Therapist - don't trust myself anymore

[FauxLiz]

I don't know what to think anymore. For 4 years I had a therapist that that was amazing. empathetic, understanding, validating and compassionate even when he was calling me on my shit. When I met him the first time even though I didn't trust him but I didn't question whether I should see him again. Since relocating I have been trying to a new therapist. But its not working, after terminating with the T I first met with after the move I don't trust that I can make a good decision. The terminated therapist I'll call Dr. F did enough damage in a short time that I blame myself for it not working. I feel guilty and ashamed that I couldn't find a way to make it work and worse I feel guilty and responsible because he told me if we terminated I was just making him another "casualty" in my life.

So now I have had an initial consult with two other therapists one which couldn't meet with me again until New Year's Eve, the other, I have had a few additional sessions. Neither one am I truly comfortable with but I am second, third and two hundredth guessing myself that I am being to picky, to judgmental, comparing the long term T with potential T's but I don't really think/believe that is the issue. I don't feel like I trust myself anymore to select someone I can work with, if it doesn't feel right/click after one or two sessions I keep going back because it has to be that there is something wrong with me. I don't know if I am making things better by continuing to research other potential therapists so I can find one that works for me or worse because I don't put more effort into making things worth with the T I have seen a few times after the termination.

I feel like a complete failure at a time when I could really use the support of a T, during my session this week the topic of my suicidality came up and we talked about the fact that with his going on vacation next week, my wanting to spend time with my son when he comes home for break and my impending holiday travel plans it is impractical to try and schedule an appointment before the first of the year (not a length of time I would have voluntarily gone with out therapy before and immediately following a visit with extended family) any time in the last 7 years. He asked me if I got to a low point what I would, who would I reach out to. My first thought was here, I would reach out here for support. Then he asked what I would do if that didn't help and I was honest that I would probably make another attempt like I have so many times in the past. What felt odd, sad and as I reflected later scary was that it didn't seem to phase him or raise any warning flags with him. So now I am questioning is it because he doesn't believe me, didn't understand that it wasn't a vague bit of suicidal ideation or if he just doesn't care. Maybe it's all of the above, maybe its that I am not worth the effort to figure out how serious the threat could be, or maybe it was a sign that it really is time to quit showing the world this exhausting facade and just cease to exist.

Sorry this is so long, I just honestly don't know what would be the point of going on and trying to convince myself again that the new year, that 2019 will be better than the preceding years.

 

[NightSky]

I just had this conversation with my T two days ago: the exhausting facade and how it’s hard to imagine anything will ever change. I am not actively suicidal although feeling very hopeless right now and struggling with self harm. My T was concerned that I was feeling so low and asked for a regular check in this week to let her know how I am. My T isn’t the only one out there like that. I encourage you to find someone who can truly help you feel supported and valued. I know there are Ts who don’t do communication outside of the room. And I told mine I struggled with the idea that I’m not supposed to need her outside of that hour. And she said it’s ok to have people we trust who help us when we need it. And that she doesn’t ever want me to feel as if I’m alone and carrying the weight of this by myself. I tell you this because it sounds like that’s what you need and it’s definitely what you deserve.
I wish I could offer some profound answer about how surely things will get better if even in small unrecognizable increments. But I won’t, because I know how much the hopelessness hurts and how hard it is to keep up the facade. Im sorry that the conversation you had didn’t alarm your T and that you didn’t feel validated in that. That might be a good thing to bring up with him if you decide to stay with him. I recently had to bring up something my T did that made me question whether she took me seriously, and it was very productive. I was wrong about what I assumed she thought. And that was holding me back for a long time.
Either clear the air or keep looking for someone who can truly support you. You’re worth it.

 

[Freida]

I feel like a complete failure at a time when I could really use the support of a T

honestly, I see this as a win for you. You are choosing to find someone you really connect with, even if that means going thru a bunch of Ts in the process. You are standing up for yourself and what you need. The timing kind of sucks, but still. Can you think of these temporary ts as a stop on the road to finding the one you want? Just people who can help you stay on track until you to the one you want to stay with?

I'm wondering if you downplayed the suidical thoughts? If he hasn't had a chance to get to your background he may not realize how scary this could be for you. Worst case can you go to the local hospital if it gets bad before harming yourself? Cause you have put way to much work into recovery to slide back now. :hug:

 

[piratelady]

When I was suicidal a little bit ago, I googled and read a ton about how therapists are taught to react to the discussion of suicidal thoughts. One thing g I read was that they are trained not to overreact, but to have a calm discussion about it. That’s what my therapist did. Now, I still felt supported, cared for, etc, but he didn’t seem shocked, scared, or anything like that. That might be something to keep in mind.

