-
We are a multilingual website again. Read the notice about this.
-
Understand AI use at MyPTSD: all AI use is explained in our AI help page. AI use is by choice here. It exists if you want it, but does nothing unless you choose to use it.
Ecstasy
- Post starter Tom Mintz
- Start date
- Status
I know there have been some successes. Although here is not how this works:
Person aquires street pills(could have anything in them). Eats pills and expects to be better. Gets high, comes down.
No progress will likely come out of that... To my limited understanding and quickly typed butchery, here is how this works.
The person is administered the pure MDMA compound in a safe comfortable controlled setting with health-care professionals around as well as a therapist. The person is allowed to adapt to the substance as the effects take place. As the substance is in full throttle, the person is asked to look back into the incident that traumatized them. Explain it fully and in some sense relive it. With the enhanced dopamine and serotonin receptor site flooding(from the compound) they can hopefully learn to see the experience in a more positive light, as well as look around them and see that the world isn't out to get them it's gushing with idealistic irrational love. As the effects subside(I believe patients were asked to spend the night), they hopefully have passed over barriers before their mind wouldn't allow them to cross.
One must be very aware of the risks of MDMA and drug combinations. For example a person on MAOI's for depression or other ailment takes MDMA then experiences serotonin syndrome then dies.
Although there are risks to MDMA and it has been proven to be nuerotoxic, when used 'properly' there is very little risk to no risk at all. It is a good idea before using MDMA to supplement with L-Tyrosine and 5-HTP a week prior so there is less of a 'crash' effect and to keep natural dopamine and serotonin levels at a regular.
It has also been used for terminally ill patients to over-come death anxiety with great success. Which over-coming death anxiety surely plays a role in the PTSD anxiety/phobia arena.
There is no miracle drug to cure everything, and often drug users will think they have found one. Don't be misled, if your seeking advice about this on more scrupulous web-forums remain skeptical.
Person aquires street pills(could have anything in them). Eats pills and expects to be better. Gets high, comes down.
No progress will likely come out of that... To my limited understanding and quickly typed butchery, here is how this works.
The person is administered the pure MDMA compound in a safe comfortable controlled setting with health-care professionals around as well as a therapist. The person is allowed to adapt to the substance as the effects take place. As the substance is in full throttle, the person is asked to look back into the incident that traumatized them. Explain it fully and in some sense relive it. With the enhanced dopamine and serotonin receptor site flooding(from the compound) they can hopefully learn to see the experience in a more positive light, as well as look around them and see that the world isn't out to get them it's gushing with idealistic irrational love. As the effects subside(I believe patients were asked to spend the night), they hopefully have passed over barriers before their mind wouldn't allow them to cross.
One must be very aware of the risks of MDMA and drug combinations. For example a person on MAOI's for depression or other ailment takes MDMA then experiences serotonin syndrome then dies.
Although there are risks to MDMA and it has been proven to be nuerotoxic, when used 'properly' there is very little risk to no risk at all. It is a good idea before using MDMA to supplement with L-Tyrosine and 5-HTP a week prior so there is less of a 'crash' effect and to keep natural dopamine and serotonin levels at a regular.
It has also been used for terminally ill patients to over-come death anxiety with great success. Which over-coming death anxiety surely plays a role in the PTSD anxiety/phobia arena.
There is no miracle drug to cure everything, and often drug users will think they have found one. Don't be misled, if your seeking advice about this on more scrupulous web-forums remain skeptical.
That be the truth! Don't even think about trying to medicate yourself with ecstasy unless you have clear and explicit approval and authorization from a health care professional. I tell you with absolutely certainty that it will do nothing but get you into trouble. Besides, as cakey said, there is no magical pill or silver bullet that will fix all your ailments, as much as I wish there was one
- Post starter
- #4
I realize there is no cure, but if it will ease some of her suffering it is worth it, And yes I was only thinking in the line of clinical use. I don't think X is available on the street around where I live. I thought idea cool it helps at all. Thank you for your informative posts.
