Other Agoraphobia -- exposure doesn't help

[Chava]

I see I'm jumping into an old post, but...anyway...for whatever it's worth relating to the topic:

He's constantly saying, "Get out more! Do it; just do it! Come on!!" And then he gives me Zen confidence boosters and we talk abut my symptoms, but I need more.

I had therapist nudging me to get out and be more social and have more fun. Not helpful. I didn't have the right tools or even the care of will. All the unprocessed stuff, as mentioned above. I don't have terrible agoraphobia, but I do not enjoy leaving my house and I am very avoidant of social activities. I've also turned away from stores when too many people are present or certain workers who give me heebie-jeebies for no clear reason. It's like I just don't have the energy and feel it easier to try another day. I've also had panic attacks, but have learned how to manage when first noticing symptoms and now rarely have panic attacks, or they are incredibly mild.

I think I know the root of my problem, though. I can't control anything outside. Inside, I have a modicum of control. I don't like feeling out of control. I get the deer in the headlights feeling constantly. I feel derealized 24/7.

That makes sense. In a case like this, it would make more sense to work on the "exposure" part in ways that also combine a sense of control, or your awareness of some control, like choosing a quiet route and going for a walk. Go shopping but allow yourself to not make eye contact if you are aware that helps. I work on keeping my head up and making eye contact in more predictable situations, like at work. I'm pretty well aware of my own areas of discomfort and where and when I can challenge my responses and behaviors.

Just getting out doesn't really solve anything without tools to also feel some sense of control. It would be worth exploring that, as well as (obviously) the underlying issues. When I was having panic attacks it usually helped to know my possible out or escape route. Then I found I didn't necessarily need it, but it gave me that sense of control, I suppose, and back up plan to keep me feeling somewhat more safe.

 

[scout86]

I feel much better knowing that someone made an effort to listen and encourage.

There are a LOT of people here who'd be willing to listen. It might help you if you can keep talking about this stuff. There's no reason for you to feel totally alone. There are an amazing number of people here who've been in marriages like yours. And quite an assortment of feelings on whether or not they were up to the challenge of facing life without that "partner". At least you have company.

The avatar is actually one I use on another site and borrowed. On the other site, it's animated (and looks like what you might think of as a "mad cow"). It's animated on my profile page, I think.

I guess it's hard to show compassion to someone who has a flat effect.

It shouldn't be! I would expect at least professionals to know that what you see on the outside isn't always an accurate reflection of what's on the inside.

I see I'm jumping into an old post, but..

I guess it got revived! (I hadn't noticed the original date until you mentioned it.)

 

[lostforgottensoul]

I get that this is an old thread but since it was posted on recently I thought Id comment.

Im not diagnoised with Agoraphobia but when I google it, its not necessarly the fear of leaving the house but more of just a fear of people etc.

I have an extreme fear of people, fear in a store, for example, that everyone is there to hurt me.

The one of two times I fully dissociated and have no memory of how I got from point A to point B was due to this.

My therapist (whom, at this point i see sorta as a stand in dad & talks to me about transference about every session which is rather annoying) has been forever trying to get me less isolated.

He thinks that if I try a park, less people, maybe a dog park since I own a pitbull and he makes me feel safer, and then work my way around more people, without my dog, and hopefully inside.

I work but do so in a cubicle, i go to stores alone but my anxiety is out of control and im running in, getting what i need and out and my stun gun in my purse is where i can grab it in a hurry.

Again, nothing ive done yet but since my fear is everyone is there to hurt me and it seems inside i have more fear than outside he thought a park or somewhere outside with less people to start would be better.

Not sure if the OP has be able to work on this since Dec '14 but thought id put thoughts on it.

 

[Knak]

There are a LOT of people here who'd be willing to listen. It might help you if you can keep talking abo...

How did you get so positive? It is very refreshing and I would like to be the same.

I fear being invisible and fear taking that chance but it is easier on this forum since many participants understand. Also years of being told to shut up, or just take the crap you're given and leave me alone or get more punishment tends to repress expression. It's hard to accept that it can affect a person's feelings so deeply and painfully with no end in sight. It also raises questions on why am I even alive.

The volatility from extreme sensitivity is not recognized in public discussions. People get uncomfortable and it feels like further rejection.

I saw the animation on your avatar, very cute.

 

[scout86]

How did you get so positive?

I'm going to have to think about the answer to that! LOL

Probably a combination of things. Things I haven't really thought about. I think part of it is, as a child, I was only valued for what I could do. My mom had some issues. I was supposed to be able to read what was going on with her and figure out how to "fix it". Although I was also supposed to be and do the wrong thing too. It helped, I think, to be positive. You never got any good attention for having any issues yourself, you know? So, there's that, part of it was and is a survival tool.

Part of it, I think, is that I tend to look at this whole PTSD thing kind of like being in a war. We're all in it together, to my way of thinking, and I want everyone to come out the other side in as good a shape as possible. They say a soldier isn't fighting for his or her country, but for the person on either side of them. I feel kind of like that about the people here.

I also kind of think I have to either put a positive spin on things or die. It's kind of that simple for me. (Probably not for everyone.) I think I have choices about how I look at things. I can chose to see the glass how ever I want. I chose half full. Choosing half empty doesn't help me or anyone else.

Also years of being told to shut up, or just take the crap you're given and leave me alone or get more punishment tends to repress expression.

