Medical PTSD from Mistreatment in Hospital During Birth

[ilexvert]

Yesterday I was reading my records trying to write out my feelings about what had happened and it triggered another emotional flash back. I start screaming and shaking, I can't stop. It's so overwhelming I slam my head into the table over and over. I want to die, I feel so violated and disgusting. I read in my notes they put a probe in my uterus when my baby was failing (hours before they told me she had issues) because of the pitocin I didn't know I was on. It says "patient consented to IUPC placement" and then above that was all the risks of a c section they don't tell me about. I was told I had to consent and they stood there telling me "that's not consent, you have to say I consent" as I'm sobbing saying they're going to have to do to me what they have to because I had already said no over and over.

I was forced to consent to a surgery I didn't believe I needed or wanted because they had me on drugs against my knowledge for an induction I was coerced into. They tore my uterus into my vagina. I wanted to have 6 kids. Instead they hurt mine and made it so no doctor would let me birth vaginally.


It is so hard to want to stay here. I'm losing everyone, no one understands PTSD.... It felt more like being raped, again, than anything medical.


I had a Foley catheter as well. They pushed no pain management even though I asked and insisted they said I didn't need it... Well I needed it. They all stood over me as I sobbed in the ebd wanting to scream at them I said take it out over and over. This thing in my body the pit on there and refused to take out... It was rape. But no one will listen. No one truly.grqsps what I went through. I can't even look at some bills without having these screaming flashbacks.

Fun part is after a 5 year misdiagnosis as bipolar 10 years ago I can't even consider medication, I have done nearly all of them. And they just couldn't help me after a while... Because it was PMDD. So taking medication is off the table.

It's either I pretend it didn't happen or I'm a nutcase who can't avoid hurting themselves. I jus don't know how to cope... Who is forced through awake surgery where their body is ruined and they were tortured the weeks into the event and hours before?

I'm sorry this is so all over but I'm not ok...

 

[Rose White]

I am so angry on your behalf at the way you were treated! It’s terrible and tragic that they tore up your body and endangered you and your baby and then expect you to be grateful to them afterwards. This kind of shit happens far too often and almost nobody talks about it and if you do talk about it many people try to shame you.

I’m so sorry you went through that. You might want to start a diary to work through your grief and rage.

 

[ilexvert]

I am so angry on your behalf at the way you were treated! It’s terrible and tragic that they tore up your body and endangered you and your baby and then expect you to be grateful to them afterwards. This kind of shit happens far too often and almost nobody talks about it and if you do talk about it many people try to shame you.

I’m so sorry you went through that. You might want to start a diary to work through your grief and rage.

Thank you for this and I don't think anyone could believe how truly systematic the abuse is in obestetrics... I'm lucky to be self reflective to figure this all out and to get help, but many women never even id understand what happened to them, that it was wrong, or that they have PTSD.

Yeah a friend wouldn't let me explain my perspective about how the system allows for this, she kept saying its not all doctors... But you talk to a lawyer and they tell you "consent doesn't matter if they followed the standard of care" and it's like... So no matter what they want to do to you it's fair game? And then to try and VBAC (vaginal birth after c section) the hoops and the manipulation, it's all designed to make money and not have any risk. 1/3 births is a c section right now, the CDC says 10% should be th max and it's 23% above that.... 23% of c sections are unnecessary, major abdominal surgery unnecessary. It's dumbfounding.... And the drugs causing issues and the lack of informed consent.

I could go on for days... If you love anyone you would NEVER let them go to a hospital to have a baby if you know what I know.

 

[anthony]

If you love anyone you would NEVER let them go to a hospital to have a baby

I don't think that is accurate. Your opinion... but not factual. Some people have difficulties and need medical assistance. Some do not have difficulties and do not require medical assistance. Then you have people in both of those that are the opposite within the circumstance.

 

[Rose White]

I hear you loud and clear @ilexvert . A quick peek at the maternal death rate in USA is shocking, especially for older mothers and non-white women. The maternal death rate has been climbing steadily over the last two decades and does not show signs of settling. Highest in all the wealthy nations.