- Admin
- #5
anthony
Founder
No... however; refer to Cakey's post, as that is the correct answer.
Media sensationalise things and use inappropriate wording to gather readers. MDMA is strictly used as part of a therapy session only, as Cakey outlined, and not for private use, as it is a hallucinogenic which will retraumatise your brain otherwise, knowingly or not, by "tripping out", so to speak.
Actually there is very good evidence for its use, and there are currently clinical trials being conducted in the US and in other countries using MDMA in a clinical setting as an adjunct to intensive therapy. So far the results have been promising, to say the least. Here is a link to the most recent study: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/12966141/ecstasy ptsd.pdf.
I believe the same researchers have just recently been cleared by the FDA and DEA for a larger double-blind study of MDMA for treating soldiers with PTSD. Hopefully someday this substance can become a clinical tool available for helping those with PTSD - I feel like it has tremendous potential to help people carrying a lot of pain.
Here is an additional study that looked at the emotional and behavioral consequences of MDMA administration: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/12966141/ecstasy ptsd.pdf.
Peace
I believe the same researchers have just recently been cleared by the FDA and DEA for a larger double-blind study of MDMA for treating soldiers with PTSD. Hopefully someday this substance can become a clinical tool available for helping those with PTSD - I feel like it has tremendous potential to help people carrying a lot of pain.
Here is an additional study that looked at the emotional and behavioral consequences of MDMA administration: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/12966141/ecstasy ptsd.pdf.
Peace
- Admin
- #7
anthony
Founder
Yes IchBin... what you say is correct, however; if you are responding to my above post, please read all above entirely with the responses, specifically Cakey's that I refer too. Nice studies those are... I have read them previously, and its certainly a positive direction for CBT treatment to break down the barriers in those tough cases IMHO.
People get confused between using Ecstasy for the treatment of PTSD vs. the use of medical MDMA for only within clinical settings. You have referred to it in the correct manner, as Cakey previously, opposed to some who took such statements from research and run off with the half cocked notion that ecstasy can just be taken to treat PTSD. Wrong!
People get confused between using Ecstasy for the treatment of PTSD vs. the use of medical MDMA for only within clinical settings. You have referred to it in the correct manner, as Cakey previously, opposed to some who took such statements from research and run off with the half cocked notion that ecstasy can just be taken to treat PTSD. Wrong!
Firstly, I'd just like to illustrate the PTSD symptoms that I struggle with. I suffer from severe dissociation. So severe, in fact, that it is nearly constant. Being "in" my body, as it were, causes me to have panic attacks. Being dissociated makes me incredibly lonely because I feel I cannot connect with the world even though I have to live in it, which in turn, makes me feel suicidal because I fail to see the point in existing if I'm so alone. As a result, I've tried to kill myself 4 times, I barely sleep, barely eat and phone the Samaritans at least twice a week.
Two weeks ago, I took Ecstasy for the first time with a friend of mine. He'd taken it before and gotten them from a friend of his in Holland. I wasn't expecting much to happen. I'm not even sure what prompted me to do it. I have no history of drug abuse, I don't smoke or do drugs (although I did do the latter two many years ago). His parents had gone away for the week so we just locked ourselves inside the house and took half a pill.
Each pill had 180mg of pure MDMA in and wasn't cut with anything else other than the filler to make the tablet. Ecstasy is usually cut with speed, btw, because it facilitates the urge to dance all night long. MDMA itself is usually in your system for about 7-8 hours but the effects are only felt for about 6 of those hours.
The first tracer effects were:
feeling giggly
feeling light headed
urge to move certain muscles such as fingers or jaw
feeling very very relaxed.
The come up for it was quite quick. I was fine one minute and the next I just felt really relaxed. I was suddenly really aware of my body, I could feel every single fibre that the carpet was made of (the suddenness of the come up caused me to lie down). My friend sat me up (there was literally no tension in my body) and said "It's O-kay. Just breathe and go with it. The E is just making your brain do something it was always capable of anyway. It's Okay."
