Ptsd from narcissistic abuse

[mumstheword]

I really hope you don't have c-PTSD and I do know how much those types of people can cause terrible stress and anxiety.

Lucky you got out and didn't have children with him, I say!

Sounds like a prime opportunity to work through some issues to do with boundaries, discernment, and self worth etc.

People like that wreak havoc with our sense of self and reality.

I really hope you can give yourself the self-love and care you need and that your next relationship is with someone lovely.

Maybe, like others are saying, if you do have c-ptsd, there is other underlying damage that been done from your past and the stress of this relationship has triggered it?

It doesn't sound like it would be c-PTSD though, maybe just PTSD. Which is a good thing.

Doubting your sanity because of a gaslighter and becoming as ill as c-PTSD makes you, triggered by a gaslighter, are different things.

I had a 21 year relationship with a gaslighter, and had a mother who did it too. They certainly greatly contributed to me being and staying ill. But it was sexual assaults, death threats and violence inflicted on me as a child and multiple people drugging me and sexually abusing me that gave me c-PTSD.

Added to that was the lack of care and any kind of response that indicates care from those self-same gaslighters.

Pleas don't be offended if people here question or doubt your assumption that you have PTSD or c-PTSD! Its good news of it's not what you are struggling with.

Accuracy of diagnosis is a really important thing, in my book.


Also I'm not saying that gaslighter/narcissists can't give you really significant mental health problems, they absolutely can. But it's the near-death stuff that tends to precede an accurate diagnosis of PTSD. I could be wrong though.

 

[anonymous0721]

You absolutely can get pstd from a relationship. I was just diagnosed this summer by a clinical psychologist after experiencing similar things in my marriage. I am now divorced. I am also studying to get my doctorate in clinical psychology and have discussed my experience and other's similar experiences with psychologists, and an abusive relationship, especially one with gaslighting and extreme manipulation, can meet all criteria in the DSM.

With that said, I am so sorry for what you have experienced. I don't have any practical advice, as I am currently dealing with the aftermath as well. All I feel that I can do right now is go to consistent counseling and try to get a handle on how this is affecting each part of my life.

 

[Deleted member 541]

^^^^^^. Anonymous. NO, you can not have PTSD from a narcissistic relationship UNLESS there was physical abuse where your life was at risk or rape was involved...

 

[Friday]

an abusive relationship, especially one with gaslighting and extreme manipulation, can meet all criteria in the DSM.

To meet all the criteria in the DSM there has to have been exposure to actual or threatened death, serious injury, or sexual violence.

Dead Link Removed

Note: The following criteria apply to adults, adolescents, and children older than 6 years. For children 6 years and younger, see corresponding criteria.

A. Exposure to actual or threatened death, serious injury, or sexual violence in one (or more) of the following ways:

1. Directly experiencing the traumatic event(s),
2. Witnessing, in person, the event(s) as it occurred to others,
3. Learning that the traumatic event(s) occurred to a close family member or close friend. In cases of actual or threatened death of a family member or friend, the event(s) must have been violent and accidental.
4. Experiencing repeated or extreme exposure to aversive details of the traumatic event(s) (e.g., first responders collecting human remains; police officers repeatedly exposed to details of child abuse).

 

[Thecathasclaws]

I'm sorry you've had such obnoxious responses to your posts. Things are much more complex than "you need to have experienced this or that to have PTSD" and every case is different. I have suffered all forms of abuse with a man who was a narcissist but it is not the violence itself that triggered my PTSD, it is finding myself homeless with two children when I left him. This is because it brought back a childhood trauma to the surface since I did not have a stable home as a child. The brain works in mysterious ways. Years later, my children and I are safe but I still suffer from PTSD. The violence I suffered with my ex is of course part of it but it's not what my recurrent nightmares and worst fears are about. Do you think your recent experience might have triggered an earlier trauma? Maybe a parent abandoned you suddenly or something? Just throwing ideas. One thing I want to add is how hard it is for me to be in a relationship now and live with someone else because I always worry about being made homeless again even if I have no reason to think that. I dream about that every night. I even find it silly but I have completely irrational fears about all kinds of things and my nightmares are ruining my life! Wish you all the best!

 

[ano]

anonymous0721 is absolutely right. I'm also a psychologist and I know from my education that the criteria "threat towards life" is not that simple. Emotional abuse can cause a perceived threat towards life, even if people from the outside didn't see it. Feeling of "dying inside" and a kind of "soul murder" are enough for that criteria. Dealing with a narcissistic or psychopathic person is not just dealing with some difficult person, it's dealing with a deliberately harmful person who gets under your skin in a crazy-making way. I understand that many people here perhaps don't understand what kind of experience it can be, so you don't understand how much you hurt this person who started this topic. It's completely irrelevant to wrestle if she has a PTSD or not, she came here for support for her symptoms, not to self-diagnose herself. Nobody here knows if she has PTSD or not, and because she is in therapy, she propably will get a proper treatment there. So it's not the responsibility of people here to "enlighten" her that she might not have PTSD. You sure can't know that.

 

[anthony]

I'm also a psychologist and I know from my education that the criteria "threat towards life" is not that simple. Emotional abuse can cause a perceived threat towards life, even if people from the outside didn't see it. Feeling of "dying inside" and a kind of "soul murder" are enough for that criteria.