I only had my first in the hospital for all the reasons you state. I had a birth plan and they practically rolled their eyes at me and seemed to be extra aggressive after that. I had the doctor yelling at me while I was crying and pleading with her. There was no consent because if I refused anything they would threaten c-section and cps. I was so dissociated and checked out. My homebirths with a midwife were very healing. I’m sorry they took that from you. There are midwives who will do VBACs but they are very secretive about it and it’s like an underground word-of-mouth network.

Proud of you for speaking out but please be careful—there is so much backlash against this topic, often well-meaning but ultimately an obstacle for you. I encourage you to find communities of free birth women—they will understand what you went through and probably have resources for if you wanted to try vbac at home.

 

[Midnightmoon]

I'm so sorry @ilexvert this is horrific. As someone who nearly died thanks to medical negligence (not birth) I hear you and believe you, and utterly understand how many people just don't get it....

The narrative of 'people look after you in hospital' is spouted from people who I doubt have ever spent 24 hours in one watching the absolute mess that happens.

In the UK I've worked with a few doulas who are absolutely fantastic at supporting and advocating for choice and freedom in antenatal and birth. I really hope you have access to some specialist therapies to help with some of this.

 

[anthony]

there is so much backlash against this topic

I honestly don't know why that is. Woman's body, their choice. From my experience, having been in the room for 3 births, then lots of births around me with friends and family, their experiences, I think there is a lot going on from all angles.

My first son, wife went into hospital, zero issues, super fast natural birth within 2 hours. Second son, issues started occurring and she was rushed into surgery for a C-section, which I was also in the OR for that. Third one, she felt the staff rushed her last time towards the C-section, so she had a home birth with Doula. That was good and bad, but she had a natural birth, but even the Doula was a little stressed and it was close to calling an ambulance and being rushed to hospital.

I think a lot of the problem with hospitals, from speaking with the staff in the delivery ward, there is a rush to suit doctors work times, ie. they don't like delivery in the early hours of the morning waiting around. Shit attitude... but I also see a side to them having a life, and they do this day after day, and they can't meet every females needs daily, as they too have a life, have responsibilities, have family, etc. There are also legal issues in a hospital surrounding negligence if they wait too long and a baby dies because the mother wants a natural birth, according to her plan, but the fetus is distressed and going downhill.

As a guy, I've sat there and watched all versions of this, and I understand some of it. I also understand that a woman has their mental plan, and they often don't like to deviate from that. Their choice. If they have a natural home birth and the baby dies... I've seen friend in this situation, and they blamed everyone but themselves for their choice of not having medical experts around them, just a midwife at home.

If it goes well, a woman is happy. If it goes to shit, they're unhappy. I'm not sure about the US, but Australia has decent outcomes in hospital, last I looked, however, those positive outcomes were not aligned with the patient outcome happiness, ie. surgery vs. birth plan.

 

[Friday]

@ilexvert My OB was the most furious person in the room (followed very closely by my CNM NP, & “my” nurse)… when a substituting nurse pushed Pitocin against orders. I ended up stuck in transition for most of a day, when it’s only supposed to last minutes, and before the eedjit gave meds that were not only not prescribed, but all over my chart NOT to give me? I was maybe 30 minutes max to birthing. 10cm, in transition, is almost NEVER the time to push that drug. Especially not with an extremely high risk pregnancy/birth that was being monitored by multptipe inpatient stays, and daily check ins for months. Sheer stupidity. She was from annother hospital, who pushed Pitocin as a matter of course, and when she saw I hadn’t been dosed, took it upon herself to do so. And my OB? ROARED and waved their arms around and made dire threats (the nurse was rushed out of the room like they were on fire, and the doctor chased her like she’d actually might set her on fire) .

I was to the point where there were only 2 good choices (3 was me & the baby die); emergency c-sect, or bring in anesthesiology and knock me the f*ck out for a few hours until the pitocin wore off, so I could rest up. Or it wearing off didn’t stop the spasms... And I’d already be knocked out / prepped for the csect.

If I hadn’t been in the hospital? Either my son, myself, or both of us would have died. Even before the pitocin screwup, I’d been dealing with an ongoing placental abruption for about 6mo. It would rip away, regrow; rip away, regrow; etc., etc…. Until a 3lb object grew to over 20lbs. The risk for hemmorage & death in less than 3 minutes was intense. And also why pitocin was contraindicated, as it could cause an abrupt on with the random spasms, instead of directional contractions. The placement/size of the placenta meant the risk was even higher with a csect. So the best chance I had? Was vaginally. But it was still “just” a chance. I was very, very lucky. My ACTUAL care team was amazing. The sub who was covering my nurses’s lunch break, because the nurse who “should” have been covering, was out sick? The one piece of bad luck.