When I graduated from high school and moved out of my parent's house, I found out there were people out in the wider world who actually seemed to think I was ok. That was kind of a surprise. LOL But, I liked it and decided "why would I go back?". Some of those people have even gotten to know me well enough to have a pretty good idea what I'm REALLY like and they STILL seem to think I"m ok. Go figure? There may not be a lot of people like that, but there are some. For everyone, I think there are some. It's hard to have a positive attitude when you're not around anyone who appreciates you. It's hard when you've never felt like anyone listened or cared. I think you've been around the wrong people most of your life. I hope you can find ways to change that!

The volatility from extreme sensitivity is not recognized in public discussions.

It IS recognized pretty well here though. One of the best things about this site, for me anyway, is that people here will actually tell you if they think you're wrong because they want to HELP, not out of meanness. I've seen a few exceptions to that since I joined, but none of them stayed around and other people stand up to them when they go too far.

 

[Knak]

On the matter of your husband not living much longer....... My ex died 5 years after the divorce. I had walked away, leaving him with most of what we owned.

3
It has been a while since this conversation but I want to talk to you specifically about leaving your husband. I don't see a way to contact you personally and it's not relevant to this thread so don't want to hijack it.
I changed my profile to avoid some problems but am trying to change it back to receiving feedback so I can speak to you.

 

[joeylittle]

If you need help with your profile settings, @Knak - you're welcome to post in the Help Desk

 

[lostforgottensoul]

plus living with a narcissistic husband.

I only feel safe outside with my husband and he is the one who can throw me into the deepest trauma with his gaslighting and desire to hurt me or just make me feel invisible or that he has to get away from me. I don't even acknowledge him to give him an opportunity to hurt me.

Im not sure if "only feeling feeling safe outside with my husband" but if he is that abusive, is it worth it?

I got a dog, a very sweet but protective pitbull to be exact, and he's the only thing that makes me feel safe outside. However, most breeds are protective of their owner...its just when someone sees I have a pitbull (though he loves everyone) they dont even try.

I also bought a tazor which is where I can grab it at all times, that's what makes me feel safe when I can't bring my dog.

Then i have to "tools" I need that makes me feel safe and can ease my way around people starting outside with a small amount of people and slowly increase the amount of people.

But I also know why people (not being outside exactly) scares me. I have a terror of people and when outside I fear someone jumping out of no where to hurt me.

If you dont know why it scares you then you wont be able to work on the negotive conginitions and negitive thoughts...so exposure therapy wont work as you are not working on the underlying issues but also being with someone that makes you feel worse about yourself, unsure if that will help either.

I alao advise looking for a trauma specialozed therapist as, in my opinion, its very hard to work on this stuff alone.

There are a ton of wonderful therapist. I happened on mine by accident and he couldnt be the best if I tried.

Just my 2 cents from my experience.

ETA:

Usually they wait for me to talk and I don't know what to say outside of complaining. I told one that my mother said she never held me, even to feed me she propped a bottle on a stuffed toy, and the response was "that's what they did back then".

Its not just something they did back then. A friend I had when I was 18 -23 ish, she did this. I wasnt thinking of him not being held more then I was worried that if he choked, no was there to help. Its def not a good way to feed a baby but as long as the baby is held and loved, in of itself isnt going to lead to later issues.

In a therpy session, they normally dont talk much and let you talk, but you also need to be open to doing things to change and better yourself on your own. Mine gives me homework which I try my best to always do and in the next session we talk about how it went.

Today my doctor wrote on my chart I had a flat effect and that hurt me because I see it as rejection being perceived as being hollow.

I guess it's hard to show compassion to someone who has a flat effect.

No its not, I have a flat affect due to being so seperated from my past. I think the trigger, feeling rejected & feeling like thats calling you hollow, which is isnt, is maybe what caused the issue. The therapist wasnt rejecting you or calling you hollow, they were just making an observation which is actually an important one.

I have an IQ over 140 on some tests.

IQ and IQ tests are over rated in my opinion and can't possibily measure how smart a person is. They're very flawed in my opinion.

I can't bear trying new therapists again who know less than I do or don't care enough to help. They are just people and are no more qualified than myself. At least I've studied my own conditions. I feel stuck and scared. In the past I've felt I needed to run away.

I would drop this thought.

I work in IT and I am forever talking to people saying "I studied IT and I know more than you" but have no clue how to change a homepage or what a browser is.

Forget what you know and just let the therapist do their job.

Again, just my 2, oh now 4, cents

 

[Liligirl]

I have been experiencing agoraphobia for six months now. I only just started leaving the house a few weeks ago, but only very short trips. I am so far from where you are right now. There is no way I could attend classes anywhere at any time. Thankfully I finished my university degree two years ago, before my recent trauma. I think you are doing remarkably well for an agoraphobe. You should be very proud of yourself that you even attempt all that you do. My therapist is the opposite of the 'exposure' theory. He has advised me to take it very slowly and not push myself to do something that freaks me out. "Why put yourself through all that pain?", he asked me. "Baby steps", he said. "Be kind to yourself." Before him, I had always been an advocate for exposure (previous history of panic disorder) but over the past six months, I have been forced to love and care for myself more than ever before. Part of that is knowing my limitations and respecting them. Not being so hard on myself. Somehow knowing that things won't be like this forever. I am re-entering the world on my own terms and for me, that seems to be helping. If you ever need to speak to someone about it, you're welcome to send me a message.

Oh....I've just noticed that you posted this some time ago. Apologies everyone..lol.

Nevertheless, if you are doing much better now, I would love to hear how you got there.