And right then, I knew that it was. And then he made me drink a little bit of water.
Dangers with Ecstasy are overheating and water poisoning. Your body loses the ability to regulate your core body temperature and you can't tell when you're thirsty or not either and MDMA causes your body to stop producing urine whilst it's in your system. You get warm and the urge to drink is great but because you have no idea when to stop drinking, unless someone is keeping an eye on you, you could easily end up poisoning yourself with water. You can also overheat and dehydrate if you don't drink water regularly so you have to get the balance just right. We were having a sip of water once every 15 minutes.
In a very cliche like manner, I began to touch everything. Everything was fascinating and beautiful to me. We took the second half of the pill about an hour after we'd come up ahnd that intensified the feeling a bit. I remember staring at myself in the mirror for ages, marvelling at how beautiful I am for the first time ever (I have issues with my body and my weight).
We had a wonderful night and went to sleep about 6 hours after we'd come up. The next morning, I woke up feeling a little achey but otherwise fine. I walked into his kitchen and looked in the garden and I was blown away. I couldn't believe how beautiful everything still looked and that's when I realised: I wasn't dissociating. I was still in my body and I wasn't panicking.
That notion itself was a little distressing but I remembered what my friend had said to me the night before and took a few deep breaths and then I was okay. We discussed the whole experience in the kitchen and he said to me "I wondered if it might have this effect on you. I read the MDMA could help people with PTSD." which was something I didn't know although having since read a lot about how MDMA works (it releases neurotransmitters, dopamine, serotonin and
Two weeks on and I'm not completely in my body but I'm not out of it either. I feel less anxious. I'm still struck by the beauty of the world, every time I go outside. I don't feel depressed or suicidal for the first time since last October. I've decided to take a trip to Paris in August, I'm being more sociable and performing better at work.
I wouldn't advise anyone that taking Ecstasy would definitely help PTSD. For a start, it's still a Class A drug in the U.K. and illegal, possession alone can get you seven years here, distribution will get you life and an unlimited fine. Secondly, Ecstasy is usually cut with speed when it's sold so you don't always know what you're getting. Thirdly, it has dangers, like any drug. You can overheat and dehydrate, you can get water poisoning, you can get hooked on it because you build up a tolerance to it which encourages you to take more, you can also get hooked psychologically, long-term users have reported symptoms such as paranoia, depression and excessive colds and flu.
Everyone has different reactions to it and I know that just because it changed my life, it doesn't mean it will change everyone's. I was in a safe space with people I trusted, who knew what they were doing and who I knew would take care of me no matter what happened so that very much contributed to my good experience. I also don't know how long this will last for me. I could be back to feeling suicidal again very soon but obviously, I hope not. For the first time in a long time, I do have hope and something to hope for.
However, I would say that from the reading I've done, research of the effects of MDMA on PTSD sufferers seem promising so I'm hopeful that it can be utilised to make an effective symptom suppressor in the future.
Two weeks ago, I took Ecstasy for the first time with a friend of mine. He'd taken it before and gotten them from a friend of his in Holland. I wasn't expecting much to happen. I'm not even sure what prompted me to do it. I have no history of drug abuse, I don't smoke or do drugs (although I did do the latter two many years ago). His parents had gone away for the week so we just locked ourselves inside the house and took half a pill.
Each pill had 180mg of pure MDMA in and wasn't cut with anything else other than the filler to make the tablet. Ecstasy is usually cut with speed, btw, because it facilitates the urge to dance all night long. MDMA itself is usually in your system for about 7-8 hours but the effects are only felt for about 6 of those hours.
The first tracer effects were:
feeling giggly
feeling light headed
urge to move certain muscles such as fingers or jaw
feeling very very relaxed.
The come up for it was quite quick. I was fine one minute and the next I just felt really relaxed. I was suddenly really aware of my body, I could feel every single fibre that the carpet was made of (the suddenness of the come up caused me to lie down). My friend sat me up (there was literally no tension in my body) and said "It's O-kay. Just breathe and go with it. The E is just making your brain do something it was always capable of anyway. It's Okay."