What you're now missing is that you, as a psychologist, are now relying upon this supposed criterion being met based on the clients word that the emotional abuse alone is caused by a narcissist / psychopath, no diagnosis or interview involved. Many a person claim that someone they know is a narcissist or psychopath, of which they are not. People read lists online that if a partner has done x, they are a narcissist. Nearly every partner, male and female, often do many things on those lists at some point within a relationship.

We both know that once, twice, or even yearly occurrence, does not make a narcissist / psychopath. By some persons definitions, loosely being applied, the majority of people on the planet would then fit this.

What you're saying here is the exact issue that experts above your level cite as criterion creep. Psychologists as yourself, loosely applying things to suit themselves or their clients, regardless of mental health doctrine. This is dangerous IMHO, and you are just becoming another cause of the mental health problem, instead of your role, to help the problem. Mental health is becoming a joke... such political correctness being allowed is making it quite terrifying.

I have seen several psychological practices in my area close, gone broke. Why? Because people can't trust the system. Its like the old chiropractic ways... walk in and they try and keep you for life. Just not true, yet they wonder why that profession is considered such a joke too. People aren't stupid. When you, as the professional, become so loose with interpretations and diagnoses, you apply this then to all clients... even those who actually want help, not labels.

I think diagnosis should be quite strictly applied to the text... the very doctrine written by people much smarter than either of us, and as a group where ideas are proofed and proven to higher standards, even within an industry of best guess. When best guess starts being PC'd to meet society... shit gets worse.

Yes... a person "could" get PTSD from a narcissist / psychopath, but that would have to be some extreme emotional only abuse which I believe would typically entail some form of threats / action at some point (being part of both diagnostic pathologies), which would then more easily form the PTSD criterion.

Taking a clients word that x is a narcissist / psychopath -- pretty loose evidence IMHO.

 

[WishfulThinking123]

I tend to agree with @anthony . As I came from an abusive X who was actually stated to have narcissistic tendencies from a psychologist (custody evaluation so they refrain from giving actual diagnosis' due to possible law suit).. Although the manipulation and emotional abuse was horrible that didn't cause my PTSD... my PTSD was developed due to the horrible and sometimes violent sexual abuse.

 

[ano]

I don't understand why you're so hostile towards psychologists, it's a profession with a different point of view than medical psychiatrists. Both have their place, without other the understanding of human mind would be very narrow.

What is a problem here is that DSM is based mostly on current beliefs of the human mind. If you look up in the history, it has been really different. People are now coming to understand that even things like a constant bullying at school (which doesn't usually meet the criteria of "potentially traumatizing event" which we are talking about here) causes very similar symptoms to some people, but they are not labelled as PTSD. Maybe in future the criteria of "potentially traumatizing event" will be broadened, because people begin to understand more. Maybe there will be more sub-categories of PTSD. I think that after that initial categorisation for medical purposes it's irrelevant what the label is, more important is to look at the sympotoms and to help a patient with them. So, the labels are for mental health professionals to debate, not for people in this forum. I think it's very offensive for this person if you start to debate about her supposed diagnose instead of offering support to her. I agree that many "narcissist-diagnoses" are clinically wrong, but we are not the ones to tell if she has met a "real" narcissist or not.

 

[lostforgottensoul]

Feeling of "dying inside" and a kind of "soul murder" are enough

No, no it's not. Criteria A is pretty damn clear. You need to actually believe you may die. It honestly is not rocket science.

"Dying inside" is WAYYYYYYYY different then actually thinking you are about to die.

I'm also a psychologist

That scares me as you seem to not know or get Criteria A in my opinion!

Psychologists as yourself, loosely applying things to suit themselves or their clients, regardless of mental health doctrine. This is dangerous IMHO, and you are just becoming another cause of the mental health problem, instead of your role, to help the problem. Mental health is becoming a joke... such political correctness being allowed is making it quite terrifying.

Agree 10,000%. Everyone has PTSD these days. Now everyone thinks it is a joke when it is far from it.

 

[ano]

Well, I'll post another one just to say that this "dying inside" is about "a threat towards psychological integrity", which meets the criteria of "a potentially traumatizing event". If you haven't been there, maybe you don't understand that it's the same as literally your sense of self is dying. It's not just about some depression.

I'm sorry, I maybe interpreted anthony's conserns of psychologists wrong, I read his post again. Anyway, this is my opinion, and it's an opinion of many other psychologists too, so I stand on my ground. Everyone is allowed to have their own opinion, you may think as you think.

 

[lostforgottensoul]

If you haven't been there, maybe you don't understand that it's the same as literally your sense of self is dying.

NO IT IS NOT!

I grew up in a cult where I literally thought I would die every single day. My head being held under water for an extreme amount of time thinking I was about to die and fighting to get above water to get air. Also threatened at gun point. And many other actual life threatening things.

I also was severely bullied in school. Also having the "dying inside" emotional abuse from that and from my parents (AKA possible psycotic cult leaders).

"Dying inside" from emotional abuse IS NOT the same as to thinking you are about to die. All trauma and suffering DOES NOT equate to PTSD.