When Therapy Seems To Make Things Worse

[willis williams]

NFH, you go and kick that ass. LOL. I had a horrible time with choosing a therapist and still after a lot of sessions over the years I still have real bad trust issues with therapists. I finaly found the one I'm with now and decided that the gain isn't in trusting a therapist it is in my sanity and I opened a little at a time and I guess I got lucky because he has nothing to do with the VA. The state pays for as many visits as I want they got some kind of federal grant. My therapist used to be one of those paranoid recluse nam vets that smoke his share of weed but hitting bottom one to many times he changed all that to become a therapist. He is awsome there is no candie coating and I don't have to sit and wounder what he wants to work on today he knows me well enough he says lets get on with it even if we gotta cry. I hope you can find somebody that fits for you it is hard it was part of the reason for not getting treatment for so long. I would see one for one or two sessions skin would crawl head would bug out and it would be six months or more before I would try another one all the while becoming more and more self and family destructive.

 

[No Folded Hands]

Well, after a couple more appointments I really don't know what to think. LOL!

Ok, I shouldn't laugh I guess. I found out I'd actually been "attacked" a couple times while AD (not by the same people). I'm using quotes because it's a generic word and I can't think of one that would really cover both incidents' intentions. I've talked about one incident, but I am frankly rather afraid to talk about the second. I half expect someone to comment negatively as it is, just having said it happened more than once.

I really don't think I understand the bare fact itself; given that I was the one who used to walk women home across campus before and during the "Take Back the Night" marches in that area in the mid to late eighties and that I habitually did laundry and walked to the grocery store in the middle of the night due to lack of time during more usual hours and rode the bike all over in and outside of urban areas alone and never had any problems at all it's thoroughly bizarre to have this go on during my short time in the military.

Perhaps the odd part of it is that I've been unconsciously using coping mechanisms to counteract reactions left by the second incident. The perpetrators happened to belong to a specific group and I've been very wary around anyone from a like group for years. When I moved here I serendipitously had opportunities to interact with like group members on a low key basis and used that to make enough mild social connections that when I see one of them now I still tighten up and get watchful but the second thought in my head is that they are people (rather than faceless members of a certain group) and that enables me to keep things under control.

I told my therapist last appointment that it was odd talking to him as I'd talk to anyone and wondered aloud why we were not doing any of the therapies I had heard about here. He answered that we will. Perhaps he is trying to establish some basis of trust first. Considering how unsettled and irritated etc I am now, and that EMDR etc is said to make things even worse at least for a time, I really don't want to go back now. Enough that one of my ulcers is reactivating. Ouch!

 

[willis williams]

Yes he is giving you freedom to expose the traumas so he can create a baseline. I he didn't do this you might as well be talking to Joe Shmoe. He can't treat your trauma by generalizing out of a text book because it is your trauma yours probable wasn't in the study used in his text book. Since PTSD affects all aspects of your life even the ones that are not seen he will build a profile of you and your symptoms. This will help him choose a path that will not violate your trust that you have built during the early phase of therapy. As far as doing therapy you control that he will start when you are ready. If you are unsettled and irritated before a therapy session starts then you shouldn't start. It is different if you get erritated during the session because you are thinking about your therapy.

With my earlier therapist this is where I couldn't get past. I would bug out. So basically just had a couple of weeks of just bullshit sessions and would say that shit don't work. There is nothing wrong with me if there was I would notice a differance after therapy. Sorry don't work that way. It takes years of therapy to process the trauma and your doing it yourself the therapist is just guiding you.

 

[Jimmy1]

The other problem with therapists is their specialty. Just like MD's. They all do the mandatory medical school, but some shoot off and specialise in renal, cardiology, etc. Same with therapists. They are all taught the types of therapy, i.e. CBT, EMDR, etc, but if they don't make a practice or learning about the different types of trauma, they will end up in the world of hurt.

My first therapist had to go away for six weeks and the stand in one was a real cock. I told him that I had screamed at my children for no reason and told him that I punched my fist into a brick wall and bruised all my knuckles and you know what he said. 'How did that make you feel' , how the f*ck did he think it made me feel.

People who are attacked, raped, in an accident all have I suppose a deep down fear for their lives, so how did it make you feel they would answer 'Scared'.

