Relationship Husband Pulled Gun, Threatened Suicide During Argument.

[Needadvicequickly]

I'm looking for advice as the spouse of a man with severe PTSD. He has been diagnosed through the VA, seeks "regular" VA counseling (I.e. once a month to retain disability benefits).

Over the course of our relationship, dating through a couple years of marriage, his overall physical and mental health has deteriorated. Several weeks ago, he announced he planned on killing himself. He has since retracted that statement, but I walked into the bathroom one day to find him with a belt around his neck.

Last night, we had an argument (pretty benign, it was about splitting household chores), that escalated to the point of him loading a gun and threatening to kill himself. I immediately left the room and started to call the cops. I hesitated because I knew it would be the point of no return, once that happens it's on his record and could jeopardize his employment. When I calmed down and re-entered the room, he had a rifle and asked if I called the cops. I told him no, and he said if a cop showed up he will shoot. He kept repeating he "wasn't crazy" and was "prepared to die" to prove a point (about chores).

I'm scared to death and shaken. He refuses counseling and doesn't see the danger in his actions citing, "I never pulled a gun ON YOU".

I cannot find much online for this behavior or how to handle it. I'm afraid my husband is becoming too dangerous to have a future with. His anger often results in verbal abuse ( which he admits), throwing objects, putting holes in walls, slamming objects such as remotes, computers, cell phones, etc. He has never hit me, but that doesn't mean his behavior isn't bad.

Sorry this is so long. Any advice or insight is appreciated.

 

[Justmehere]

He is clearly a danger to himself since he not only has suicidal plans but is acting out plans to kill himself, and on a chronic basis. You need to call a suicide hotline NOW and tell them what is going on and they will get help for him. I had a male roommate do the same kinds of behaviors and one day he succeeded. We tried to get him help, in the ways Ide scribe but the last time the police were delayed and found him dead. Please call the suicide hotline and they can help. Your husband will not like being hospitalized, and it is not something anyone does very lightly. but he is giving all the warning signs of his intent. Right now, his life is in danger and you need to call them. I hate hospitals. They sometimes are very unhelpful - however, this situation is way past all the lines of what is ok and he is sending every single warning sign of someone who is severely suicidal and likely to act on it. A hospital will keep him alive and start to give him some support and it will give you some space to reconsider what you need to do.

As far as a future, the physical aggression he is displaying is showing that he is very out of control. If he isn't willing to go to VA or private treatment, or even if he is, a separation would be reasonable to consider. However, right now, please call a suicide hotline right now, describe the behaviors you are seeing and they will get him into a hospital.

I would highly recommend you find a therapist for YOU. Watching someone actively try to kill themselves under the influence of PTSD is a form of TRAUMA. His aggressive behaviors only make the possible development of PTSD for you the more likely. Please seek out some counseling ASAP for you as you endure this very difficult season. I suggest most supporters get their own support, and in this case, I believe it is imperative for your own mental health and wellbeing.

 

[scout86]

You're probably going to get better replies than mine (I hope) but here's mine.

Your husband is suffering from a serious disorder that CAN kill him. What would you do if he was having a heart attack but was in denial and didn't want to go to the hospital?

Nearly two years ago now, I was debating between suicide and therapy. I wasn't going to threaten, I wasn't going to give anyone any warning, I was just going to kill myself. Or, maybe not. Maybe I'd give therapy a try. I found a therapist. Wrote a bunch of emails I didn't send. Tried to remember where I'd put the handgun for safe keeping. (Couldn't find it, as luck would have it!). One day, I impulsively hit "send" instead of deleting an email. The guy who became my therapist replied almost right away. He said, "If what you have is actually PTSD, I can tell you this. It affects more aspects of your life than you realize and it won't go away by itself. I have an opening day after tomorrow, if you want to come in and talk." (I did. Good choice too. The gun turned out to be in a little used drawer in the desk I was sitting at, typing the email.)

It helped me to have an "expert" flat out tell me I wasn't going to be able to "fix" this on my own. Might help your husband too, coming from the right person. In either case, this is a real thing and his life is as much in danger as if he was having a major heart attack or in a diabetic coma. Possibly so is yours. This is an emergency and his career is the least of his worries. He won't have much of a career if he's dead.

If you need more than that to convince you (not saying that you do!), I lost one of my best friends to suicide last spring and he had a history much like your husband. Right down to the visits to the VA. I'd literally give my right arm if I could go back and make that situation turn out differently.