All that being said, you have to feel supported and cared for to build trust in my opinion. I like Freidas idea of one of these being a temporary form of support until you find a king term solution.

 

[FauxLiz]

I'm wondering if you downplayed the suidical thoughts?

I would say it would be difficult to think I have downplayed my suicidal thoughts. I told him that 2017 was the first New Year's Eve in 20 years that I haven't attempted suicide and that I am in the middle of my "annual 5 months of hell" and am struggling with suicidal ideation several times a day.

One thing g I read was that they are trained not to overreact, but to have a calm discussion about it. That’s what my therapist did.

I get that they are trained to not overreact and my previous long term therapist was really good and discussing things with me to ascertain how unsafe I was. The T this week took my statement that if the support I get here wasn't enough if I were to get to that point and would likely make an attempt like we were talking about something completely different. The closest I can come to it talking about me being physically sick and if ibuprofen didn't help with my headache I would amputate my head and he didn't see that being an issue. He didn't ask if I thought I could keep myself safe, he didn't suggest that if I get to that level of depression and dysregulation that I go to an ER or call a crisis line it was like, oh well no big deal. I don't really know how to explain just how much it just fed into my feelings of worthlessness and invalidation. Hell, I had even admitted that my intended method of getting through the holiday visit with my extended family was both alcohol and prescription medication abuse. I just don't know how he could have not taken it more seriously.

Anyway, I honestly don't know what to do anymore. I have a T session scheduled for NYE with the other therapist I had done an initial consultation with the end of Oct. and I reached out to another potential therapist today but he has a wait list and while agreed to be placed on it they said it would most likely be at least 6 weeks.

I suppose on the humorous side of life the T that I terminated sent me a discharge letter worded as though he had discharged me not me terminating him with a bunch of CYA bullcrap in it that at first infuriated me but now just honestly has me being thankful I am rid of this horrible excuse for a human being let a lone an ineffective jerk of a therapist.

 

[Sideways]

He didn't ask if I thought I could keep myself safe, he didn't suggest that if I get to that level of depression and dysregulation that I go to an ER or call a crisis line

Did this T offer to make a follow up appointment?

You mentioned that he was going on holidays for a week, but that after that week, you were going to prioritise bei with your son and travel plans.

They’re great things to do, especially at a time which you know is really difficult for you. But perhaps if he has another appointment available, you could maybe fit that in before you go travelling?

Seems to me you need all the support you can get during this period, and I don’t think your son is going to hold it against you of you have to see a medical specialist on one occasion while he’s visiting?

Just an idea.

The suggestions you came up with (going to the ER or calling a crisis line) are excellent ideas. Perfect. That would make a great safety plan:
1) call t for support
2) if T is unavailable to provide support, call a crisis line
3) if neither of those options result in you being able to guarantee your safety, present to your nearest ER.

That is a rock solid safety plan. It’s exactly what some of us (me included) sometimes need to do to keep ourselves alive during difficult periods. You’d be hard pressed to find a T that could come up with a better safety plan than the one that you have come up with yourself.

There is no T in the world that can make you commit to a safety plan. Ultimately, that commitment has to come from us. It sux. It’s awful. But it keeps us safe when we can’t guarantee to pull that off by ourselves, and it absolutely beats attempting suicide. You’ve out yourself through that enough times. It’s okay to make that your safety plan, even without the seal of approval by a T.

Do you know what stops you from committing to a safety plan?

 

[FauxLiz]

Do you know what stops you from committing to a safety plan?

What stops me from committing to a safety plan is not wanting to be alive. My accomplishment of the week was to have my mammogram and all I can think of is I hope I have cancer. Then I won't tell anyone, refuse treatment and I can just die in a socially acceptable way. I knew there was a chance my depression etc would get worse with an empty nest I guess I just wasn't prepared for reality. I am so lonely, I try to find ways that I don't isolate so much but it doesn't change my being lonely. My son informed me this week that his dad is trying to get him an internship at the company where his dad works for next summer which means I wouldn't see him at all.

So a safety plan, seems counter productive because I really wish I could just die even if that means by my own hand.

 

[blackemerald1]

I don't know if I am making things better by continuing to research other potential therapists so I can find one that works for me or worse because I don't put more effort into making things worth with the T I have seen a few times after the termination.

^^You have to find someone who works for you.. that's not a negotiable issue. I mean what is the point? - You will just end up in a toxic, no win situation and end up hurt and damaged.. that's no good...I think you would agree.

But at the same time, you have to give T's time to hear your story and find you.

They would be foolish to jump off into big ideas and your emotional mine field (we all have one let's be honest here) without assessing and learning first.