That is why their is a major difference with PTSD from someone who is attacked and raped, to someone who was in a war zone. The servicemen and women who are in a war zone are there for an extended duration.

Some of the veterans of WWI and WWII were in war zones for years with very little respite.

These are just my opinions mind you.

But to cut a long story short, therapists have to know their subject before tackling an issue, so NFH, if you think your therapist does not know what he is talking about, go find someone else.

Jimmy

 

[No Folded Hands]

I guess so, Tex. I still want, at this moment, to go find a cabin in the woods near the top of a mountain and move there...with a nice tall fence at the base of the mountain to keep humans away. It's entirely too strange to have had people comment they can't figure out why I like the woods because it's scary in there with bears, wolves, mountain lions. Humans are so much more dangerous.

I'm wondering, Jimmy, how do you stack up long term duration in a war zone without much going on, and with a lot going on? Is it being in the war zone with having to be constantly on guard that's the point you're making, or actually being shot at, shelled, etc that you mean makes the difference?

 

[Jimmy1]

NFH, this is an extract out of the DSM IV, the psych manual. It is the first criteria.

A. The person has been exposed to a traumatic event in which both of the following have been present:
(1) The person experienced, witnessed, or was confronted with an event or events that involved actual or threatened death or serious injury, or a threat to the physical integrity of self or others
(2) The person's response involved intense fear, helplessness, or horror.

Every person who has PTSD has to fall under this criteria, otherwise it is not PTSD. There is also a time frame. If the person can be diagnosed within 30 days of the actual trauma, then they can class it as an anxiety disorder or a depressive episode. This is why they now constantly counsel paramedics, policemen/women, and even service personnel after a tragic event.
They had to draw the line somewhere. That is also why the VA here have an avenue of escape. If they can diagnose a person within the 30 day window after returning from overseas, they can get away with it.
When you think about it, it saves money.

So as you can see, a person who is raped, a person who is attacked, a person who is in an MVA, a person who goes through a natural disaster and people who see action in a warlike environments are all exposed to a traumatic event.

The difference between a veteran and anyone else is the duration. Some soldiers suffer from intense fear for months. For example, two weeks after my deployment to Iraq, mortars landed very close to where we were sleeping. For the next 5 months I slept very, very lightly and used to lay away some nights wondering whether a mortar or rocket was going to come through the roof, and I will tell you, the Taliban were not real good shots with home made mortar tubes or rockets. Three weeks after I left, a fellow co-worker was thrown from her rack and broke her hip after a rocket blew a hole through the blast wall and the wall of the room she was sleeping in. The very room I was in.
So, like the criteria says, veterans are confronted over a long period of time with events that threaten death or serious injury. They also inflict death or injury constantly on other human beings and as well as that witness horrifying devastation day after day after day.
Whereas with a rape victim, or a MVA victim, or an attack victim, its usually a one off event.
Yes they can suffer from PTSD if not treated, but it is different from a veteran.


So, Anthony not only made this forum for us veterans because of that, but because we all have also been 'brainwashed' for a better word with military training and have been taught to with hold a lot of our emotions.
So we don't talk a lot about our emotions and our trauma's, and we also speak our mind and do not really care what other people think.
After being on the other forum for a bit I noticed that a lot of physical abuse, rape, and accident victims, constantly talked about their trauma, and some never seemed to let it go. It was like it was cool or something.

This site allows us to speak our mind without having to choose our words carefully, which can result in some people being offended.

Anyway, thats just my opinion. Hope it clears it up for you NFH, why we are so different.

Jimmy :eek:

 

[Jimmy1]

And NFH, it is common for people with PTSD to want to isolate themselves and get away from society.

I want to do that all the time, so your not alone there.

 

[Sarg]

I lost five years of my life after my wife died. Sat there in my recliner, drinking beer, watching newson tv and hated going out among people, did't do a damn thing. Only left the house to go to the VA, shopped early am for my beer, Jack and minmum groceries to getme by.

Still isolate way too much, but I'm gettingbetter!

Sarg

 

[Jimmy1]

Well, Margaret and I can't wait till the youngest has left the nest. We want to travel a bit around Australia then isolate somewhere where there are no dickheads. An old country town with a pub, a general store, and a post office would do nicely. But less than 100km from a major town though.