 

[Needadvicequickly]

Thank you so much for the replies. Unfortunately, he is vehemently against therapy or intervention and now says he "isn't suicidal anymore". Having never been suicidal myself or clinically depressed, I'm unsure of how someone can be suicidal one day and not the next.

My large concern is his cavalier behavior towards bringing a firearm into an argument. This is the second time he has done this in our relationship, both times threatening to kill himself. It's not like he just held it up to his head, He loaded a round and put it straight to his temple while screaming at methat he was going to pull the trigger and he "dares" me to do the same or follow suit.

 

[Justmehere]

My now dead roommate did the same thing. he would make severe suicidal gestures, and then say he was fine. Please call the suicide crisis line and they can better evaluate what to do that any of us can. He behaviors are severe. Someone who does what he has done is not someone who is suddenly not in severe need of support the next day. He is either lying to say he is not suicidal or he is in denial so that no one will really stop him. Maybe he is ok right this moment, but the pattern will continue without intervention. Please call the suicide hotline before he re-escalates again and does pull that trigger on himself. His behavior actually does follow a pattern and without intervention, this pattern of behavior, especially in men, too often end in death. Of course he doesn't want help. He wants to die. The folks with suicide hotlines are set up to help people just like him who don't want help but need help to stay alive. Please call them.

 

[Justmehere]

Also, do you have any friends or family you can stay with for a little while? I would call them and then pack a pag and go stay with them for a few days for your own safety. I know he hasn't hurt you, but with PTSD, when people get treatment, things tend to get worse before they get better. This is a very serious situation and it would be reasonable to take some steps to keep you safe while they get him into treatment.

When I was acting on suicidal thoughts, I didn't want help either but it was a darn good thing someone called and sent help and got me to a hospital anyhow. I told everyone I was fine, not suicidal anymore and thankfully they didn't believe me. I would be dead myself if that had not happened.

Again, I am not a big supporter of hospitalization if it can be avoided, but all the warning signs and grounds are there and there really isn't a better option for him right now. Let the professionals step in and figure out what is best for him in this time where he is unable to consistently keep himself safe.

 

[nursenurse]

It only takes a fraction of a second of impulsivity where he can turn the gun on you. At the very least he is using this as emotional blackmail. Inside is a man who desperately needs help, however he can get it.

I think the suicide hotline is a good idea, but honestly, someone holding a loaded gun to his head is not to be trifled with. Where I live he would be admitted involuntarily to hospital. That status would be reviewed every three days until such time that he is deemed to not be a threat to himself or others.

Here is the thing. Whatever happens, you have been sucked into the vortex of his suicidal ideation, and no matter what the outcome, you will likely feel guilty over something that really has nothing to do with you, and everything to do with him. I think it is high time that you get help for yourself before you are swallowed by this.

And I think that you physically need to get out. A loaded gun and threats are no way to live for you. He is going to do what he wants to do regardless of your presence. Anyone willing to shoot himself over the division of labour is clearly out of control. The verbal abuse is bad enough, but he is also emotionally abusing you by levying these threats on himself. I would call a woman's shelter as well. You may love him, but this goes beyond what anyone should put up with in a relationship. You need distance and perspective. He needs a hospital stay.

I hope all goes well. He isn't going to get better on his own. There will be a next time. This is well beyond PTSD.

 

[Kefira]

As someone who has been suicidal for long periods of time I agree that it's highly unlikely after that sort of severe gesture that he's not in need of support. He may be in denial, he may be unable to see how severe his actions are. Either way, he needs help and if he won't seek it on his own you're going to have to be the one to ensure he gets the treatment he needs. Calling a hotline or a local service is a good start. And believe me, they're used to dealing with people who would rather die than admit they need help. There are ways to handle this and help him start to recover while mitigating the risk to him in the process.

I also second finding therapy for yourself. This is trauma and this is abuse, whether it results from his own disorder or not. It's important that you take care of yourself, and that if the abusive behaviors escalate (whether peaks like this or overall) that you make clear decisions about at what point you need to remove yourself from the environment for your own safety. Particularly since he has access to a weapon and has no problem threatening his own life I would advise looking at plans to get out of these situations safely. A little forethought can go a long way.

Also, my personal advice as someone who has been in a situation where my significant other threatened suicide often during arguments is to call the police next time. Preferably on your way out of the home to a safe location. I know you want to help him, but it's not acceptable behavior and you have to keep yourself out of harms way as well.

