General Codependency and codependent tendencies - exploring and overcoming them

[shimmerz]

But if you never had the experience, how can you love yourself and others?

Interestingly enough I was able to anchor to my grandfather (who died when I was in grade 3 but lived with us for a few years) to recognize the difference between love and what I had thought love was.

For love of self I relied on the model I created myself when raising my kids.

 

[ms spock]

Lawrence Heller is the bomb. Thanks for reminding me of how he addresses this @Living in the 70s

Melody Beatie is good, and worthwhile to read and process, but in my humble opinion if you don't address the underlying attachment issues underneath it is will never be resolved. Heller gives some keys for this. I struggle with all of this, and I have been working hard for a long time on it. So if this is not useful for you or this thread please ignore.

Thanks for the link! I read Heller's book a few years ago and started reading it again recently until I started reading Beatte's book. The NARM approach is so intuitive and eerily relatable. I would love to check out the video! I agree that van der Kolk's book is great too.

For some the combination could be useful. So I thought I would suggest it into the mix.

 

[Deleted member 47099]

Thanks @Living in the 70s and @shimmerz for recommending Lawrence Heller - I just ordered the book.

I agree that the underlying attachment issues are at the core of this.

I think even "recognising" codependent tendencies can be important tho, because it's so easy to convince yourself that "helping = good" and to not see the dysfunctional aspects clearly, so that can be a good starting point for doing the underlying attachment work.

 

[ILoveLife]

Codependency is not just about helping and it's about being on the receiving end as well.

Codependent relationships can actually be really enabling of shitty behaviors in light of feeling like it's love, or not feeling lonely.

 

[PreciousChild]

For some the combination could be useful. So I thought I would suggest it into the mix.

I agree with you, @living in the 70's. The things Heller talks about is on deeper level. But I agree with @Sophy too. Since reading and reflecting on codependency, I've learned a lot about patterns of unhealthy behaviors in relating to others. She also has suggestions for healthier behaviors, which I think are helpful. Part of growing up the way I did, my parents didn't really teach me anything. They used me and spit me back out, but they didn't teach me a whole lot about social skills and didn't sit down and have hearts to hearts about how to deal with problems as they came up in life. Sometimes it's good to hear some good old-fashioned advice.

 

[PreciousChild]

Codependency is not just about helping and it's about being on the receiving end as well.

Codependent r...

Thanks Sietz. I think that's good to point out, rather than diminish. Seems like there's quite a few of us who tolerate unacceptable behavior.

 

[TTC18]

You don't feel loved or loveable, so you try to bargain for it, but that'll never get you the love you need because love can't be got that way. So you're always externally related to it. But if you never had the experience, how can you love yourself and others?

Whew, exactly.

I actually went to Codependent anonymous meetings for a year about 10 years ago. I felt like it helped me a lot! I felt so much better that I started dating again, and next thing I know, I was married to an abusive drug addict. The moral of this story is that 1 year of recovery isn't enough!

 

[Deleted member 47099]

Just wanting to throw in another thought/ element to this topic...

I rescue a lot of injured animals/ injured wild animals and have a few rescue animals at home.

One thing I notice about this, is that on some level I'm re-enacting a part of my childhood trauma.

When I was going through the trauma as a kid, nobody rescued me. And I couldn't rescue myself.

Whenever I help an injured animal (or a human being in need) I can feel that I'm doing it to prove to my inner kid that animals and humans in need *do* get help sometimes.

It's like, if I don't help, and let the animal die miserably of its wounds, or don't help when I see someone is in need, it feels like I am abandoning the child me to the trauma and need she faced, all over again

It's like I made an inner promise to myself and my inner kid that no matter what - I will never be a silent witness to suffering. I will DO something about it. Do what I can, what is in my power.

And whenever I do that, I can feel the promise to my inner kid. And I know she's watching me, to make sure that no one is abandoned to trauma and suffering and left in need, the way she was.

For me, that is a big element of it.

