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The advantages/disadvantages of service dogs.
- Post starter Barberian
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What type of course (puppy, CGC, Novice, etc)? Most local training classes suck - they aren't anything like the real thing. I started out that way too... had no idea the difference until I started working in real obedience. Most classes are such a money stealer, ha ha.
You'll definitely like that book - it is the perfect "how to" for obedience training competitively if I had to pick one, which is key to any dog training. Besides that, check out Bow Wow Flix - It is like Netflix but for dogs. AWESOME resource.
Another must-have book for training puppies is The Building Blocks for Performance.
You'll definitely like that book - it is the perfect "how to" for obedience training competitively if I had to pick one, which is key to any dog training. Besides that, check out Bow Wow Flix - It is like Netflix but for dogs. AWESOME resource.
Another must-have book for training puppies is The Building Blocks for Performance.
Usually a beginner obedience class. Though I have found that the lessons done by the obedience clubs to be more usefully then ones at the pet stores. I have found a copy of the book you suggested on Amazon and I can't wait to read it. Thanks for the referral. :)
DharmaGirl
VIP Member
Bad day for my dog. Really, really bad for me. I use my dog at home. She checks the house, goes and gets my renter if I have a problem, she wakes me from nightmares and lies pressing up to me until I go back to sleep, she circles to keep people from getting too close on our walks but she always has had her sister with her since I don't take her "out" with me.
I stupidly decided to take her to therapy with me with my therapist's permission. She was panicked in the car without her sister. We were stuck in traffic, so a 40 minute drive took 1 1/2 hours. We were late for the appt. I opened the door for her and she left without me. I stood there and when she almost reached the road she looked back as if to say, "Oh, where'd you go?" She came running back but I was freaked. I decided not to put her backpack on (I got that instead of a vest so she could carry her drool towels and water bottle) and she just didn't relax. She has NEVER been like this. By the time I got to the waiting room I was having a panic attack. My therapist took us back and Nugget was just stressed the whole time. At the end I put on her backpack and she settled right down. She circled when my therapist got too close, and heeled all the way out to the car.
I have to take her out alone a little bit every day. I can't bring 2 mastiffs to therapy. I really wanted her there to help but not anytime soon. She usually responds to my panic by sitting next to me and doing the lean. Oh well, live and learn.
I stupidly decided to take her to therapy with me with my therapist's permission. She was panicked in the car without her sister. We were stuck in traffic, so a 40 minute drive took 1 1/2 hours. We were late for the appt. I opened the door for her and she left without me. I stood there and when she almost reached the road she looked back as if to say, "Oh, where'd you go?" She came running back but I was freaked. I decided not to put her backpack on (I got that instead of a vest so she could carry her drool towels and water bottle) and she just didn't relax. She has NEVER been like this. By the time I got to the waiting room I was having a panic attack. My therapist took us back and Nugget was just stressed the whole time. At the end I put on her backpack and she settled right down. She circled when my therapist got too close, and heeled all the way out to the car.
I have to take her out alone a little bit every day. I can't bring 2 mastiffs to therapy. I really wanted her there to help but not anytime soon. She usually responds to my panic by sitting next to me and doing the lean. Oh well, live and learn.
- Post starter
- #54
Monster, maybe just a short drive around the neighborhood, or to a park to start off. A trip without a destination or expectation then work your way up in complexity and expectations?
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The last few weeks has been ok as far as training, but she is becoming more "spunky" or "willful". I'm trying to do the non-dominant training I posted about above, but not sure if it's working.
I took my dog to IHOP (International House of Pancakes) yesterday. It was my wife's birthday dinner with some family. Sequoia wouldn't settle down, kept licking the carpet, sniffing for food crumbs, etc. She is still a puppy, but she has never behaved this poorly before. I took her back out to the truck and left her there alone for about 20 min. Then I brought her back in. She was still interested in a lot of things she shouldn't have been, but I put her on the chair next to me this time. She settled right down after about 5 min. and went to sleep. Her poor behavior was stressing me out, that and the abundance of noisy people. One of the things that stresses me is I don't want to give SD's a bad name or upset people who are just trying to eat a meal.
