Relationship Still Doesn't Get It

[awayhome06]

So I made my boundaries about our relationship clear to my husband. Great advice from everyone, btw, thank you.
But he still just asked me to think about how I would feel if he went to a concert at a bar with another woman (one of his friends). Seriously?!
I feel like he's trying to make me into the controlling person that doesn't respect him that he continually calls me.
Why would he ask me if I'm ok with him doing something that so obviously falls into the category of things I just told him are not okay within our relationship?
Is he trying to fight? Is he trying to trip me up to get his way? Is he testing my resolve?
I just don't get it

 

[Ronin]

Have you asked him what is he trying to accomplish there, and if he misunderstood what you've just said & the reasons he said it?

It's possible he honestly doesn't get it (and not your thing to sort for him, but it might help in case it really is a miscommunication in how he gets things.)

 

[Snowflakes]

I think yes to all your questions. I have learned that when one sets boundaries, one has to be willing to carry out the consequence. It is my sense he wants to see if you're bluffing. It took me a while to learn this.

Edit: I forgot to add.....does he clearly understand what you will do if he crosses a boundary?

 

[Friday]

If someone laid something very general down with me; say I'm not allowed* to go out by myself where there will be men present... And I asked "What about Mark?" (Someone very specific, and beyond "men" but a friend) "What about a concert at a bar?" (Not a private secluded location, but a public open venue)

... I would be trying to figure out the actual ROE, here. Where are the lines? What is okay & what is not okay? No vagueness. I want an area of operation with a clear ceiling that I can be free to move in, and know exactly where the lines are that I might be crossing.

I GET that kind of precision can be vexing. I would send my son to his room when he was little "until I tell you to come back down" and I had to learn to also add "standard exceptions apply" because if I didn't, he would ask "What about if there's a fire? Or a robber? Or in the eventuality that the roof collapses? Should I remain in my room? What IF..."

But with both myself & my son, the spirit of the law & the letter of the law, can become confusing. Personally, I'll follow the spirit & break the letter, my son is/was the reverse and follows the letter, while breaking the spirit of it. So we've had to have a lot of conversations where I explain the intent behind the rule or edict, and he queries various exceptions to the letter, to better understand the intent. Until we can meet in the middle, with mutual understanding. My stuff comes from trauma (I don't follow rules, just because they exist, I have to agree with them to at least some extent. Even if it's 'I'll drive on the right hand side of the street unless it makes more sense to drive on the left."), his is innate (he's always believed that rules & law are something sacred).

Not saying your beaux is like me, or my son, & just trying to fully understand... But it's another possibility.

*If I want to be in a relationship with them.

 

[awayhome06]

I think yes to all your questions. I have learned that when one sets boundaries, one has to be willi...

I'm not even sure if I'm clear what I'll do. So far I've been able to express that he doesn't need my permission to make what decision he will, just that I can't be in a marriage in which my partner won't respect my needs. I would end the relationship of he continually crossed those boundaries now that I've made them clear, but a far as individual occurrences like that, I don't really know what to do.

 

[awayhome06]

If someone laid something very general down with me; say I'm not allowed* to go out by myself where ther...

I appreciate your perspective so much!
It didn't read as trying to understand my boundaries. He too has to agree with a rule to a degree to implement it. I know he doesn't in this case agree with them, but I don't see them as rules or even limitations. They aren't about him in the first place , though I understand that is not going to be how he looks at it.

 

[Snowflakes]

@awayhome06 I think there is a big difference between habits and boundaries. When we are in a committed relationship we collectively agreed in our hearts to accept or overlook some habits. It would be unfair to the other person to suddenly find a habit so unacceptable as to back that person into a corner. A boundary was either specified at the beginning or at least implied. I think that when your sufferer, and mine, become accusatory and/or emotionally abusive, they are crossing a boundary, not a habit.

However, I have learned that sometimes the sufferer will confuse the two and try to make me believe I'm trying to control their given right to a habit.

An example in my case....I have a habit at looking at all people who approach me intently but discretely. My wife knows that habit was borne from my wartime and Law Enforcement training. It's a habit. But when she gets accusatory that I'm looking at women because I'm going to cheat on her, she is crossing a boundary. I don't cheat on my spouse period. And if she is going to continue to cross that boundary, I will walk out of the room and leave her alone till she settles down. My consequence is I will leave the argument and walk away. It's done till she tells me she is sorry for accusing me.