Birth is a brutal process, even in the best of times.

When something goes wrong? There really aren’t words. Best possible outcome is both mother & child live, without suffering brain damage. That’s a very loooooow bar. With a whole helluva lotta potential physical/mental/emotional fallout.

I got very lucky, when things went wrong. (As well as “luck is the planning you don’t see” as we had supplemental o2, my blood banked in advance for replacement, an anesthesiologist on call, a room that doubled as an OR -all giant bath & posh hotel motif, with *poof* lights/table/all the things so I could be cut on immediately, if necessary = zero wasted time moving me somewhere else, even “just” down the hall; etc.). So it was a wicked brutal day… but my son & I came out of it aces.

I’m so sorry you’re still dealing with lasting & long term effects.


ETA… and CHA! I don’t usually share that story with expectant mothers. Even though it all came out right in the end, it was very very nearly a 2 people dead story. No one fearing their own birth wants to listen to the horror stories “little bluebirds of happiness” so cheerfully regale. But? When someone has been through something as bad, or worse, than I? Damn straight. It can be f*cking. Brutal.

 

[ilexvert]

I don't think that is accurate. Your opinion... but not factual. Some people have difficulties and need medical assistance. Some do not have difficulties and do not require medical assistance. Then you have people in both of those that are the opposite within the circumstance.

Once you step foot in the hospital no lawyer will represent a woman who is mistreated. Like I said consent doesn't matter, they can do whatever they want because they will say it's medically necessary.

C sections without pain management, put you on pitocin against your will, cervical checks without consent, procedures without knowing the risks because they will lie to get you to do it, signing you up for procedures against your will, husband or dulas kicked out for no reason ... A lot of women won't get IVs now so they can't be put on drugs against their will.

Truly it is barbaric. Women go back screaming I don't consent to c sections and there is no legal precedent in the USA for them to sue. It's so bad some groups are filing them as civil rights violations.

My baby had seizures, a brain bleed, and giant clot which gave her brain damage. He spent two weeks in the NICU. For us it cost our insurance $160k we are expected to pay about $20k for the failed induction c section and NICU stay, and unless she is permanently brain damaged to the point it's life affecting there is NO RECOURSE for anything the did to us.

I really mean it, if you knew how bad it was you would never let a loved one go... If anything happens they cannot do anything about it.

@ilexvert My OB was the most furious person in the room (followed very closely by my CNM NP, & “my” nurse)… when a substituting nurse pushed Pitocin against orders. I ended up stuck in transition for most of a day, when it’s only supposed to last minutes, and before the eedjit gave meds that were not only not prescribed, but all over my chart NOT to give me? I was maybe 30 minutes max to birthing. 10cm, in transition, is almost NEVER the time to push that drug. Especially not with an extremely high risk pregnancy/birth that was being monitored by multptipe inpatient stays, and daily check ins for months. Sheer stupidity. She was from annother hospital, who pushed Pitocin as a matter of course, and when she saw I hadn’t been dosed, took it upon herself to do so. And my OB? ROARED and waved their arms around and made dire threats (the nurse was rushed out of the room like they were on fire, and the doctor chased her like she’d actually might set her on fire) .

I was to the point where there were only 2 good choices (3 was me & the baby die); emergency c-sect, or bring in anesthesiology and knock me the f*ck out for a few hours until the pitocin wore off, so I could rest up. Or it wearing off didn’t stop the spasms... And I’d already be knocked out / prepped for the csect.

If I hadn’t been in the hospital? Either my son, myself, or both of us would have died. Even before the pitocin screwup, I’d been dealing with an ongoing placental abruption for about 6mo. It would rip away, regrow; rip away, regrow; etc., etc…. Until a 3lb object grew to over 20lbs. The risk for hemmorage & death in less than 3 minutes was intense. And also why pitocin was contraindicated, as it could cause an abrupt on with the random spasms, instead of directional contractions. The placement/size of the placenta meant the risk was even higher with a csect. So the best chance I had? Was vaginally. But it was still “just” a chance. I was very, very lucky. My ACTUAL care team was amazing. The sub who was covering my nurses’s lunch break, because the nurse who “should” have been covering, was out sick? The one piece of bad luck.