I will have to do some more basic training around food before I take her to a restaurant again. I had done some, which at home seemed to work, but I guess not enough with all the other distractions. In the past I carried her in, and sat her on the seat next to me. This time I walked her in and had her sit on the floor by my feet at first.
I know being a "in training" SD, things won't always go as planned, but yesterday made me really wonder if she and I are cut out for this. I will keep working, even harder than before, but it makes me wonder. She started out so well, but has become a "wild" teenager this last week or two. Well, not that wild, just more willful. She is going to be "fixed" in a month or so, maybe that might settle her down some. She is 5 months old now.
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The last few weeks has been ok as far as training, but she is becoming more "spunky" or "willful". I'm trying to do the non-dominant training I posted about above, but not sure if it's working.
I took my dog to IHOP (International House of Pancakes) yesterday. It was my wife's birthday dinner with some family. Sequoia wouldn't settle down, kept licking the carpet, sniffing for food crumbs, etc. She is still a puppy, but she has never behaved this poorly before. I took her back out to the truck and left her there alone for about 20 min. Then I brought her back in. She was still interested in a lot of things she shouldn't have been, but I put her on the chair next to me this time. She settled right down after about 5 min. and went to sleep. Her poor behavior was stressing me out, that and the abundance of noisy people. One of the things that stresses me is I don't want to give SD's a bad name or upset people who are just trying to eat a meal.
I will have to do some more basic training around food before I take her to a restaurant again. I had done some, which at home seemed to work, but I guess not enough with all the other distractions. In the past I carried her in, and sat her on the seat next to me. This time I walked her in and had her sit on the floor by my feet at first.
I know being a "in training" SD, things won't always go as planned, but yesterday made me really wonder if she and I are cut out for this. I will keep working, even harder than before, but it makes me wonder. She started out so well, but has become a "wild" teenager this last week or two. Well, not that wild, just more willful. She is going to be "fixed" in a month or so, maybe that might settle her down some. She is 5 months old now.
^ She is a puppy. This is going to happen. My dog was total destruction until he got out of his teenage years. Everyone was on the edge with him. My other dogs, I obtained as adults and skipped the teen years. That is why people tend to get older dogs, to leave the teen years to someone else who really knows puppies.... They are worse than babies sometimes and in someways.
Read some books about puppy training, such as Building Blocks For Performance . What current methods are you using? What are you training her to do? What have you done with her so far? What age did you get her?
Good luck to you. It will work out with some hard work, getting her spayed, and 24/7 training.
Read some books about puppy training, such as Building Blocks For Performance . What current methods are you using? What are you training her to do? What have you done with her so far? What age did you get her?
Good luck to you. It will work out with some hard work, getting her spayed, and 24/7 training.
- Post starter
- #56
I got her at 7 weeks old. I didn't want to get her so young, but the previous owner was under pressure to get rid of her pups and was going to do it whether or not I took her. She is 5 months old today.
She is still young so I'm keeping the training simple for now. I've slowly increased the complexity as she has gotten older, and plan on doing so more in the future. I've scoured the internet for good ideas, training methods, and come up with ad-hoc training goals/methods. I'm 47 and have had dogs almost all my life. They always had the basics. This is the first time I've done intensive training. I would get a professionally trained dog, but I can't even come close to the $$ needed. I can't afford any books at the moment.
I'm training her for now on some basics. I'm pre-caffeine and didn't sleep well at all, so not thinking to well yet. I can't remember most of the command names, and I'm having trouble concentrating from anxiety too. So far all the commands are verbal. This reminded me I need to start working on hand signals for each command.
1. Truly the basics - Sit, stay, no inappropriate sniffing, walking beside me without pulling on leash, ignoring distractions like food, other dogs waste, potty breaks when out in public on command, not "wherever".
2. "Grounding" command, where if I'm siting and start to go into a panic or anxiety attack she leans on my chest and/or puts her feet on my chest and licks my face. If I'm standing, she will lean against my leg and push into it. Grounding = "stay in the here and now".
3. Positional training for being in public. Sit at the 0, 90, 180, 270 degree spots to sit between me and someone else. Will morph to the general degree between me and someone near me with another command. Right now I just want her to get the basics of where I want her to sit.