 

[Jroocan]

when you return you are in the ugliest maroon scrubs that say the ward you are from and there are armed policeman at every door but I magically managed to go out for a pizza or something.
TEX

Hmm, sounds like my time at VA's Danville, Illinois hospital (ward 7) wow, that was ONE WHO FLEW OVER THE CUCKOO'S NEST for sure...very scary. Had to do 3 days in there for observation before being admitted to the in-patient SARP (substance abuse) program. Did it two summers in a row. Felt like a Veteran, no pun intended, again the second time around.

 

[Steph_F]

then isolate somewhere where there are no dickheads. An old country town with a pub, a general store, and a post office would do nicely. But less than 100km from a major town though.

I'll come be your neighbor! Sounds awesome!! :)

 

[Londonacquisition]

Hey guys it's me again. I hope things are Loooking up for you guys. I need to say that for the paT week or more I have been feeling different. Reading a lot of your guys posts really brings me to attention. Peole I businesses have been very attentive to me. I really appreciate that. I get the running thougtq a lot and I have noticed the patience people h
Are giveng me. Today for some reason I woke ip happy. Even a little motivated. I dike not cause a disturbance at the jay Leno show. There were a lot of security d police there looking at me and of course inknew why. But the god part isno one came up to me and say anything that would be disrupted. The while staff always just leaves me alone. That is a huge thing. There is lne thing. Yesterday a friend of line came over d told me that the operatives are still trying to get him to get me to use illegal Drugs. He said the reason is so that they can take away my venifits. I see it as being correct. No medical provider tells me differently so I am right to think that way. As longs the operatives keep doin this I wil never get better. I want them to know that all it does is make me paranoid. If m medical provides don't tell me then i don't know. I had laser hair removal on my face and neck today. I am happy to say that foe the first time I had no anxiety and no flashbacks!!!!! For the first time ever since the trzatment. I am so happy. I am so hopeful. That is a huge step in the right direction. I was relaxed. I think exposing myself to loud situations is good. But at the same time my medical providers in ft. Hood Texas told me not to push to hard. Ever sine I was discharged I have come to know that they were right. I don't push it to hard. For instance I was discharged from the army in august 2010 d the fist time I went to the jay leno show was April 2011. It tookthat Long. I am going to go again to the jay Leno show again onmay 19 as usually I will take the same amount of medications to keep as stable as possible and if it gets to much I will just get up d leave. I will not take that high amount of medication everyday. To me I feel like a zombie. That is the best wayto describe it. I have a hard time driving. I have learned that for that much medication is good only for situations like the jay Leno show. But if I take it everyday I will not be able to function. 3 seriquils and 6 of the main killers is to much. I also need to say that for a good 4 days no I have been sleeping well. My nightmares are less I don't know how else to say it. I have come to realize that I still don't fell safe anywhere. I think that certain things are just nor going to change. In ly 2004 deployment during the summer time in Iraq. We were in a convoy. One the trucks was hit by led we all got our to pull security. I fell off the pls when getting out. My helmet got fought on something. I don't remember I fell head firs on to the rod and I lost consciousness. The next thing I remember is being on one of the humvees and talking to a coreman. There is so much i don't remember. Ever since that day I have headaches. I was lucky to get tinted window for my car. With that I have noticed hat I have 2 kinds of headaches. 1 is for the light sensitivity 2 are other headaches. I have a hard time remembering what part of my hard it comes. I also have pain associated with the headaches. Then the anxiety then the flashbacks. So frustrating. Never in a million years did I think this would happen to me. I do get angry but I try to keep it under control. Writing in this forum has really helped. For a long time in thougt I was the l ly soldier with these problems. One thing that I wish I could manage better are ly racing bought. I have a hard time taking to people. Specially medical providers. It is easy for me to just forget.


What do you do when you get running thoughts? Honestly I have stopped trying to fight them. I just hive it. I have running thought to the pin where I just stop the conversation. I can't evEn manage them. I have notice that the longer I have running thoughts the more I forget what I was taking about or where I am going and then get lost. I actualy don't remember what I have done. So frustrating. That is why I just met the inning thoughts happen. They go away as soon I calm down. Damn anxiety. Any help is appreciated. Thanks.