Birth is a brutal process, even in the best of times.

When something goes wrong? There really aren’t words. Best possible outcome is both mother & child live, without suffering brain damage. That’s a very loooooow bar. With a whole helluva lotta potential physical/mental/emotional fallout.

I got very lucky, when things went wrong. (As well as “luck is the planning you don’t see” as we had supplemental o2, my blood banked in advance for replacement, an anesthesiologist on call, a room that doubled as an OR -all giant bath & posh hotel motif, with *poof* lights/table/all the things so I could be cut on immediately, if necessary = zero wasted time moving me somewhere else, even “just” down the hall; etc.). So it was a wicked brutal day… but my son & I came out of it aces.

I’m so sorry you’re still dealing with lasting & long term effects.


ETA… and CHA! I don’t usually share that story with expectant mothers. Even though it all came out right in the end, it was very very nearly a 2 people dead story. No one fearing their own birth wants to listen to the horror stories “little bluebirds of happiness” so cheerfully regale. But? When someone has been through something as bad, or worse, than I? Damn straight. It can be f*cking. Brutal.

I never said the medical emergencies don't happen. My point for not wanting anyone to go of they knew what I know is the lack of respect for ones bodily autonomy and the inability to take legal action about it if you are mistreated.

Legally doctors are held against the standard of care. What any reasonable doctor would do at that time and it ALWAYS comes back as being the right decision. Same for reporting them, it never does anything because it is within their system.

Sure you can sure if the baby has long term damage but if you're mom no one cares what they have to do to you... Well what they think they have to do.

I honestly don't know why that is. Woman's body, their choice. From my experience, having been in the room for 3 births, then lots of births around me with friends and family, their experiences, I think there is a lot going on from all angles.

My first son, wife went into hospital, zero issues, super fast natural birth within 2 hours. Second son, issues started occurring and she was rushed into surgery for a C-section, which I was also in the OR for that. Third one, she felt the staff rushed her last time towards the C-section, so she had a home birth with Doula. That was good and bad, but she had a natural birth, but even the Doula was a little stressed and it was close to calling an ambulance and being rushed to hospital.

I think a lot of the problem with hospitals, from speaking with the staff in the delivery ward, there is a rush to suit doctors work times, ie. they don't like delivery in the early hours of the morning waiting around. Shit attitude... but I also see a side to them having a life, and they do this day after day, and they can't meet every females needs daily, as they too have a life, have responsibilities, have family, etc. There are also legal issues in a hospital surrounding negligence if they wait too long and a baby dies because the mother wants a natural birth, according to her plan, but the fetus is distressed and going downhill.

As a guy, I've sat there and watched all versions of this, and I understand some of it. I also understand that a woman has their mental plan, and they often don't like to deviate from that. Their choice. If they have a natural home birth and the baby dies... I've seen friend in this situation, and they blamed everyone but themselves for their choice of not having medical experts around them, just a midwife at home.

If it goes well, a woman is happy. If it goes to shit, they're unhappy. I'm not sure about the US, but Australia has decent outcomes in hospital, last I looked, however, those positive outcomes were not aligned with the patient outcome happiness, ie. surgery vs. birth plan.

If you think of it goes well it's great and if it goes to shit its trauma you really didn't read what I wrote....

Forced consent... I was told for two hours everything was fine then all of a sudden the baby had been in distress the whole time you need a c section, even feeling her come down more I told them going back and they ignored me. Forced to undergo awake surgery because they had me on 18/20 pitocin which is 2.5 x the contraction strength your body can do. I didnt want to go above 7... They just hooked me up and never mentioned he was having decelerations for hours and hours.


Or the Foley? I asked for pain medicine over and over they said I would be fine and didn't need it. Then to have four people standing over you with a tube of fluid in your cervix ripping through it and they push your husband away saying it's supposed to be like this. Over and over I say take it out and they refuse?

