Medical Should medical staff stop when you tell them to?

[ben1982]

Consent for medical treatment is often more tricky than for sex. Specially with minors and young adults. And there is also a grey area when it comes to pressure. Even if it's not violently forced. It isn't always consentual. This is often the case with teens who still see a doctor as a authority figure. They are scared to say no. But these complains are often downplayed because it's medical. So they go along against their wishes. And feel violated. But everyone tells them they are not allowed to complain because it's medical. So we don't treat consent for sex and medical stuff the same at all. Maybe something that should be discussed? What about minors who are forced or pressured by their parents or medical staff? In what amount is pressure still okay?

 

[FragileGlass]

While I understand the sentiment behind your thoughts, applying sexual consent thought process to medical consent regarding minors would set a dangerous pattern. Granted I work in an Emerge unit and the number of screaming no’s that echo the hallways from young ones not wanting X-rays, stitches, needles, casts, awful tasting medicine, ventilators, cold stethoscopes etc..... makes up for the majority of my day to day ER stories.

 

[ben1982]

While I understand the sentiment behind your thoughts, applying sexual consent thought process to...

Thats just it. It's not clear at all. And sometimes simply ignored. With sex we have a better picture what's allowed and what not. And there is a constant debate about it. With medical consent we hardly have that debate. The last time we really had that debate on larger scale was after ww2. America has it sometimes on a local level. Mostly after children are vaccinated without parental consent at school. But mostly the consent debate is overshadowed by the vaccination debate. But most teens that by law have the right to consent or refuse have no idea about their rights. And i wonder if some medical professionals even care.

 

[ben1982]

Mental illness is another gray area when it comes to consent. There have been some cases where the police didn't know what to do with a person. These people didn't broke the law. So the police couldn't arrest them officially. So they dumped them at the mental hospital. These people were locked up and forced on medication. And sometimes this was totally unnecessary or justified. And yet there isn't a serious debate about these issues. Is it save to be registered as mentally ill? Some people labelled mentally ill are perfectly capable of giving or refusing consent. Others might not be able. But who's going to take anyone labelled mentally ill serious when that person makes a complaint? And once somebody has that label is it even possible to get rid of it? I think these are some questions that should be debated. Specially because medical records are digital these days. And although they should be protected. We all know thats not always the case.

 

[FragileGlass]

@ben1982

The medical community debates and adjusts far more rapidly than you’ve suggested. There are constant guidline and policy changes almost at a daily pace as we learn how to deal with certain issues.

Consent has a lot of grey areas in the medical industry as there are very broad spectrums of medical needs. Whatever policies are mandated also have to factor emergency and critical care into the equation. Typically it’s a broad sweeping policy that applies across the board to all medical professionals and law enforcement professionals to ensure consistent service.

However, a drug overdosed 15 year old girl is not going to have the same consent process as a 15 year old girl receiving an elective physical exam to perform in a sporting event. It would be a legal nightmare to split consent policies based on medical attention needed. The 15 year old girl looking to participate in a sporting event can absolutely say no to the exam. The overdosed girl is impaired, in potential critical danger and will most likely resist help when she needs it. She will be forced into compliance if medically needed to address her situation.

As far as mental health cases, there are rules that police need to adhere to. If you are with a person who is unable to clearly communicate clearly due to their intellectual disability, appears to be in mental health crisis, pose a danger to themselves or others, police typically take those subjects to the nearest medical facility for evaluation and observation. It’s a sad story indeed. That’s the legal process. Police aren’t doctors and would be accountable if they left a potentially distressed subject to their own decisions after contact has been made with subject.

 

[Freida]

Yes. You can tell them to stop. You can tell them you don't want any more tests. You aren't a prisoner. You can get up, put on your clothes and walk out the door at any time. They can't force you to stay (unless you are a danger to yourself or others of course)

With that being said, what you might really need is a better conversation with them about what they are doing and why. Most hospitals have a social worker or therapist on site to help you translate how you are feeling - all you have to do is ask for them. You can tell your doctor you need more information before submitting to treatment or tests. You can bring someone with you to help you stay calm when they have to do an exam. You can tell them you want to know what results they are looking for before they start - then you can weigh your health with your ptsd.

many of us give up too much of ourselves when we try to have faith in our doctors because we think we HAVE to cooperate. We don't.
Be an educated patient and an honest one and tell them they need to work at your speed - not theirs.

 

[ben1982]

(The medical community debates and adjusts far more rapidly than you’ve suggested. There are constant guidline and policy changes almost at a daily pace as we learn how to deal with certain issues. )

Yes i know. But thats the problem. It's debated in a vacuum. Not on a societal or even a political level. A medical professional will always vote for more treatment possibly. More say and less limitations. Not claiming they do so with bad intentions. But it will be tunnel vision. All people with more or less the same ideas and worldview. So not really a debate. It's more a friendly internal discussion amongst colleagues.

 

[ben1982]

Thank you but i wasn't really concerned for myself. I don't have any personal problems communicating or anything like that. I was more aiming for a societal debate on the issue. Not because of personal issues. But because i see some problems that i think are worrisome. The massive amounts of drugged up children for example. Many of them not drugged for their own benefit. But because they are more easily controlled that way. Or young people sent to residential treatment centres because the parents are to occupied with their careers to give care. Often taken there against their will and without good reason. In a environment that's not healthy. And without any oversight or possibility to challenge their "treatment". It's scary to look in the history books and see how much evil has been done in the name of medical treatment. And seeing that people are no longer watchful or aware about medical consent. It's a important issue that should concern all of society. Not just medical professionals.

 

[scout86]

Many of them not drugged for their own benefit. But because they are more easily controlled that way

The same thing happens to "old people".

I actually wasn't talking about kids. (I decided, as a kid, that the down side of being a minor was you didn't get any choices and no one cared what you thought. You're in prison till you're 18.) I haven't had much better luck "being heard" as an adult, it's just that now I believe I can leave.

 

[Friday]

Should medical staff stop when you say no?

If it’s an emergency, no.
In nearly all other cases, yes.

 

[GettingBetter]

This has turned into a fascinating discussion! So glad I asked.

 

[Anarchy]

I’ve had to wrestle those patients into compliance

Where did the "had to" come from?

No, you didn't not "have to" at all, you are externalizing blame rather than taking responsibility for your own actions.

What makes you believe that you, an individual human, are somehow special / entitled enough to have greater rights over another individual human's body than they have?