News Ariana Grande's (pointless) PTSD brain scan

[somerandomguy]

Ariana Grande's PTSD Brain Scan - Neuroskeptic

I would never say that Ariana Grande doesn't have PTSD. Neither did the article. She certainly fits Crit A. However, the guy who says he can "show" PTSD using brain scans seems to be selling snake oil. It's also troubling to use technology to "prove" someone has PTSD, as if our experiences and symptoms and diagnoses aren't enough.

 

[Kubash16]

I’m curious what your stance is, are you suggesting she doesn’t have PTSD? Seems like the article is a bunch of guessing and opinion, cool, but any reputable sources?

For my opinion based on the limited info, I do think she could have PTSD. She would definitely meet Crit A. I’m not a fab of hers at all, she’s done things that I have zero respect for, but I don’t doubt her PTSD.

Are you suggesting she shouldn’t get a brain scan? If you have that kind of money and are curious, why not? Maybe it’s accurate, maybe it’s not, but it seems like even that was all just guessing. There’s a place in Dallas my first T suggested I go to that would have done periodic brain scans and frankly if I had had the money I would have done it. Seeing my brain would be really cool.

 

[Neverthesame]

It looks to me more like the concern is this Dr. Amen person using a celebrity to conflate the efficacy of his diagnostic procedure.
That's what I got out of it anyway.
I agree seeing a scan of my brain would be pretty cool, even if just for the novelty value.

 

[Kubash16]

Thank you both, that makes more sense.

 

[blackemerald1]

But what was the whole point? Why say anything or share scans.. when apparently she's also saying she's not well enough to publicly discuss her ptsd or the scans... apart from saying she "likes science" and thinks her brain "looks cool" .

But wait..there's more.. she then tells fans that when she's ready she will talk more (to them) about her ptsd?
Smells of a publicity stunt for the celebrity and the person who did the scan... :rolleyes: What next?

 

[LovingH]

Brain Scan Can Tell PTSD Apart from Traumatic Brain Injury

 

[Neverthesame]

@blackemerald1 Who knows? Maybe she won't make a total hash of it.... Maybe...

 

[LovingH]

She MAY have done it for publicity, or maybe she did it to raise awareness..hard to say

 

[somerandomguy]

Brain Scan Can Tell PTSD Apart from Traumatic Brain Injury

That's quite different than being able to diagnose PTSD from a brain scan, though, which is what Ariana's doctor was doing.

 

[tacit]

Not sure if this is the same thing or not, but may play into it.
I remember talking with an expert in his field (he travelled globally as a reputable trainer for therapists) & him showing me some brain scans of people who had experienced serious trauma (the PTSD kind), when they were asked to recall the traumatic memory. And the interesting thing was that those who did not suffer from PTSD, the areas of their brains that lit up when doing so, were consistant with the area of the brain that is known for storing memory. But when those who did suffer from PTSD recalled their traumatic memory, the areas of their brains consistently lit up much further away from & considerably less than in the area known for storing memory. He also went on to show me, how these scans changed over time & after treatment where, as the PTSD symptoms subsided, the more the brain lit up in the appropriate areas of the brain in a normal/standard way to be expected when recalling the traumatic memory. Thereby concluding (in my very layman's terms) that when we are trying to access our memories through an area of the brain, not fully designed or equipped to do so properly, the result can be suffering from many problematic symptoms, inc. PTSD.
I don't recall it ever being mentioned as a potential diagnostic tool. But rather as a tool to show the importance of the proper processing of traumatic memories, & in some cases moving that traumatic memory from where it is currently being accessed from to where it should be, as an integral part of the healing/recovery process.
I don't know if these are the type of scans they are referring to, but might be helpful info anyway.?

 

[joeylittle]

However, the guy who says he can "show" PTSD using brain scans seems to be selling snake oil. It's also troubling to use technology to "prove" someone has PTSD, as if our experiences and symptoms and diagnoses aren't enough.

this Dr. Amen person using a celebrity to conflate the efficacy of his diagnostic procedure.

I first learned about Dr. Amen around 2011...he's been trying to sell his "unique" ability to "diagnose" multiple mental health conditions and various addictions for a long, long time. Actually, I shouldn't say "trying" because he's gotten quite rich and successful off of doing just that.

The real research around the application of various kinds of scans has come a few steps forward since 2011 - but it's still very, very much in the "we're trying to figure out exactly what all this means" phase of scientific research. In other words, his claims that he can really do what he's doing are entirely based on his own subjective experience, there's nothing objectively scientific about it besides the fact that you'll come out of the process with a full set of brain-pictures.

Scam, scam.

BUT: I disagree that the concept is offensive. I think a lot of people dealing with various kinds of mental health problems would agree that having an objective diagnostic procedure would be really helpful. We spend so much time and energy doubting ourselves, because diagnosis right now currently relies almost entirely on our ability to report our own symptoms. Most medical diagnosis now can rely on something that can be seen - on an xray, in a scan, under a microscope...I think it would help a lot of people if mental health had at least a component of something objectively observable.

But we are a long way off from that, still.

I do hear you @somerandomguy, on the concept of being required to prove that the illness is there. That could become very problematic. But I think the ability to obtain proof could be equally helpful, not harmful (if that makes sense).

 

[Sideways]

And the interesting thing was that those who did not suffer from PTSD, the areas of their brains that lit up when doing so, were consistant with the area of the brain that is known for storing memory.

Yup - probably the hippocampus.

There have been studies around this associated with chronic trauma during childhood, while the brain is still developing, and the hippocampus can often be found to be smaller than what you’d expect in those victims.

The brain being the plasticky (scientific term that one ;) ) weird and clever thing that it is, this can potentially change as the person ‘recovers’.

We aren’t at the point yet where you can scan a brain and conclude “definitely that’s the hippocampus of a childhood trauma victim”. But perhaps one day.