News Us politics - read first post before comment

[Neverthesame]

Agreed. I'd say it ranks right up there with refusing to shake hands with the Speaker of the House in that situation.

I did learn of that today when looking into this a bit deeper. So I sat down and watched the whole thing, paying close attention to the "handshake snub". I had read elsewhere that she was late offering the handshake, waiting for Trump to have turned around before raising her hand, then playing up the "snub" as justification for tearing up the papers.
Not being a fan of Pelosi I'd love to agree with that assessment, however it looks to me that Trump did indeed snub the handshake. So I have to agree with you that there was some poor behaviour from both Trump and Pelosi here.

 

[The Albatross]

So far as State of the Union POTUS/Pelosi controversy. Pelosi broke protocol and tradition during her introduction of the President. Anons have been rewatching the vid... it really is 50/50 as to whether or not he even saw her extend her hand. Most notably, he didn't even extend or shake VP Pence's hand for example. But the CSPAN phone in comments were pretty critical of her behavior...

The Senate votes today... I expect POTUS to be acquitted.
Less publicized was FBI Dir. Wray's live stream testimony this morning.

Why does Coronavirus not have it's own thread... it's a world health issue? Just askin.

 

[Justmehere]

Why does Coronavirus not have it's own thread... it's a world health issue? Just askin.

As a member, I posted specifically about it here in terms of the US political context. It certainly is a world health issue and that subject could be it's own thread.

 

[Mee]

. So I have to agree with you that there was some poor behaviour from both Trump and Pelosi here.

agreed. The footage from above shows the timing most clearly.

All the poor behaviour is very frustrating as it just adds stuff to fan each sides’ flames with.

 

[Neverthesame]

All the poor behaviour is very frustrating a

No kidding. I was listening to a podcast that covered this incident and the caster pointed out something glaringly obvious that I failed to notice.
He pointed out that through the whole speech Trump listed off example after example of good things that have been happening for the American people.
Namely the economy improving, crime declining, more new jobs opening than projected, unemployment and homelessness on the decline.
All of these are good things, irregardless of which side made it happen, real benefits affecting the American people whether they be Democrat, Republican or independent. Yet even though these are positively effecting their constituents, the Dem's just sit there in white scowling at Trump.

It just broadcasted this air of divisiveness in that these people are so caught up in their tribalism, they can't even be happy when something good happens to the people they claim to represent. It's really kind of sad.

The upside to this poor behaviour is that I would not have watched the SOTU were it not for the heaping pile of BS. It was a very interesting event to watch and I thoroughly enjoyed it. Honouring the last living Tuskeege airman was one of my favourite moments.

All in all it was an interesting experience, the positive accomplishments the American government has made outweighed the negative identitarian bullshit. I look forward to watching again next year.

Assuming of course the Chinese Mexican beer virus doesn't kill us all first.... :wtf:

 

[Friday]

Assuming of course the Chinese Mexican beer virus doesn't kill us all first.... :wtf:

Oh...c’mon, now! You know as well as I do... things will have to be on the brink of world peace for the apocalypse to strike.

:cool:

 

[Mee]

Not reacting positively to things said isn’t poor behaviour- it’s sensible.

The people who smile at the lists acceptingly are less likely to fact check them.

 

[scout86]

All of these are good things, irregardless of which side made it happen, real benefits affecting the American people whether they be Democrat, Republican or independent.

That's true. Where this get hard, for me, personally, is the part where he seems to be totally unwilling or unable to share the credit with anyone else. And the part where he insists on running down anyone who's ever opposed him. As luck would have it, I've spent a fair amount of time around people like that in real life, and it gets old for me pretty fast. I'll grant my view on this might be skewed by personal life experience.