I'm not sure if that is what you meant, if it isn't, I'm sorry. It's been a rough day for me. I've had to walk out of the room twice today.

I hope this helps and I truly wish you and your husband well. Take care.

 

[Snowflakes]

@awayhome06 I went back to your original post. I think if your original arrangement when you two got married were that you're in a committed relationship and going out to a public event with someone from the opposite sex is ok.....then he has a valid concern. In his mind, you're changing the "rules" unilaterally.

However, if the agreement, explicit or implied, was that you don't "go out" with the opposite sex to a public event, then you're enforcing a boundary.

My wife made that very statement to me, ironically after accusing me of cheating on her. I simply said that when we married that we were committed to each other not others. I'm not controlling her. She goes out with her friends. He cannot play games with semantics, you and he knows exactly what he is talking about.

My response to my wife was, if you do, be sure he understands that he will be supporting and living with you because I won't be. Never had that discussion again.

 

[awayhome06]

@awayhome06 I went back to your original post. I think if your original arrangeme...

I am too messed up tonight to really know if I'm making sense, but here's hoping.
My husband did cheat on me. He left me for the better part of a year right after our second child was born. He had a child as a result of that relationship. I have been wishy washy about sticking to what I need for boundaries in order to feel safe in our relationship.
It came to a head recently (as a note, I'm now pregnant with our 3rd) when he want answering my texts several hours after he told me he'd be back, while with this friend he wants now to go out with.
That showed me just how much I need those things, so I have been more direct and unwilling to give in since then.
What makes it all the more crazy for me is that he has not gone out to clubs or concerts of any kind, just hasnt been an interest of his. Now he also doesn't feel safe in most places, was sexually harrassed at a work event at a bar, and knows I have reason to have trust issues with himbeing with this person particularly.
I very well may be changing the expectations, but,at least to me, for good reason.

 

[Snowflakes]

@awayhome06 I am so sorry. I didn't know. I'm new here so haven't read the older posts.

If it were me, that boundary was crossed a long time ago.

I don't know your circumstances with respect to your ability to survive on your own pregnant with children but, in my humble opinion, I don't care what the reason, PTSD be damned, you do not deserve to be treated this way. The man needs to be a father to his children and a husband to their mother.

I wish I could write something to help you. I'm sorry I don't have the words. I empathize with you and wish you well. We are here on this board so you are not alone.

 

[awayhome06]

@awayhome06 I am so sorry. I didn't know. I'm new here so haven't read the older...

Thank you, and know I wasn't upset by your posts, I just want to be understood.
I am confident that I would be able to make it with the support of my family and friends without my husband. That part, fortunately doesn't affect my decision to stay. For now I am willing to give him time to adjust to me being more assertive and direct with what I need from him before taking any extreme steps, I just haven't figured out what I can do to show I'm serious in that time when he crosses my boundaries, as I'm fairly sure will happen.

 

[Snowflakes]

@awayhome06 Thank you, I understand now.

This is the rough part of being a supporter. I am an easy going loyal person. As my spouse became more verbally and emotionally abusive, I "took it" because I get the part about mental illness being just that, an illness. It took a while for me to realize my own mental health was spiraling downwards from the stress and to also realize PTSD is not an excuse to abuse me.

So I set boundaries. I was wishy washy about it at first and the abuse continued. The more I talked about boundaries, the more I was accused of being controlling. It took a bit more time for me to understand I wasn't controlling my sufferer, I was controlling my own sanity by setting boundaries. Finally, it got to the point where I had to be ready to act when my boundaries were attacked. I did not physically walk out the door but I emotionally let go. The result was that we essentially became roommates. Thankfully, our love for each other prevailed and, while the episodes flare up consistently, she believes that when my boundaries are crossed, I will walk out the door. It was a long and difficult process.

So, to answer your last post. The extreme was leaving the abuse by walking out the door. To demonstrate my resolve, I walked out emotionally rather than physically. Yes, I had to take the first step a month or so later to see if mutual heartfelt communication could be restarted which meant I had to pick a good day from her perspective, but we are working on it.

I have found that the hardest thing for me to do is to not wait for the other shoe to drop. It sets me up for another disappointment but I think it helps my sufferer if she doesn't think I'm waiting for the next episode.

We are all different, this works for me. I hope my experiences help you. Take care