Relationship Am i naive??

[ByrnesT]

@scout86 i think you’re right. I show trust to my sufferer (or any partner I have ever had). If she was to screw up that trust & be unfaithful etc then my trust would be broken & I would be gone. Until she gives me solid reason to be suspicious tho then I will continue to show that faith. I can’t see how a relationship can really exist without that.

In fact for the first time in my life I have given fleeting thoughts to even lying to my sufferer on occasions just to avoid the inevitable fallout. I haven’t had any reason to lie out of any guilt or for any misdemeanours on my part, but purely because being up front & honest so far hasn’t worked out too well for me. I haven’t actually been dishonest with her but I find it unsettling that the thoughts are even creeping into my head; it’s never been who I am or who I want to be. And I know I’ll never give into that cos that would be death for me if I start having to be dishonest. I have even been honest with her about these feelings.

I feel I can get a grip on the deeper rooted trust issues she has based on her trauma far easier than I do her trust issues over me having relations of any sort with other females. I find it quite insulting & dangerously like she’s trying to isolate me from others.

 

[Sweetpea76]

Just don't let her make you pay for this over and over again. This would be a good place for a boundary.

"Nothing happened. You gave me your permission to have that woman stay. I did not lie about it. I am not a cheater, and I did not cheat. I will not answer to your jealousy anymore. I refuse to participate in this fiasco from here on out."

Just because she has a storm in her head doesn't mean she gets to pull you in there and make it your storm too. You can put an end to it.

 

[scout86]

I don't know at what point in her life your partner's trauma happened. If it was childhood, then she's probably not going to have changed. If it happened as an adult, then I wonder if her level of wanting control changed with the development of PTSD. I've been in a couple of relationships where my partner really wanted control. None of them had PTSD, they were just like that. I can see the logic of how PTSD might lead you to believe that "control" was something you needed to have too, now that someone (can't remember who to give credit to!) has explained their way of looking at things. But I wonder if your partner has a before & after with this? I guess there's the chance she will be willing to learn better ways of handling things, no matter what, but there are plenty of people out there who don't have PTSD and want to be controlling too.

 

[ByrnesT]

Just don't let her make you pay for this over and over again. This would be a good place for a bound...

Thank you @Sweetpea76 , you are absolutely right. I did try saying things very much to that effect. I guess the hardship I’m having is to not be pulled in after that tho, defending myself against the accusations that follow. It’s not that I get involved in the arguing & fighting, it’s that I make the mistake of giving her airtime by defending myself. I should know better & I’m really trying to learn now.

 

[ByrnesT]

I don't know at what point in her life your partner's trauma happened. If it was childhood, then she's...

@scout86 my sufferers trauma happened in childhood so don’t think there will be that “before” time as such for her. This is obviously what she has learnt to do from quite early on (that’s on the information that I do know, because I only know some of the details of her trauma, I think things started to change for her in her early teens).

She will openly admit to being controlling but that acceptance (like a lot of the things she can at times admit to) is never actually applied to the situations as they are happening (that’s the illness I know), & rarely even afterwards. And I think it’s the fact that she is constantly telling me that by me making any sort of point or disagreeing it is in fact me controlling her. She actually regularly tells me how I am doing all of the things that she is in fact doing to me. It really tests your sanity & your perspective on reality after a while!

 

[The Albatross]

Admission without initiating change or improvement is wearing on even normal relationships. Being untreated, she is unlikely to shift her perspectives. It is a sad fact that untreated PTSD comes with the pain of consequences and for many... until the pain of staying the same meets or exceeds the perceived pain or risk of change in habit/behavior... she is not likely to do so.

Dealing with someone who resists personal improvement, more beneficial relational attitudes and behaviors (in my old recovery circles) often leads to resentment, retaliation or abandonment. Thus for them it is a self fulfilling prophecy of sorts that feeds their maladaptive defensive living behaviors... because when a partner wears out and/or can no longer cope or manage... one of the three most often is exactly what happens.

It is sad to see people that are so invested in defensive coping that they are unable to accept/participate or reciprocate better relationships.