4. A circling command to circle me repeatedly about 2 feet away to keep crowds at a distance.
5. Working with her on playground equipment (at night) to build her confidence.
Future training plan.
1. Alert wife I'm in need of assistance - panic attack, etc.
2. Provide a distraction that I can use to claim to need to take her on a potty break or other activity to get out of an uncomfortable or triggering situation. The command will need to be subtle, and probably just a simple motion.
3. Provide a reality check - Is it real or in my mind? Investigate area of concern.
4. Cover me - Watch for persons and alert me if they approach me or are near me when I freeze up or shut down. Freeze up and shut down are different to me. Freeze is I'm unable to do anything, shut down is I close my eyes, tilt my head down and just stop doing anything to prevent overload or a freeze. Freeze is pretty much uncontrollable, shut down is marginally controllable, but with high costs to my stress cup.
5. A distance command for her to keep between me and others who stand or pass close to me. This will be a "standing order" that shouldn't need a command, but will be an automatic behavior. The command will be a back up if she is distracted. This will be similar to #3 in the current training, but she will be standing with her backside to the stranger.
There are a few other things I will train her for, but can't remember right now. I need to finish making my list of training, I keep forgetting stuff.
Just a thought, I've found that for my dogs, teaching hand signals first and reinforcing with a reward and then teaching the verbal signal after they are solid with the physical command works best. It helps teach them to look at you and pay attention. Having a pocketful of training treats is a big plus too! ;)
DharmaGirl
VIP Member
Barberian, maybe it was just a bad week for SDs, lol. I'm going to take Nugget to Petco, and I will probably continue to take her to therapy but first put on her backpack. I think she will get used to it faster since my therapist likes dogs, and she is pretty smart. Of course if she doesn't settle down I will back off.
- Post starter
- #60
Those with service dogs have probably had a similar incident. I am surprised at the lack of training most managers receive on critical issues like ADA, and discrimination regardless of who is being discriminated against.
I go out of my way to make sure Sequoia is well behaved when in a public building. If she is not behaving, I take her outside. If she won't behave to a service dog's standard, we stay outside. I did it once today at a Target store (like Wal-Mart, just a little more classy and expensive). She was sniffing too much, bouncing up and down trying to play with me, and kept pulling on the leash. About 1/2 hour out of a full day of good behavior.
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Today my wife and I, and Sequoia went to a McDonald's for a snack after running around most of the afternoon visiting and shopping. We went in, I went to a booth as usual and my wife ordered. I don't do cashier transactions or stay at the counter unless I have to. Aside from pulling on the leash a little more than I wanted, Sequoia was quiet and well behaved. She started to take a nap shortly after I sat down. After my wife came to the table with the food and an empty cup, I took the cup to the soda machine. I left Sequoia at the table with my wife because she was napping already. As I approached the machine the manager stopped me and told me I couldn't have a pet in the restaurant. I told him it was a service dog in training. He asked me for a certification or proof it was a service dog. I said I don't have to provide such proof according to the California ADA laws in regards to service dogs and service dogs in training. He said without proof I had to leave. I told him I was staying to finish my meal, he was more than welcome to call the police if he felt he needed to do so. Normally I am willing to work with people when this happens. Today I was not in the mood to deal with an aggressive ignorant manager. He didn't show any indication he was willing to believe me. I was in a lot of pain. The way he approached me and spoke to me was unprofessional. I was very anxious because it is Mothers Day, and I was trying to be on my best behavior with my wife and the general public (this takes a lot of effort because I get angry at idiots in public very quickly. The truly low I.Q. I don't have a problem, it's the willfully ignorant that piss me off very quickly. Then I have to "play nice" with my wife while pissed off at other people).
[pretty much a repeat of the paragraph above just a lot more of the typical questions]
Well, he called the police and one showed up about 15 min later. At first the police officer was aggressive, tried to be intimidating, and somewhat confrontational. He did the usual "wants and warrants" call after I had to give my name and D.O.B. . After the first few questions, when it didn't look like it was going to go well, I took out my camera and told him I was going to record the conversation, which I then did. The officer asked me for certification she was a service dog, I told him I don't have to have any certification. He asked me where is her service vest and patches, I told him those too are not required. After a couple min more of interrogation, he softened up and started to treat me with some respect. He realized I was legit I believe. I told him my conditions once he started being nice, and just because I don't have a visible disability, doesn't mean I'm not disabled. At the end of the interview, I asked him to tell the manager the same thing.