 

[Needadvicequickly]

I have family near by but would prefer to keep them out of this if it does turn violent. The fact that he decided to assume the role of a sniper if I had called the cops let's me know I don't want to put my parents or siblings in harm's way. I'm definitely removing all the guns/weapons this week when he isn't home as a precaution.
I seriously cannot believe this is happening.

 

[Needadvicequickly]

Also, after these episodes he completely acts like nothing ever happened. We go to dinner, watch tv, etc... and it's like 2 hours before never took place. He sleeps like a rock while I toss all night wondering what to do. He does take several medications: anti anxiety and a mood stabilizer, but recently went off anti depressants at the instruction of his DR. He claimed they upset his IBS flare ups.
Also, he has been heavily dependant on alcohol as of late. Within the past 2-3 months it has progressed from a drink every night after work ( not a huge deal to me) to finishing a BOTTLE of whiskey in 1-2 days.

 

[scout86]

What you've described is a REALLY ugly combination. This is really and truly an emergency, no matter what he says. (For the record, my T asked me to promise I'd call him before I ever actually killed myself. I told him that I wouldn't lie to him, so I wouldn't make that promise. But, between you & me, if I was serious, I'd also lie to him. What your husband says right now doesn't count nearly as much as what he does.)

Here's another thought. I don't know where you live and I don't know how good the VA is where your husband has been going. You could try calling them, or going in yourself, and tell them what you've told us. Around here, the VA is really pretty good. Sometimes they actually call my T and send him out to talk people off ledges. He's good at it. Could be the local system where you're at is equally good. It's worth a chance. Anyone sent to talk to or deal with your husband needs to know about the weapons and the threats. This is potentially life and death for them too. This situation is WAY above the pay grade of amateurs. You really need to get yourself out of the line of fire and turn it over to the best professionals you can find, ASAP.

Best wishes and prayers.

 

[joeylittle]

He does take several medications: anti anxiety and a mood stabilizer, but recently went off anti depressants at the instruction of his DR.

My large concern is his cavalier behavior towards bringing a firearm into an argument. This is the second time he has done this in our relationship, both times threatening to kill himself. It's not like he just held it up to his head, He loaded a round and put it straight to his temple while screaming at methat he was going to pull the trigger and he "dares" me to do the same or follow suit.

He needs to be admitted to the hospital. The recent change in meds (going off them can have as dangerous an effect as going on them), the fact that he's done the gun maneuver twice (once is enough, twice is beyond dangerous, for you and him) - and this:

Several weeks ago, he announced he planned on killing himself. He has since retracted that statement, but I walked into the bathroom one day to find him with a belt around his neck.

Was an attempt. A solid attempt. Like other posters here, I've been suicidal and I've had suicidal thoughts - those are two vastly different experiences. By actually acquiring his method and beginning an action, he is at best engaging in parasuicidal behavior and at worst he is attempting suicide.

He is clearly under an enormous amount of mental pressure. I can promise you: he's not thinking straight. Suicide is about looking for relief. He is looking for relief. What he doesn't know is, that relief requires medical intervention, and will also require therapy. It's not about his preferences anymore when it comes to that.

Now, you sound amazing. And you aren't actually responsible for anything but your own safety, physical and emotional. But you are clearly still engaged in this relationship.

Clearing the house of guns, knives (even kitchen knives), belts, rope, bleach and other chemicals is a good idea. You should follow that immediately with a call to the most trusted medical professional you know and ask for information about whether they can connect you directly with someone in psychiatry at the hospital. Or you can call that department directly - it's actually often called "behavioral health" or "mood disorders" or sometimes, actually "psychiatric disorders."

Call them and tell them the facts that you've told us, ask to arrange a pickup for involuntary evaluation because he is clearly a danger to himself and others. That language is the kind of gold standard of hospital admittance, especially involuntary.

In your state, they may not be able to come and get him until he does something else. In that case, I think all you can do is wait for him to flip out again. Which he will likely do when he sees that his guns are gone. It's probably not going to take much, from the way you describe him. Don't even think about it - call 911 and order an ambulance.

This is not actually your responsibility. If you just want to disappear today and try and help him from a distance, that's OK. Go to a hotel and don't tell him where. Inform your family to all be on the lookout and tell them to call 911 at the first sign of aggression from him.

I'm so sorry this is happening. And I second the suggestions that you are probably going to need some therapy after this.