 

[ByrnesT]

Yes @The Albatross , the self fulfilling prophecy of it all is very difficult to witness. I recognised she was doing that from the moment we first met but back then I did not know exactly why or how deep the issues really lay. And being on the receiving end of that makes things so hard to manage. If I up & leave, she goes back to square one & you prove all of her fears about you right (I know that’s not the case but you know what I mean!). If I stay, she pushes me away to continue testing me. In the early days I naively assumed that if I showed her I wasn’t going anywhere then eventually it would stop. Of course this is not the case & like you & so many others have said (& I have said to her on several occasions over a period of time now) the only beginnings to an answer is with outside help.

 

[The Albatross]

The thing is... if you leave or discontinue the relationship... whether or not she "goes back to square one" is possible but not actually knowable. Also the onus is not on you because you have ample evidence accrued that her perceptions are pretty ego centric and defensive. Rather, if there is a break up... with clear communication... it can be a "consequence". The consequence of her cumulative behaviors resulted in a relationship break up. Like addicts, alcoholics, codependents, or untreated mentally ill... sometimes consequences is exactly what it takes for someone to endeavor to change.

 

[The Albatross]

For the record... I was untreated/undiagnosed until I was in my 40's but I have been with my husband for about 33 years... since I was 24. I am 57 now and we've been married for 28 years. Not easy years... but at each turn, I or he or we endeavored to value the bond over our individual issues. That's the relationship that you deserve.

 

[ByrnesT]

Thank you @The Albatross . It’s so good to hear from a sufferer as well as other supporters to hear your take on things & your perspective. That’s so great to hear that you have been in a long term relationship where you both clearly were willing to put the work in. I’m sure it’s not always been easy but so reassuring to know that you must be in a better place with things now, tho I’m sure the work never stops.

What I found interesting is you saying “the onus is not on you because you have ample evidence accrued that her perceptions are pretty ego centric & defensive”. I’m almost afraid to say something like that myself for fear of sounding arrogant/passing the buck/or like it implies I have no part to play in the work required. But it is how I feel. Dare I say we can all have our moments of losing the plot a little, whoever we are! But the sheer amount that I have witnessed in 2.5 years is beyond excessive & simply keeps on coming.

If I make any sort of move towards mentioning the accrual of behavioural problems, misconceptions & angry outbursts etc, then I am accused of living in the past & not giving her the chance to move forward. And of course no one needs the past thrown back in their face all the time. But what I feel she fails to see tho is that none of these repeated patterns are in the past. They are all very much the present & possibly even gathering more pace.

 

[Sweetpea76]

She doesn't have a say though. You can state your feelings. You can disengage from the meltdowns. You don't have to defend yourself.

You're not controlling her by doing so. You're controlling yourself. She can rant and rave on all she wants about whatever she wants. You don't have to listen to it or engage in it.

It's hard not take things personally, but look at it this way. Defending yourself is throwing gasoline on the fire. She's there to vilify and project negatives on you and she is going to do it no matter what you do or say. In her head you're guilty and that's all that matters to her at that moment. It's "proof".

When my vet gets like this I could literally show him screenshots of text conversations and what exactly was said... he still doesn't believe me. He's been stewing over it, has imagined what I was thinking and my motivations, and decided that I'm guilty and he was aware enough to "catch me".

You can't defend yourself from that shit. Don't let the mental illness run the show. Don't give it any kind of energy, because it's an energy vampire. Disengage.

Don't let the mental illness run the show.

 

[ByrnesT]

@Sweetpea76 you’re completely right & am trying to put this into practice now. How you describe your sufferer hits home; they’ve convinced themselves so much of your guilt about something that they are unable to move from that, no matter what the “evidence” it seems.

Can I ask is this kind of scenario a regular thing for you? Has it become less over time & with work? I’m trying to get a gauge of just how bad my situation is if that makes any sort of sense, cos I seem to live in it almost daily. As much as each person’s situation is unique, I’m trying to get my head around how extreme or “normal” my situation is for this kind of relationship.