And right then, I knew that it was. And then he made me drink a little bit of water.
Dangers with Ecstasy are overheating and water poisoning. Your body loses the ability to regulate your core body temperature and you can't tell when you're thirsty or not either and MDMA causes your body to stop producing urine whilst it's in your system. You get warm and the urge to drink is great but because you have no idea when to stop drinking, unless someone is keeping an eye on you, you could easily end up poisoning yourself with water. You can also overheat and dehydrate if you don't drink water regularly so you have to get the balance just right. We were having a sip of water once every 15 minutes.
In a very cliche like manner, I began to touch everything. Everything was fascinating and beautiful to me. We took the second half of the pill about an hour after we'd come up ahnd that intensified the feeling a bit. I remember staring at myself in the mirror for ages, marvelling at how beautiful I am for the first time ever (I have issues with my body and my weight).
We had a wonderful night and went to sleep about 6 hours after we'd come up. The next morning, I woke up feeling a little achey but otherwise fine. I walked into his kitchen and looked in the garden and I was blown away. I couldn't believe how beautiful everything still looked and that's when I realised: I wasn't dissociating. I was still in my body and I wasn't panicking.
That notion itself was a little distressing but I remembered what my friend had said to me the night before and took a few deep breaths and then I was okay. We discussed the whole experience in the kitchen and he said to me "I wondered if it might have this effect on you. I read the MDMA could help people with PTSD." which was something I didn't know although having since read a lot about how MDMA works (it releases neurotransmitters, dopamine, serotonin and
Two weeks on and I'm not completely in my body but I'm not out of it either. I feel less anxious. I'm still struck by the beauty of the world, every time I go outside. I don't feel depressed or suicidal for the first time since last October. I've decided to take a trip to Paris in August, I'm being more sociable and performing better at work.
I wouldn't advise anyone that taking Ecstasy would definitely help PTSD. For a start, it's still a Class A drug in the U.K. and illegal, possession alone can get you seven years here, distribution will get you life and an unlimited fine. Secondly, Ecstasy is usually cut with speed when it's sold so you don't always know what you're getting. Thirdly, it has dangers, like any drug. You can overheat and dehydrate, you can get water poisoning, you can get hooked on it because you build up a tolerance to it which encourages you to take more, you can also get hooked psychologically, long-term users have reported symptoms such as paranoia, depression and excessive colds and flu.
Everyone has different reactions to it and I know that just because it changed my life, it doesn't mean it will change everyone's. I was in a safe space with people I trusted, who knew what they were doing and who I knew would take care of me no matter what happened so that very much contributed to my good experience. I also don't know how long this will last for me. I could be back to feeling suicidal again very soon but obviously, I hope not. For the first time in a long time, I do have hope and something to hope for.
However, I would say that from the reading I've done, research of the effects of MDMA on PTSD sufferers seem promising so I'm hopeful that it can be utilised to make an effective symptom suppressor in the future.
- Admin
- #9
anthony
Founder
Aine, I think you need to read this thread, and all associated research about MDMA helping PTSD, because none of it is how you have done things, nor suggested.
IT HAS ONLY EVER BEEN ABOUT WITHIN A THERAPY ENVIRONMENT.
IT HAS ONLY EVER BEEN ABOUT WITHIN A THERAPY ENVIRONMENT.
- Post starter
- #10
You know, I will probably get booted for this, but Jesus Anthony, she didn't even avocate it. She was sharing her exprience. It is wonderful, that even for a little while she can enjoy and appriecate the world around her. I am not saying that she needs to repeat it, or that she, did it the right way. However, if there is anything I have learned in this short amount of time in life, it is we all work in much different ways. There is no medical book that can explain the complexities of the human mind, we can't even explain a house pet's brain function. Could you for once offer someone support and happiness instead of being a doomsayer. Anyway, good luck Aine, do seek assistance with a professional next time, but it is fantastic that you have found reason to live instead of searching for a reason not to. All my love and cares. I hope you get to read this before they delete it.