You would be the first person to scoff at their arrogance if they did... I certainly would!

So..it's a little bit of both - keep looking and have patience with the T and yourself too! That would be my option if I had one.

So now I am questioning is it because he doesn't believe me, didn't understand that it wasn't a vague bit of suicidal ideation or if he just doesn't care.

^^Did you tell him that what you were considering was more than ideation?

Remember he's not up to speed on almost everything about you yet. He doesn't know when you are engaging in catastrophic thinking etc, he's got to make his own mind up about diagnoses... there is so much work to go before he might be in a place to help you more. And.. it's coming right up to a holiday - so timing is totally off..

Idk.. are you expecting him to sit up and say..'right I am committing you to an institution for your own welfare'? He could have done exactly that and torpedoed you entire life in a misguided attempt at saving you from you!!

I think if he had done this you would have been really upset that he did not listen to your ideation and allow you the opportunity to self-regulate and work your way through alternative's to hospital.

For now, because you barely know him either... you might think about simply assuming he care's for you in a professional way... until you find evidence to the contrary.

it just fed into my feelings of worthlessness and invalidation.

I don't quite understand this.. he didn't react enough? Is that what you mean? What would have been a better outcome for you that did not cause you to feel these things?

I just don't know how he could have not taken it more seriously.

^^So are you saying that you laid out rock solid plans to suicide and he ignored you?

@FauxLiz - if you want to be taken that seriously go to the ER now.. That is the only serious option left. Instead this T allowed you to describe your ideation without panicking. That's got to be a good thing... isn't it?

He listened to you regarding your plans for seeing family and travel. He scheduled his next most available time for you. He asked about coping strategy - and he listened.

What did you want him to do? He only has one option left. Did you want him to do that?

discharge letter worded as though he had discharged me not me terminating him

^^I'm so glad you got away from this nob... the arrogance and disdain he had for you and your health is disgusting. So very good call on walking away from him.

I hope you can work your way towards a better relationship with this T. I think it's good that you pull in all of your supports and keep them near. If you feel too unwell.. go to hospital.

I can just die in a socially acceptable way.

I'm sorry to hear you say this bc I have experience of close relatives passing from cancer and they did not 'just' die. It was an agonising, slow death. I hope your mammogram is clear bc when you stop feeling like this you are going to love being alive. :hug:

would get worse with an empty nest I guess I just wasn't prepared for reality. I am so lonely, I try to find ways that I don't isolate so much but it doesn't change my being lonely.

^^You are not the only mother to feel this. I too am in exactly the same boat and it's very difficult to live with. I want to be nearer and part of my children's lives but it's not possible. So I get this empty nest feeling..this loneliness and sometimes it get the better of me too.

It's not spoken about much bc everyone thinks that once your kids are grown up, job done! - You just get on with doing other things. I know it's not like that at all. I know the gap and the silence and the place in your heart that aches for your children when they leave. It is very hard. :hug:

The only consolation I tell myself is that my children are out there living their lives and being independent and that is a good thing. That's what it was always about. I do not own my children. But it's still very hard.

My son informed me this week t

^^Do you not think this would be a good move for him in his career?

Why would you never get to see him? You are still able to travel and so is he...

My children live vast distances from me... it's difficult granted, but I travel to them about twice a year and they travel to me about twice a year and in-between we do skype and texts and photos/video's and phone calls. Exploit all of these opportunities @FauxLiz.

I know that all of that^^ does not stop me feeling lonely either but it certainly does help a heap!!

It's a probably not as good if I just lived around the corner. However I have watched their friends and how often they interact with their parents who do live around the corner ...and really...I see them distancing themselves from their parents and going their own way naturally. Maybe if they really get organised and want to, they go home once a week. Don't we all do this as young independent adults? Didn't you? I did!.

So, proximity doesn't seem to be the biggest catalyst for the empty nest depression I feel. How about you?

If you died by your own means.. even refusing medical treatment... What message are you sending to your son? That he's not worth hanging around for, not worth watching him grow up and become a man, not worth seeing him happy?

Put yourself in his position. How unworthy would you cause him to feel? Do you really want to do that and at his age?

You'd be saying...through your death...you took option D because things got tough...and you are telling him it's acceptable to do so. Do you know that is what you would be doing? Because it is.

I think you could consider going to your psydoc and seeing what can be done with your medications. You sound very depressed and this time of year is a flash-point for you and many people.

It's the time of year when being separate feels really wrong, even intolerable and it plays on our minds. Loneliness and depression are very difficult to manage I'm not diminishing any of your feelings here FauxLiz - it is incredibly tough but think of another way to deal with it because death is not a plan.

