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Emotional Numbess

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When I am talking to people he says that I often hesitate when I talk because he can tell that I am looking for the exact word that I want to say. The draw back is that when using the exact word, it that it is like using a blunt force weapon against the person I am talking to. I use as few words as possible, the exact word and the exact definition of that word, and it leaves people no wiggle room. They feel trapped, and there is a communication breakdown.

omg...M does the very exact same thing! I call it "word trapping". As long as I have known him he has done that. I used to feel like I had to think very carefully about what I was going to say because every other thing he called me out on and I had to explain myself and he held me to my word and left me no "wiggle room" either. It was so frusterating and disheartening when I felt that I could not be open and honest with him. He also has that "Vet's sixth sense" we were talking about once on here, somehow Matt knows everytime I am holding something back, so then I would just spill my feelings and my frusterations without second-guessing myself I would always say the wrong thing and HIS Lizard brain would take over and BAM! red hot anger and irritation and SLAM! the bars were on his heart again and I would lose my sweetheart. Once he started on the Citolapram most of that went away, but that is one reason I try my best to avoid confrontations with him. He told me that I should still be honest...if he's acting like a butthole, call a spade a spade. LoL He knows when he is being a jerk, but unable to stop it. I am really hoping that they will touch on this in therapy. He is one of the most loving, caring, generous, kind-hearted, sweet people I have ever met in my life, when PTSD is not in control. He may never learn to be that way all the time, or even want to be that way all the time, but I hope that in therapy he learns to control the worst of his symptoms.

And you, Fargo are like an Angel who sometimes has a Lizard brain! You rock! Your girl is as lucky to have you as I am to have my soldier! Sometimes I wonder if you should ever copy and paste some of the things you write on here, tweak it a bit and give it to her. Matt and I use Yahoo! chat all the time, even when we are face to face on video chat, when things are hard to say, he simply types them and I talk. It works. Words on paper are less scary to "say". I'm sure she will understand.
 
Hey Steph, its really hard you know. I am so numb now and want to run and hide. I don't want to show Margaret my weakness. I try to smile and be happy and act like a dick. I love seeing her smile. But its hard to fake it.

Margaret loves you...how can she not?? ;-) Sometimes we women don't mind being the strong one in the relationship, makes us feel really good about ourselves and value the effort we put forth even more. Tell her you love seeing her smile. Tell her that her smiles make your heart happy, even if she can't see it. Ask her patience and her compassion and ask her to think back to the good times and reassure her that you are also looking forward to making even more great memories, but right now you just need to get through the next hour.

Your girl is not your group of soldiers depending on you for strength and fearlessness in the face of battle. She's your partner, 50/50. She will love you more for honesty and weakness than she will for you to remain stoic and locked away. I know, I know easier said than done of course, but this will pass and things will get better in time.
 
Your girl is not your group of soldiers depending on you for strength and fearlessness in the face of battle. She's your partner, 50/50. She will love you more for honesty and weakness than she will for you to remain stoic and locked away.

Amen Steph. Well said and all that jazz. Hugs to you and I'm glad things are looking better.

Fargo, while size doesn't matter.....we like your long posts because it gives us more insight. You really do convey the information very well, so please do not censor your posts.

Jimmy, love and hugs to you. I realize you are having a tough time and we support you even more for sharing that with us. We know it isn't easy and applaud you for sticking with us through the tough times.

Red
 
Amen Steph. Well said and all that jazz. Hugs to you and I'm glad things are looking better.

Fargo, while size doesn't matter.....we like your long posts because it gives us more insight. You really do convey the information very well, so please do not censor your posts.

Jimmy, love and hugs to you. I realize you are having a tough time and we support you even more for sharing that with us. We know it isn't easy and applaud you for sticking with us through the tough times.

Red

Well I am quoting both of you, Red and Steph. They trained me for 20 years to be strong, fearless and not show pain and emotion, how can you expect your men to all of a sudden give it up. Its hard enough coming to terms with the fact that you forget what your doing or about to say. Its hard enough not being able to go into the street or a shop without looking over your shoulder and checking the people out.

We have been conditioned and programmed and it takes a while to deprogram this. I am not saying it cannot be done, but i am just letting you know another hurdle we have to contend with on top of our PTSD.

Jimmy
 
I have no idea what you have gone through and I am sorry if I ever gave the pretense that I do or that I think PTSD is just something that one can "snap out of". If that were true, there would not be PTSD. I am just frusterated and sad and venting, but you are right, not only were you guys trained to act a certain way, but you have lived through relaying on those actions to save your lives. Of course it would not be easy to change, and I bet it is even a scary thought to even think about living differently, even though you want to.

I wish my guy could open up and let me in like you guys do on here... *sigh* patience is not one of my virtues, but I am trying.
 
I just wish I knew what to say when it comes to talking to my honey. I am trying to keep it light and easy and act like nothing is wrong and when he snaps at me, I try to back off without letting him walk all over me. I know that the things he says when he is angry he doesn't really mean, but they are still hard to hear. :( I wish I knew how to break that cycle when he says something hurtful, then feels bad and guilty and then gets even more angry at himself for being an ass so he continues to misdirect that anger at me. How do I best absorb/deflect those attacks?
 
Your girl is not your group of soldiers depending on you for strength and fearlessness in the face of battle. She's your partner, 50/50. She will love you more for honesty and weakness than she will for you to remain stoic and locked away. I know, I know easier said than done of course, but this will pass and things will get better in time.