There's no way I'd ever vote for him. Not for anything. Even if I agreed with him on most issues (which I don't). And it's because I can't abide the way he treats other people. I'd have been ok with John McCain as president, even though I disagreed with him on a lot of issues, because I think he really cared about the WHOLE country and he had thoughtful reasons for his views, even if they were different than mine. Same with Mit Romney, far as that goes. Didn't vote for him, but thought he'd have been an ok president. The current president seems, to me, to be different than that. As near as I can tell, he's interested in being the president of his base and doesn't much care about anyone else. His manner of dealing with people seems to be to encourage tribalism and division. And I'll grant he's good at it. He totally ignores the fact that the majority of voters DIDN'T vote for him. Yes, he won the election. No doubt at all about that. But the fact remains more of the people who bothered to vote voted for someone else. Seems to me he chooses to handle that by ignoring the rest of us, which is actually MOST of us. I think that does as much to fan the flames of polarization as anything else. I'm not surprised that he acts that way. He's acting exactly like I expected him to. (The reason I couldn't vote for him, regardless of views.)

How do you deal with someone like that, if you don't agree with him? Based on my own real world experience, there aren't many options. (not legal ones anyway) It's not like dealing with a normal person where you might disagree, but you can still respect each other as decent, well intended human beings. You can't reason with people like the president, and you'll never get them to respect you point of view. If you're nice to them, it just encourages more bad behavior, because they feel it means they've "won". I'm not sure there IS a way for the Democrats, or anyone else with a different view point, to deal with Trump. If you represent an opposing view, and you've been elected to represent that view, it's your job to disagree. At the moment, what's inevitably going to happen if you disagree is you're going to be demonized by the president and his crew. Seems to me you have to resign yourself to that and do your job anyway. But I'm sure it gets old because it gets old for me. (If you can give me an example of a case where someone disagreed with Trump and he still treated them with respect, I'm willing to stand corrected, but I can't think of one.)

 

[Justmehere]

Trump values loyalty to himself above all else. He is very insecure.

 

[mumstheword]

Just in case truth seekers here on the site are wondering what's behind Mitt Romney's motivation and stance, this article is very detailed and provides much back story to his position.

<link removed>

 

[Neverthesame]

@scout86 I do see your point.
I think where I my opinion has shifted from "Never Trump" to "ummm, he ain't that bad" has come from seeing the direction the left has been going in ideology there, and in action here. It's well, in a word, frightening.

I remember his campaign trail, the disgusting things he said and did, "Grab her by the pussy" still creeps me out.
I also agree he doesn't do anything to bridge the divide between the parties, more so they all seem keen to widen it, left and right. (Though I gotta admit, the hurricane meme with the CNN cat chasing the laser pointer was actually pretty funny. And.... Trumpy Balboa gave me a chuckle too.)
Anyways, yes I agree his behaviour is certainly driving the left further and further away from centre. Where I can't just hold it solely to Trump though is how unbelievably far they're going with it.
I'm sorry but there comes a point when I just had to say enough. Ultimately these people are all adults who are responsible for themselves, just as we are. Their behaviour is on them. The crazy nonsense being spouted from what used to be fairly rational political figures isn't tolerable for me.
Sadly the anti trump craziness isn't limited to the USA. Up here we've lost some major freedoms in favour of not being "right".
We have compelled speech laws here. Bill C-16 if you want to look it up. It isn't a good thing, it's authoritarianism.
One of the campaign promises from all the major parties that ran in our last general election, was giving the reigning political party to bypass our courts when deciding what words can constitute "hate speech". Whether or not this is passed into law, I don't know, all anyone can hope is that they use this power responsibly. Considering we live in a world where using using too much black face paint for a Halloween costume constitutes a hate crime, I don't have alot of hope left for reasonable governance.
There weren't any good options either. The only party that wasn't in favour of eliminating free speech was the Canadian alt-right party.

If you represent an opposing view, and you've been elected to represent that view, it's your job to disagree.

I think we're looking at this from different perspectives.
I was looking at it as Trump simply announcing results, not gloating about how they happened.
Maybe it's because I'm not an American, but isn't the point of the STOU for the president to address the nation as a whole?
If the president can highlight something that positively affects all Americans, is it really a necessity for the members of the opposition to sit there looking like they are eating lemons? It just seems weird to me.

I'm not trying to change anyone's mind, or call anyone wrong, I was just surprised by the response I got from my last post.

 

[The Albatross]

Beck broke out his last Ukraine series Ukraine: The Final Piece (12 hours ago and it already has over a quarter of a million views just on youtube. The invidio link is broken.) Say what you like about Beck... but his timeline has been unable to be disproven. Money laundering... and a shadow war.

Next up will be China.