I have also stepped in several times, when I have seen kids being abused and/ or bullied. It's a difficult thing to do - to work out which intervention actually helps the child.

I know if I didn't do that, I would never, ever forgive myself, because I know what it was like to be a child in trauma and need and no one helped.

 

[Mach123]

Just wanting to throw in another thought/ element to this topic...

I rescue a lot of injured animals/ in...

Yes, I have all this. I actually think I "got it" from two sources or suffered two traumas or "I don't understand my mothers' role in all this" BUT, I have a memory of escaping them. The cops used to drive away from there and I could never understand why they weren't taking me with them. To get me out of there. Then finally I left (got a chance to escape) and I remember it so exactly, standing up there in the dark and it was really cold and realizing I was never going back. That no one was going to take me out of there. There were a lot of repercussions from my CSA going on during this time. Lots of really hard things went on in those years.

 

[TTC18]

I rescue a lot of injured animals/ injured wild animals and have a few rescue animals at home.

Yep, me too. Lots of rescue animals. I can't say no.

 

[ms spock]

I rescue a lot of injured animals/ injured wild animals and have a few rescue animals at home.

I was a wildlife rehabber for awhile, andthere were a lot of people with trauma issues involved, and quite a few people with personality issues as well.

One thing I notice about this, is that on some level I'm re-enacting a part of my childhood trauma.

Your level of awareness is so high.

I do it unconsciously but I am kind of aware at times, upon reflection, that I am re-enacting part of my childhood trauma.

When I was going through the trauma as a kid, nobody rescued me. And I couldn't rescue myself.

I am so sorry no one rescued you. I know what that is like. I couldn't rescue myself either.

Whenever I help an injured animal (or a human being in need) I can feel that I'm doing it to prove to my inner kid that animals and humans in need *do* get help sometimes.

That is amazing awareness! You have such a high level of awareness.

... it feels like I am abandoning the child me to the trauma and need she faced, all over again

You have incredible awareness. I do all this unconsciously. Occasionally I have awareness!

It's like I made an inner promise to myself and my inner kid that no matter what - I will never be a silent witness to suffering. I will DO something about it. Do what I can, what is in my power.

And whenever I do that, I can feel the promise to my inner kid. And I know she's watching me, to make sure that no one is abandoned to trauma and suffering and left in need, the way she was. For me, that is a big element of it.

I am not as conscious as you are on this, that is great that you

I have also stepped in several times, when I have seen kids being abused and/ or bullied. It's a difficult thing to do - to work out which intervention actually helps the child.

I have done this, and it is really hard. I got into a lot of trouble in one instance.

I know if I didn't do that, I would never, ever forgive myself, because I know what it was like to be a child in trauma and need and no one helped.

It is so hard to deal with this one, my problem is I rescue people that don't need rescuing I am projecting myself on to the people around me. So if it is a genuine child abuse case then that is one thing, but my co dependency means I am inappropriate and I do too much for way too many people.

 

[PreciousChild]

I wanted to pick up this thread again after having a moment. I'm actually still sorting it out.

I'm feeling like there is some strong emotional wave that is surfacing. I was re-reading Beattie about how the codependent should detach herself from others and focus on her own needs. I actually don't even think I know what that means. But rather than not truly knowing, I think that I am actively dissociated from my needs and that this emotional wave is being triggered by my attempt at thinking about what my needs actually are. As a kid, though, I was strongly conditioned not to think about my own needs. So focusing on my needs=dangerous. So I walk around the world constantly putting energies into what my son needs that day and even what my ex bf needs who I'm still living with to keep him happy for some unknown, god-forsaken reason.

This emotional wave feels like a kind of suppressed frustration of decades of neglecting myself. But on the other hand, it almost seems silly to focus on my own needs since that was always negotiable and flexible, and something I could put aside. That makes me feel like a martyr, a saint - to do something not everyone can do. But underneath, I feel a primal scream surfacing and I feel like crying.