, lives, as… members. The above? Are mine. As a member. Which is what I. Am. Always. Posting. As. unless you see me posting AS STAFF. OR MODERATOR. OR ANY OTHER “this is on behalf of the site” instead of me’self? It’s me. Friday. Speaking from my own heart. My own conscious. My own lived experience. Argue with me. Disagree with me. I’ve certainly done so, with every member of staff/admin/founder. That’s no small part of what makes makes site great. It’s not group-think, but the more minds? The better.

 

[LeiaFlower]

At the top of the website under articles. It helped me very much. I am rarely triggered anymore as I made note
and worked the suggestions. I will say when my jaw becomes tight and my chest tightens, shallow breathing, palms sweaty, and racing thoughts and impulse to speak it is time to move on work on CBT exercises of deep breathing until I am calm and can think. Learn the deep breathing exercise well. You can learn these skills like so many of us use. Time to hang up the phone or leave when your body starts to do these things.

thank you :) I hope to make the same progress