The police officer then went and told the manager that I had a legal right to be there with my service dog in training. My wife said she overheard him telling the manager what I asked him to say. I was on the verge of crying, close to shorting out and freezing. It took me around an hour before I felt it was safe to leave and drive. My mind was not working very well at all. It is still not working very well, but I can at least function for the most part.
If I wanted to be a real ass, I could have left the restaurant when the manager told me to, after informing him it was a service dog in training and the state ADA law. Then I could have called the police and charged him with a crime under the state ADA laws. He wasn't listening to or believing me, and I was in no condition to try and change his mind or educate him. I decided it was best to let a police officer educate him, someone he HAD to listen to or face criminal charges. Harsh I know, but sometimes ya gota do, what'cha gota do. [sic]
I go out of my way to make sure Sequoia is well behaved when in a public building. If she is not behaving, I take her outside. If she won't behave to a service dog's standard, we stay outside. I did it once today at a Target store (like Wal-Mart, just a little more classy and expensive). She was sniffing too much, bouncing up and down trying to play with me, and kept pulling on the leash. About 1/2 hour out of a full day of good behavior.
----------------
Today my wife and I, and Sequoia went to a McDonald's for a snack after running around most of the afternoon visiting and shopping. We went in, I went to a booth as usual and my wife ordered. I don't do cashier transactions or stay at the counter unless I have to. Aside from pulling on the leash a little more than I wanted, Sequoia was quiet and well behaved. She started to take a nap shortly after I sat down. After my wife came to the table with the food and an empty cup, I took the cup to the soda machine. I left Sequoia at the table with my wife because she was napping already. As I approached the machine the manager stopped me and told me I couldn't have a pet in the restaurant. I told him it was a service dog in training. He asked me for a certification or proof it was a service dog. I said I don't have to provide such proof according to the California ADA laws in regards to service dogs and service dogs in training. He said without proof I had to leave. I told him I was staying to finish my meal, he was more than welcome to call the police if he felt he needed to do so. Normally I am willing to work with people when this happens. Today I was not in the mood to deal with an aggressive ignorant manager. He didn't show any indication he was willing to believe me. I was in a lot of pain. The way he approached me and spoke to me was unprofessional. I was very anxious because it is Mothers Day, and I was trying to be on my best behavior with my wife and the general public (this takes a lot of effort because I get angry at idiots in public very quickly. The truly low I.Q. I don't have a problem, it's the willfully ignorant that piss me off very quickly. Then I have to "play nice" with my wife while pissed off at other people).
[pretty much a repeat of the paragraph above just a lot more of the typical questions]
Well, he called the police and one showed up about 15 min later. At first the police officer was aggressive, tried to be intimidating, and somewhat confrontational. He did the usual "wants and warrants" call after I had to give my name and D.O.B. . After the first few questions, when it didn't look like it was going to go well, I took out my camera and told him I was going to record the conversation, which I then did. The officer asked me for certification she was a service dog, I told him I don't have to have any certification. He asked me where is her service vest and patches, I told him those too are not required. After a couple min more of interrogation, he softened up and started to treat me with some respect. He realized I was legit I believe. I told him my conditions once he started being nice, and just because I don't have a visible disability, doesn't mean I'm not disabled. At the end of the interview, I asked him to tell the manager the same thing.
The police officer then went and told the manager that I had a legal right to be there with my service dog in training. My wife said she overheard him telling the manager what I asked him to say. I was on the verge of crying, close to shorting out and freezing. It took me around an hour before I felt it was safe to leave and drive. My mind was not working very well at all. It is still not working very well, but I can at least function for the most part.
If I wanted to be a real ass, I could have left the restaurant when the manager told me to, after informing him it was a service dog in training and the state ADA law. Then I could have called the police and charged him with a crime under the state ADA laws. He wasn't listening to or believing me, and I was in no condition to try and change his mind or educate him. I decided it was best to let a police officer educate him, someone he HAD to listen to or face criminal charges. Harsh I know, but sometimes ya gota do, what'cha gota do. [sic]
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