- Admin
- #11
anthony
Founder
What you say is accurate Tom, though I cannot let people think it is right, when it's not. Already from this research upon the web, we have people like aine trying it exactly as was never described in the research. In essence, aine's comments validate my response as I see it.
Kintsugi
Sponsor
I respect that self-medication is a bad idea, not the right way to heal, drugs are illegal, street drugs are scary, and none of this is research-based.
But, come on man. You can tell someone that something is bad for them a million times. It does not mean that they will not make the opposite decision. My opinion is that self-medication is never the answer to complicated problems like PTSD. The temporary alleviation of symptoms afforded to us by drugs of all kinds (cigarettes, alcohol, caffeine, lexapro, ambien, tylenol, whatever) is not healing, it is temporary alleviation of symptoms.
Having said that, in case you do decide to turn to street drugs, you should be well informed, and I believe that aine sharing her experience was a valuable start.
Ecstasy is NOT MDMA. Ecstasy usually has no MDMA whatsoever in it unless you are living near a border that admits pure drugs, which is hard to judge if you aren't tapped into the culture already, particularly with 'designer drugs,' so assume that anything called X is a cocktail of uppers and downers. X is designed as a party drug, and it is usually demographic-specific when it's sold in or around clubs: girls usually get things with downers, serotonin-centered drugs, ect, and guys usually get speedy mixes. It's a dangerous game.
It is impossible to find uncut MDMA in the USA without having some kind of hospital or university connection, or close friendship with a ballsy chemist. It will always have something in it. This could be anything from rat poison to meth to coke and so on. BUT the street name for what is supposed to be pure MDMA is Molly. Aine was incredibly lucky to have access to something that was completely untampered with.
Having gotten that information out of the way, I will share my knowledge and experience.
I have no idea what anthony is referencing about re-traumatizing and 'tripping out.' I respect anthony and his research, but I was told by a neurologist teaching a bio/psych class about drugs and their effects that it is impossible to feel bad on MDMA. X, probably. I don't like speedy things. Some people love them. They heighten my anxiety. But my experience with some really good (not totally untampered with, mind you, but I knew my sources well) molly was incredible. I was anxious up until taking it, but that ended in about a minute and a half. It was like falling into divine comfort. Not only is everything beautiful, fascinating, and wonderfully sensational, but I felt such love and openness toward everyone. [Note, I was in a controlled environment. No one should ever try something for the first time in a place or with people who feel unsafe to the first-time user.] I was with people I really love and trust. We had some great, heartfelt conversations. I disclosed my childhood abuse to one of my friends (others knew), but there was no fear. It was cathartic, relieving. He shed a single tear for me, but that is as far as he or the drug would allow. It was impossible to fall into sadness. Life was beautiful and there for me to embrace. Everything feels so vivid and pleasing. Touching other people was warm, wonderful, easy.
That said, I have had the reaction that Aine had with a drug experience [lasting appreciation for life and its beauty], but certainly not with this drug. Aine said that her high lasted a long time, though. Molly usually lasts for about three hours. NO good. VERY addictive. I did not like that aspect. My come down wasn't harsh, but it was a little sad. I felt good the next day except for jaw tension. By the way, you will be sore after taking something like X or MDMA because you usually expend more energy than you think. Your muscles tense, and depending on the mix you got, you may have the urge to do physical things, like running. I tried to go to sleep before I was totally down and felt like I could have ran a few miles and feel great. [Also, just another in-case-you-will-do-this-no-matter-what, carefully regulating your water and electrolytes is important. Gatorade will replace electrolytes, but you must still be careful about dehydrating or water poisoning. I regulated by not allowing myself more than a glass of water at a time, taking about 30-60min breaks between but no longer than an hour before another glass.]
That was my experience. I personally hope this treatment will be available in my lifetime, because I'm sure it would be awesome for me at least. I do not advocate self-medication. I advocate pragmatic information in case people wish to employ their free will in opposition to empirical evidence.
