Research Survivor Guilt Stories

[Bloomy]

Yepp - grats Bloomy - you shown again that your limits are poorly buit. I should not have jumped onboard and answered this post in the first place, but think as I see you guys done here.

This is also what roselyn should consider. That she ask in a forum where people are trying to buid themselves and not all of us is safe and sound with healthy boundaries and as me mght blurt out personal matters with out second thought. No offence Roselyn as I see where you come from, but this is the other side of this coin. There is no delete post button on this sight so what is said is said and cant be undone.

Reminds me of a norwegian author who wrote a book of similar story. And oh man did she write it bad. To such a degree that I almost belived she had some personal sick pleasure of some of the scenes written. Jeez...

With this said- Roselynn - I belive there is so much litteratur for you to read on this. Please do if you really want to write somehing. Im also sure in the are where you live there must be some health care center or anywhere that people meet according to circumstanses and Im sure you can make a polite inquiry if you can talk with some one with certain experiences and why you inquire. Or use facebook / isntagram / twitter.

If you do write and it does get published I hope for our sake itll be a good one.

 

[Neverthesame]

I don't want to say too much here, but nobody else has mentioned it yet.

I know it's petty, but it bothers me still.
The guilt I feel has been a huge obstacle in my therapy. I'm not likely making any appreciable progress towards getting better until I find away past the guilt.

Ptsd has cost me dearly.
Among several other things, I lost my career. I now work in a entry level position of a large companies warehouse. The requirements to be hired for this job are so low, literacy isn't mandatory. Not kidding. Yet I still find this job overwhelming at times. This is frustrating like you wouldn't believe.

It's difficult to want to talk to somebody about anything like this, knowing that they stand to profit from others suffering.
I know that's not really a fair thing to say, but it's how I feel about it.

 

[Friday]

Ronin, I would never take something personal lightly. I want to learn and understand. Where else could I learn to be respectful of the people who feel this way if I don't ask the people themselves?

Would you walk into a hospital and ask parents who've just lost their child if they're sweating, or feel chills? What their physical symptoms are? What they're thinking and feeling about their dead kid? Right there with the body still warm in front of them? Because that's what you've just done.

PTSD isn't grief.

You say it was 13 years ago, so she's over it. PTSD doesn't work that way. It's not something you get over, or get stronger, like grief. PTSD hits as hard 25 years later as in that very first moment. We relive shit. Not remember. Relive. The pain -including grief- is just as fresh 25 years later as it is on day 1. Flashbacks aren't a memory sequence in a movie, to fill the audience in on what happened. Flashbacks are reliving the event. Like having a nightmare, but awake. Not like daydreaming. Not remembered. Happening. Right now.

I realize war & refugees are a sexy topic right now, and to some degree, always have been for those who have never done it. But it's not sexy for us. Or, to put things in perspective, it's about as sexy as a 4yo being raped. If you wouldn't ask someone to describe their brutal rape as a toddler? Don't ask people to describe their war. Or at the very least expect people to go for your throat. Again, not grief. It doesn't feel better to talk about. It doesn't feel better to be asked about it, or "Oh thank you! That's so kind of you to remember this is a hard day for me." :wtf: Bend someone over, f*ck them with a broken glass bottle, and then be surprised that they're angry about it?

If you haven't been to war? Haven't lost a child? Don't write about it. At the very least not from the perspective of someone who has. There's a very good reason why every writer ever is told to "write what you know". Because when you don't? It's as authentic as a virgin writing about sex. And just as obvious they don't know wtf they're talking about.

 

[joeylittle]

I do believe however we can always learn from others who have lived an experience different to our own. Both in fiction and in real life. I appreciate those who have been (and are) willing to educate me.

Absolutely.

And the process for any fiction writer is: research, write your story, share relevant bits with educated readers so they can comment, expand on, contradict, etc. It's simply that you need to go first. The research is conducted using the work of individuals who have purposefully shared their experience for a wider audience, with full acceptance and knowledge of what that entails.

