When Therapy Causes The Ptsd

[anthony]

Yep... NLP, that says enough. NLP is not a trauma therapy at all... actually has been medically and science tested, zip results, along with neurologically, nothing. I would not say you have seen a traumatologist, as they used NLP, which is only a motivational therapy. I would seek out a real trauma therapist, someone who either practices CBT or EMDR.

 

[Abstract]

Sorry for all the spelling mistakes!

 

[Xibalba]

Interesting article, that discusses that some trials related to NLP (although, if I am reading it right, not directly *OF* NLP) were conducted, and all were inconclusive. It seems NLP works for those who it works on, in the same way regular hypnotherapy will work on those who are highly sensitive to suggestion, and not work well on those who are not.

My hypnotherapist used EMDR, too, but had no clue what he was doing. He was just waving his hand back and forth. It had no effect. I later read more about it and realized he was clueless. Same with holotropic breathwork, the way he is conducting it will get someone killed, assuming it doesn't account for the suicide rate (both attempted and successful) of his clients.

But then this guy was living with his mother and had a bankruptcy, had to flee to India to avoid problems with a previous partner he owed money to, and now is back claiming he can make anyone a millionaire. The way he made his money is by hypnotizing women (almost predominantly, only a few men were allowed inside his "circle"), and then draining them of their money with his books, CDs, training sessions and lectures, doing all of this while either overtly or subvertly hypnotizing them. The guy is so good, that when he was teaching sexual promiscuity to his class (in a state funded class, mind you), one student's wife stormed into the school and asked what the hell was he teaching. That eventually led to her divorcing her husband for infidelity. Fast forward a few months, and SHE was not only a student, but he made her his "lieutenant" and was dating her. He's good.

 

[Reclusive]

That's pretty horrifying. I don't even know what to say. It's mad world.

 

[Abstract]

That confirms what I think of NLP.
Far to often it is used to manipate people and milk them without the ethical checks and balances of proper supervised registered therapy.
EMDR from someone like that is frightening.

 

[anthony]

NLP has a lot of substance and is very effective for self esteem building / business coaching, that is what it was designed for, and it works really well as a motivational coaching. But that is all it is, coaching. NLP is coaching, not counseling. A few nut jobs off to make a name for themselves, trying to turn NLP into a trauma therapy, some buy into it and suck it up, just like hyper marketing on TV sucks people in to buy rubbish after rubbish!

NLP has zero substance in trauma therapy, as well as EFT, hypnotherapy, etc. None of them are effective strategies for trauma. Hypnotherapy is only effective for memory recovery, not trauma therapy. Go beyond a treatments use, you confuse the boundaries of reality and commonsense, usually ending up that the patient suffers.

There are two types of therapy for PTSD, being what this forum is about, CBT & EMDR. There are lots of different named therapies around, and the majority are CBT models. If you step outside of CBT models, as outlined in previous threads, then you are asking for trouble.

 

[Xibalba]

My best results with any kind of talk therapy were with CBT. I have never had EMDR from a proper therapist, so can't comment.

EFT is a great short-term stress reducer, for me, or when I need to "take my mind off" of something, when my brain gets stuck in a rut. If I can catch myself in time, and to the tapping, it snaps the spiraling downward. But EFT is, as Anthony said, without any substance for serious trauma. I once paid an EFT practitioner for eight straight hours of therapy, thinking a "heavy duty, bring out all the guns" approach would work. We just kept uncovering layer after layer of trauma "bits" and at the end of the day the issue was not solved. I do not believe you can solve something as complex as PTSD with NLP or EFT, although I will say that EFT is effective for "life's little problems."

 

[Xibalba]

Your main trauma being linked to T is really tough as I can see how it may very well be just too much. Have yo tried something that feels very different? T whilst walking in a park? Art therapy and in a very different setting to the past?

I haven't tried any therapy in a park, or art therapy, or any of those out-of-the-box type alternatives. I am in a bad part of the country for good therapy to begin with, and no one has ever suggested anything like that. Until that post, I wasn't even aware to ask about that! Thanks for the suggestions.

My therapy now consists of meditation and just meds for the stress (to prevent fainting).

 

[Abstract]

It may not be the best trauma therapy but it seems to that you need to regain some trust before you can be properly helped.
It is possible to get t and heal after being traumatised by therapy.
I know someone severely abused in therapy with serious consiquences (PTSD; DID, self harm, etc) and who is now very stabil.
She went in patient for two months and then followed up after.

From your story I would propbably do something that "feels" a mile away from your experience so that you can gain steps in trust and then work from there.
The best way to heal damage casued in a specific situation is to have a healthy re experiencing of something similar.

Whatever you do just avoid all these hypnotherapists and NLP people! Mke sure it is someone properly qualied and experienced - a psychologist, councellor or councilling social worker.

Just my thoughts on this.
I have big problems interacting in t because of my previous t experience, and although I now have trauma cbt, my therapist uses a sandbox and crayons ect to help me break through the trust issues and get to the desentsitizing stuff.

 

[anthony]

I always like the crayons method... I actually find it quite interesting to learn from a mental imagery view, as it can tell a whole lot about a person real quick.

 

[Xibalba]

You eat the crayons? How does that help? What colors do you recommend? (sorry, just kidding.)

I just remembered. The "traumatologist" I saw who worsened matters was a student of Franklin Schultz, author of A LANGUAGE OF THE HEART (known, somewhat menacingly, as ALOTH.) She was following his book and personal teachings in trying to use NLP (although they do not admit it was NLP, even though it's based on Bandler's "behavior mapping" theories) when she did her "intensify the bad feelings" schtick. I saw Schultz personally, as well, and won't use this forum to comment openly on his therapeutic techniques, but certainly can comment on his published works, including ALOTH. Schultz does not believe there is such a thing as a "moral imperative" to be a good person. He (and thus his student and offshoot therapists) say that we make the choice to be what we want to be in life, and we can choose from an infinite number of possibilities, but once chosen you only have to the best at whatever you decide to be. If you decide to be a good person, be the best good person you can be. If you decide to be a serial killer, be the best serial killer. (I am not kidding.)

Making matters worse, as part of his approach, he emphasizes that therapists not "judge" -- meaning, literally, they would not deem someone who came to them and admitted a series of murders to be "bad" unless the patient himself themselves FELT bad. This leads to the question as to whether or not the ALOTH theraptis would then help the murderer accept his role and thus become a BETTER murderer. At a personal level, Schultz disallows any questioning or debate of his theories.

Needless to say, this kind of therapy is not conducive to (a) victims of rogue hypnotherapy whose suggestive states are already in flux and highly fragile, and (b) people (like my ex) who are going through the manic cycle of their bipolar disorder, looking for a person in authority to basically "give permission" for them to go out and become a sex addict or whatever is very dangerous stuff. (Which is my case is exactly what happened. Still high on the hypnosis, she used ALOTH to justify a third and fourth relapse into manic behavior that eventually almost killed us both and destroyed our marriage, in effect finishing the work started by the trauma-inducing hypnotherapist we were seeking help from!) In my opinion, ALOTH presents a very dangerous approach, at a very subliminal level, with an outward appearance new-age warm-and-fuzzy. But at it's core it is teaching that uber-narcissism is okay, and if anyone tells you otherwise THEY are crazy.

More culty crap. I sure know how to find 'em.

Then I had the therapist who told me "just man up" and stop thinking so much. That's another story for another day.