But, come on man. You can tell someone that something is bad for them a million times. It does not mean that they will not make the opposite decision. My opinion is that self-medication is never the answer to complicated problems like PTSD. The temporary alleviation of symptoms afforded to us by drugs of all kinds (cigarettes, alcohol, caffeine, lexapro, ambien, tylenol, whatever) is not healing, it is temporary alleviation of symptoms.
Having said that, in case you do decide to turn to street drugs, you should be well informed, and I believe that aine sharing her experience was a valuable start.
Ecstasy is NOT MDMA. Ecstasy usually has no MDMA whatsoever in it unless you are living near a border that admits pure drugs, which is hard to judge if you aren't tapped into the culture already, particularly with 'designer drugs,' so assume that anything called X is a cocktail of uppers and downers. X is designed as a party drug, and it is usually demographic-specific when it's sold in or around clubs: girls usually get things with downers, serotonin-centered drugs, ect, and guys usually get speedy mixes. It's a dangerous game.
It is impossible to find uncut MDMA in the USA without having some kind of hospital or university connection, or close friendship with a ballsy chemist. It will always have something in it. This could be anything from rat poison to meth to coke and so on. BUT the street name for what is supposed to be pure MDMA is Molly. Aine was incredibly lucky to have access to something that was completely untampered with.
Having gotten that information out of the way, I will share my knowledge and experience.
I have no idea what anthony is referencing about re-traumatizing and 'tripping out.' I respect anthony and his research, but I was told by a neurologist teaching a bio/psych class about drugs and their effects that it is impossible to feel bad on MDMA. X, probably. I don't like speedy things. Some people love them. They heighten my anxiety. But my experience with some really good (not totally untampered with, mind you, but I knew my sources well) molly was incredible. I was anxious up until taking it, but that ended in about a minute and a half. It was like falling into divine comfort. Not only is everything beautiful, fascinating, and wonderfully sensational, but I felt such love and openness toward everyone. [Note, I was in a controlled environment. No one should ever try something for the first time in a place or with people who feel unsafe to the first-time user.] I was with people I really love and trust. We had some great, heartfelt conversations. I disclosed my childhood abuse to one of my friends (others knew), but there was no fear. It was cathartic, relieving. He shed a single tear for me, but that is as far as he or the drug would allow. It was impossible to fall into sadness. Life was beautiful and there for me to embrace. Everything feels so vivid and pleasing. Touching other people was warm, wonderful, easy.
That said, I have had the reaction that Aine had with a drug experience [lasting appreciation for life and its beauty], but certainly not with this drug. Aine said that her high lasted a long time, though. Molly usually lasts for about three hours. NO good. VERY addictive. I did not like that aspect. My come down wasn't harsh, but it was a little sad. I felt good the next day except for jaw tension. By the way, you will be sore after taking something like X or MDMA because you usually expend more energy than you think. Your muscles tense, and depending on the mix you got, you may have the urge to do physical things, like running. I tried to go to sleep before I was totally down and felt like I could have ran a few miles and feel great. [Also, just another in-case-you-will-do-this-no-matter-what, carefully regulating your water and electrolytes is important. Gatorade will replace electrolytes, but you must still be careful about dehydrating or water poisoning. I regulated by not allowing myself more than a glass of water at a time, taking about 30-60min breaks between but no longer than an hour before another glass.]
That was my experience. I personally hope this treatment will be available in my lifetime, because I'm sure it would be awesome for me at least. I do not advocate self-medication. I advocate pragmatic information in case people wish to employ their free will in opposition to empirical evidence.
- Status
Similar posts
Donation drives
Trending content
-
-
What Are You Feeling Today? Not Thinking, Rather Feeling! Can You Identify Yours?
- goingonhope
Comments: 34K -
-
-
-
Latest posts
-
-
-
What Are You Feeling Today? Not Thinking, Rather Feeling! Can You Identify Yours?
- Latest: Seraphine fatal
-