I do not doubt that if you wrote your initial draft, and came back here asking for volunteers to read portions of it and comment, that you'd have volunteers. I appreciate that you've been honest here, instead of posing as a sufferer looking for shared experiences of survivor guilt - as the administrator, I'm quite grateful for that.

Do your work, provide a focal point for the discussion, and then engage. This keeps individuals from simply putting themselves out there for an unknown end, and it keeps you from simply modeling off other peoples' lives - which would ultimately make the writing weaker.

 

[RoselynJ]

It's not something you get over, or get stronger, like grief. PTSD hits as hard 25 years later as in that very first moment. We relive shit. Not remember. Relive. ..

See.. this is the kind of stuff I don't know and wanted to learn. Otherwise, she would have just got on with her life. I didn't understand - and by these words, you helped me that little bit to write more honestly and respectfully. So thank you.
And just FWIW - I have lost pregnancies, and thus lost children. But the grief I know is different to those I know and communicate regularly with who lost an older child. I am not writing this totally from ignorance - my own self is rooted in the essence of the people I write.

@Neverthesame - I am not immune to that irony. I am not however an already published author. Not all stories see the light of day - especially for new authors. The reason I want to get this story right - and the reason I asked the experts (aka you and people like you) is because I want it to raise awareness. I have a brother with BPD. I love him desperately, but he is not a part of my life because he threatened my infant children. I fully intend to donate any profit from this book to mental health.

@joeylittle - I would never pose as something I am not in a place like this. It would be dishonest and deeply disrespectful. I also have purposely kept myself here in this thread. I am not out reading peoples threads and cherry picking things they have said in this safe space for you all. I asked it here because those who are able and willing to share, do so knowing exactly what I am trying to learn from it.
As to a draft - I have parts of one already. One scene where the event takes place is written. The reason I posted here is that the next scene is proving difficult: her friend (whom she has just told for the very first time that it happened) is trying to convince her that she is not at fault, but she cannot - and will not - accept that. I know that she is angered by her friend. I know that she can't accept that she wasn't at fault. But I don't know or understand why. As an author I "see" things, but I don't always understand how or why - and that is where the research comes in.

 

[Suzetig]

See.. this is the kind of stuff I don't know and wanted to learn. Otherwise, she would have just got on with her life. I didn't understand - and by these words, you helped me that little bit to write more honestly and respectfull

You really seem to struggle to hear people saying that what you're trying to do here isn't ok. @Friday was trying to explain why they wouldn't share the way you've asked people to, why it would be potentially harmful and inappropriate - for you to simply cherry pick the part that gives you something and disregard the rest.

PTSD isn't survivors guilt and it presents in vastly different ways in individuals. People here tend to have significant levels of trauma with long enduring symptoms, that isn't the case for the majority of people who develop PTSD so what you do glean here isn't likely to be representative of the general population. And frankly, if you know so little about PTSD that you're trying to learn the basics from a website, you have no business writing about it.

If honest, respectful writing is what you're aiming for this is the least appropriate way to do it. If you want to understand survivors guilt/PTSD/whatever go and do proper research - read some text books and research papers/journals about the condition, talk to doctors and therapists about their understanding based out of practice, go through ethical approval and do some group work with folk. That's research.

 

[Neverthesame]

Please don't refer to me as an expert.

Failing to extricate living children from the wreckage of a car, doesn't make an expert of anyone. If it does, it's a skill I pray to god I never master.

This is very much tied in with the point @Friday and @Suzetig are trying to get across to you about how to remain respectful whilst conducting this sort of research.

In my day to day life, I don't expect people to walk on eggshells around me.
As an example: If I am queued up at the bank, when some random in the same queue answers their mobile. Then begins having a loud conversation about the gory accident scene they gawked at during morning rush hour. I'm not going to march over to them, demanding they change the subject because it upsets me.
How were they supposed to know?

Even here to a reasonable extent I feel the same. Having ones thoughts challenged from time to time can be beneficial.