 

[Nessa7]

I had similar problems looking for a new t after leaving a bad one. Looking back on it, the first t I met with would have been a terrible match. Even during the first appointment, I knew that, but I kept second guessing myself. It took almost a month, a post here, and finding the t that I'm seeing now for me to finally trust my judgment.

I needed to take some of the pressure off of me. One thing that helped was putting my trust in posters here. I didn't trust my own judgment. Asking people offline wasn't helping. Posting here got me feedback from people that have been through it before and knew what they were talking about. The other was constantly telling myself that it wasn't my fault until I at least kind of believed it. What happened with your last t was definitely not your fault, and you know that even if you haven't completely accepted it.

From the way you talk about the t you've had a few appointments with, it doesn't really sound like he's the one. I think it's good that you still have an appointment with an alternative, and there's nothing wrong with continuing to look. Picking a t isn't meant to be a permanent decision. You're also looking at a time when therapists are going to be really busy and have packed schedules. Things might be different in a few weeks.

 

[Abstract]

No wonder you are struggling a bit with this now. That t did a bit of a number on you. You also seem like a person that tries very hard so you stayed with him for way past the time when it was damaging you. It also doesnt mean you should immediately fit with the next one or two t's after that. That doesnt make you bad at therapy. You do deserve to take your own feelings seriously and be sure you are OK with whomever it is you see. Sometimes knowing that is a process.

So now I am questioning is it because he doesn't believe me, didn't understand that it wasn't a vague bit of suicidal ideation or if he just doesn't care.

The only way to know is to ask him and see how he reacts. I certainly can see a possibility of someone reacting in a "solid" "unintimidated" way as a possible way to react to someone very chronically suicidal. I have seen people who like it when that happens. Being very prescriptive may also be harder since he doesn't have a history with you as yet. I would ask him if you can. Also be patient with yourself about feeling OK in t. And you are absolutely in your rights to keep looking and thinking if something is right for you or not.

 

[Justmehere]

For what it’s worth, and it may mot be much, but I usually have to see quite a few therapists before one is a good fit.

What felt odd, sad and as I reflected later scary was that it didn't seem to phase him or raise any warning flags with him.

Maybe it did phase him but he didn’t show it... or maybe there are other possible interpretations of his actions?

I tend to run into a weird problem that because I can be so upfront and most clinical about my needs, therapists downplay it. It’s like... wtf? Hey. I actually do need some freaking support here.

You already know what to do for the suicidal thinking and planning, but maybe what you wanted was more empathy and concern for you as a person? To freaking show up and give a damn.

It is hella confusing when a therapist seems to ignore a serious issue. I’m so sorry you are in so much pain. Lonliness is a hard weight to bear. No matter what this therapist did, you belong in the world. I’m glad you exist. I hope you fighting to hang on. :hug:

 

[FauxLiz]

Everyone thank you for your input, support and advice. It has been a long and difficult few days. I did get the mammo results back, no such luck, clean bill of health in that area. I struggle with the idea that my kids need me, by the time I was my youngest's age I was out of my parent's house at college and never looked back. I never went back to my parents house other than to visit for holidays and that got fewer and farther between once I had my daughter.

Yes I think the internship opportunity would be great for my son but he would be spending the summer living and working with his dad. I won't visit him in that instance, I just can't be near his dad, knowing I would be spending two weekends in his proximity earlier this year was enough to push me near going over the edge and that was with months to prepare my first two psych hospitalizations ever before the first and my third hospitalization between the two weekends like book ends.

I am happy for my kids to be independent and flourishing as adults that is all I have ever wanted for them. But my daughter chooses to spend her vacation time with my brother and his family rather than visiting me and generally for the past several years I have had zero vacation time to do anything that isn't a doctor's appointment or staying home sick.

As for what I am "modeling" for my kids if I were to refuse treatment for an illness or commit suicide, honestly I am modeling that they are better off without me. When people, therapists, doctors etc ask me that question I want to turn that around, and ask why does everyone assume that the modeling is negative? Why is it not me showing that we all have a choice in this life, that sometimes life isn't happy, positive, safe and full of loving and caring people and sometimes it is better to cut our losses than to risk damaging the ones we love further by our existence.

I don't know what I am going to do moving forward about therapy, I don't know what I am going to moving forward about me. I am taking things one day at a time. I am struggling to get to and do my work. I am struggling to eat not that I really have anything to eat my debit card got hacked last week I am an hours drive from my closest bank branch and I have less than $10 dollars for gas, food what ever until my new card arrives. I am trying to lurk here to try and keep my head above water I hope you know that everyone here has been so helpful and supportive here since I joined thank you.