Being signed up for an induction knowing my due date is wrong and not being able to get taken off th list. Told they will call and call till I come in, not being able to get anyone to talk to me, they are all trying to get me to induce and refused to listen to my concerns.


There's a reason people call it Obstetric violence and birth rape.

 

[Rose White]

there is a rush to suit doctors work times, ie. they don't like delivery in the early hours of the morning waiting around. Shit attitude

pushed Pitocin against orders.

There is a great book called “The Farmer and The Obstetrician” by a French obstetrical surgeon which explains why these kinds of interventions are routine now. He posits that the 20th century industrialization of agriculture and obstetrics went hand in hand.

It makes sense to me that giving oxytocin is routine because the hospital is such an uncomfortable place to deliver, especially when there are a dozen new people asking the same questions (“my address again?! Pain scale?”) and forcing the mom to stay still for monitoring. With my first I went in at 8cm and my cervix closed back up for twelve hours until they completely numbed me with the epidural and I slept.

With my home birth my cat gave me regular bursts of oxytocin by loving on me and it was so painful, I closed her out!

Side note: oxytocin is a wonderful drug for social anxiety, autism, schizophrenia, and other disorders that may induce forms of paranoia. It’s also supposed to be really helpful for couples counseling!!

 

[ilexvert]

I never said the medical emergencies don't happen. My point for not wanting anyone to go of they knew what I know is the lack of respect for ones bodily autonomy and the inability to take legal action about it if you are mistreated.

Legally doctors are held against the standard of care. What any reasonable doctor would do at that time and it ALWAYS comes back as being the right decision. Same for reporting them, it never does anything because it is within their system.

Sure you can sure if the baby has long term damage but if you're mom no one cares what they have to do to you... Well what they think they have to do.

Oh and AGAIN they tore my uterus and my vagina but neglected to tell me... I had to find it in my notes. The one doctor said the pain I was and still have was the knot from my stitches.

I can only have c sections of I can still get pregnant. The procedure that has me suicidal having flashbacks where I literally feel like I had my organs harvested against my will...

There is a great book called “The Farmer and The Obstetrician” by a French obstetrical surgeon which explains why these kinds of interventions are routine now. He posits that the 20th century industrialization of agriculture and obstetrics went hand in hand.

It makes sense to me that giving oxytocin is routine because the hospital is such an uncomfortable place to deliver, especially when there are a dozen new people asking the same questions (“my address again?! Pain scale?”) and forcing the mom to stay still for monitoring. With my first I went in at 8cm and my cervix closed back up for twelve hours until they completely numbed me with the epidural and I slept.

With my home birth my cat gave me regular bursts of oxytocin by loving on me and it was so painful, I closed her out!

Side note: oxytocin is a wonderful drug for social anxiety, autism, schizophrenia, and other disorders that may induce forms of paranoia. It’s also supposed to be really helpful for couples counseling!!

You had a home birth, you know.

Yes we are conditioned to think that a hospital is the safest place to give birth, it seems the only way this natural mechanism allows any women to give birth in a foreign environment.

Truly calm, quiet, dark, etc the things that make a woman feel safe and cared for will help labor progress naturally.

I'm learning with many others how childhood neglect and our choice of emotionally unavailable men allow doctors easy targets for abuse. That and previous trauma or being raped sets up for a mental battle which has ACOG recognizing and recommending trauma informed care but barely any do. Currently it's an epidemic because women are starting to advocate for themselves and that has been increasing the abusive tactics.

Our husbands or partners aren't there for us emotionally, we don't feel safe secure or loved enough to keep the oxytocin flowing and instead feel alone and scared... Then the doctors come in and it's no wonder studies show that birth trauma uses the languag of rape when recounting what happened to us...

Problem is that pitocin and the prostaglandin drugs are all unapproved for labor use and have black box warnings against it. But a doctor has the discretion to use a drug off label and also legally down have to tell you, again the issues of informed consent.


Interventions beget interventions and that's how the cascade begins... But I don't have to explain this to you...

Thank you for recognizing my pain and suffering... Few have and it seems I have to fight and scream at the top of my lights for anyone to hear...

 

[Friday]

I never said the medical emergencies don't happen.

That’s what you took from what I wrote?

You might try rereading when you’re feeling less defensive.

All my best, to you & yours.