However. When I am being asked about things like this specifically. I do hold a reasonable expectation of the other party to pay attention to what and how they word things.

Not because I want to be pissed off easily, or looking for any excuse to throw a guilt trip on some aspiring writer. But because of the knee jerk reaction felt towards poorly worded questions, statements or labels. Such as referring to me as an expert.

To give you a bit of an insight of I mean. I started writing this post at around 12am, it's nearly 3am. I probably won't have this sent before 5am. Some of that is proof reading for spelling and grammar. But mostly it's because I need to stop. Breathe. Calm. Continue. Repeat.

The first sentence and following paragraph? Gave me chest pains, cold sweats and a very real feeling of terror. Because my mind was screaming at me "YOU'RE GOING TO f*ckING DIE!!!!! RUN YOU FOOL!!!".

I logically know that was a fear more than ten years old. I've yet to be able to convince my body of that.

But enough of that.

I realise that most author's never make it. I also realise it's a job. As life enriching as it probably is. At the end of the day, it pays the bills.
Chucking in the bit about the charity, would have been better stated in your first post. Might have also been an idea to name the charity you planned to donate to. Would have made the idea seem less of an afterthought.

Suzetig gave you excellent advice. I couldn't agree more.

Almost 3:30. Not bad.

 

[RoselynJ]

Chucking in the bit about the charity, would have been better stated in your first post. Might have also been an idea to name the charity you planned to donate to. Would have made the idea seem less of an afterthought.

I did not think it was relevant to my question, which is why I didn't include it. But, for what it is worth, it was going to BPD families for research and to refugee support services (whichever region needs it most at the time this ever gets published). It probably should go to PTSD support services, and if you have one in particular I should think about I would welcome the suggestion.

Your point about the badly worded questions - I came here to learn. To understand. My questions were not meant to harm or hurt. And I have apologised upthread. And I apologise again. I came here with honest and (I hoped) a respectful desire to understand. As I said upthread to Joey, I have not hidden myself as if I was a sufferer, or in any way hid what I am doing or who I am. I'm trying to pay attention. I have not responded to everything that everyone has said - but I HAVE read it, and I HAVE taken it on board. I AM listening, and though I have clearly made blunders with some of my words - they were unintentional and I am trying to do better.

 

[RoselynJ]

You really seem to struggle to hear people saying that what you're trying to do here isn't ok.

I have not disregarded the rest of what people have said. I have taken it on board, and tried to show that I am learning. If it seems like cherry picking, it is only because I wanted to show that I had read their post by responding to part of it.
As to proper research, I do it all the time - I have a PhD and research is my day job. But that kind of research can only take you so far. I found this site when I googled survivor guilt. I wasn't actually looking to write about PTSD, but just about the survivor guilt. I didn't come here to cause harm - if I had meant harm I would have hidden my intentions.

 

[Ronin]

@RoselynJ you don't even have an idea what you want to write about.

BPD =/ PTSD =/ Grief =/ Trauma =/ Survivor's guilt.

Please stay out of refugee services. Stay away from refugees. These are actual people, with severe problems because of violence of the scope you cannot damned imagine. They're not your labrats, we're not your labrats, learn basic decency before you talk to anyone.

 

[RoselynJ]

@RoselynJ you don't even have an idea what you want to write about.

BPD =/ PTSD =/ Gri...

I work with refugees every day in my day job. I am not trying to make anyone a labrat.
I know that BPD is not PTSD. I chose BPD studies because my brother has it, not because it relates to the story.
I know PTSD is not survivors guilt. I searched for survivors guilt, I saw threads here. I felt disrespectful "snooping" and so I joined and asked my question.

 

[Ronin]

I work with refugees every day in my day job.

And your first idea happens to be writing a story and profitting off someone else's suffering?

Let alone I'm not buying it. This, or your 'trauma center work' variant.

You think you're entitled to answers. You think others' suffering exists for your profit. You aren't. It doesn't. Now, be so kind and go do something more productive with your life, instead of wasting people's time.