I read you loud and clear on that. However, it is NOT that easy. Mostly, I think, it is even worse when you are talking with your girl/boy. Because you CAN'T explain what is going on. Sometimes you know what is making you react. But often, you don't know or even realize it is even happening until it has happened. Also, it doesn't matter whether or not you will love us more for being honest and showing weakness. This is pure survival at the primal level. The Lizard Brain. If I feel threatened or weak. It is me feeling frightened or weak. I have to get around that. All your love and affection won't help when the Lizard Brain is in control. In fact, you loving me, makes me feel weaker.

So while on that subject, let me throw this into the mix. I am going to use stereotypes and speaking only from a male perspective (specifically mine) here so bear with me...
  1. I have frequently heard women say that men need to get more in touch with their feminine side. But the guys they date who "sensitive" and express their feelings (sometime...dare I say it...even cry in front of them) are seen as wimpy and weak.
  2. What type of guy is attractive to these women? The Bad Boy. The Dangerous Guy. James Dean, Marlon Brando, in more modern times, George Clooney, Brad Pitt, Johnny Depp.
We see it every day on TV and in movies, but I have also seen it expressed by female friends in real life.

Now lets look at a definition of masculine:
1. Having qualities or appearance traditionally associated with men, esp. strength and aggressiveness.
—He is outstandingly handsome and robust, very masculine.

So now lets look at the average Veteran. Of course there are an infinite amount of options, but lets just look at the two above for the sake of arguement.

Which one most closely fits your Veteran?

Why did you find them attractive? If you saw flaws, did you think they would change or that you could change them?

Most of the guys I know who have been or are currently in the service fit the more masculine stereotype and they did prior to joining the service. Now add in indoctrination (boot camp), advanced training and posting. The military culture, although it has gotten, in the famous words of George Bush I, "Kinder and gentler." But it is still a very masculine profession.

Now look at why he was attracted to you. Why did he find you attractive? What was it in your personality that he liked? What were the thins he did not like and thought he could change?

They say that opposites attract. Men and women are very different. They have different hormones, different maturation rates, etc., Whether it is God's crazy joke, or evolutionary response to the world, there is a reason for it. What we all have to learn (and clearly I have not learned the lesson yet) is how to accept those differences, then use those differences to make a better relationship.

So when you guy is stoic and shut off, remember that it in not ONLY PTSD acting there. It is more-than-likely his entire upbringing AND his biology. He may be trying to break out of it, but he also may not. Either way, it is not a switch that can be flicked on and off.

you are a great woman. Clearly you have strong feelings for your Vet. You are also very caring and emotional. He is not. You have to learn how to identify when he is shutting down, then not push him. Give him SOME space, but also to be strong about it. Don't let him push you around. Don't let him completely shut out. Let him know you care (and he does know already).

For me it was like taming a wild animal. Talks softly, leave little bits of food out, and eventually it will come over. Keep doing it and trust begins to form. Keep on doing it and it moves in and takes over your bed!

I wish my guy could open up and let me in like you guys do on here... *sigh* patience is not one of my virtues, but I am trying.

I don't know what else to say. Talking here is much, much easier than talking to someone in person. For one, I have time to think about my response to what someone says. If it touches a button, I can flick past it (read run away). If it pisses me off AND triggers me to want to fight, well I can fire up the respond button and let loose.

When I am standing in front of someone, T or anyone else, if they hit the red button and I want to reach over and strangle them.... Well, I can say "BREAK" and try to disengage. But with annoying frequency, they will not take that as an answer. And will continue to press the BIG RED BUTTON. So I go to level one protective response, sometimes consciously, sometimes unconsciously, and start making them wiggle with my blunt force wording. If they press the attack, I escalate to what the Coast Guard calls a "Stern, loud voice." Usually, that, combined with my physical presence (Mud crusted spiderman) is enough to break contact. However, if they press the BIG RED BUTTON again...well that has not happened yet. But I scares the crap out of me daily, because it would be ugly, and I would most likely be jailed for Assault and Battery if not worse.
 
Sometimes we go from being emotionally numb to verbally abusive. I can gather the majority of you 'Harpies' have copped a battering. This is our way of making up for what we feel are our inadequacies, or where we believe we have failed. We don't hate you. We just feel terrible inside and want you to feel terrible too. And the same goes for everyone we love. We don't really mean it. And you know, straight away afterwards we are berating ourselves and beating ourselves up for saying what we did. But we can't take it back. We do try hard, and we have no idea what is going on inside your head or how we have hurt you. But as long as you know we are hurting too.

The PTSD journey is full of twists and turns, ups and downs. There will be quiet times and there will be fun times, but there will also be the horrid time where you wish to give up. Thank you to all the 'Harpies', Friends, Families, and Partners of those veterans that have this beast we call PTSD.

Margaret, this was written primarily for you. I am trying hard and apologise for being the dick I have been over the last couple of weeks. I know you love me and you don't have to prove it. You have accepted Me and my family as yours, that is proof enough.
 
You guys just kinda blew my mind! You are both beyond amazing! I need some time to re-read and process all this. Thank you with all my heart, thank you!
 
First off, I want to thank absolutely everyone here for being sting enough to share and in the process, helping everyone else out.

While really new to all of this, this thread has really helped me over the past few days handle things and not completely freak out and probably end up destroying what we have before it's really had a chance to start.

We've only been dating a few weeks, but as he put it, "we're obviously very drawn to eachother."

It was several weeks of roses, sunshine and laughter and I was thinking "Really? He has PTSD? I haven't seen any signs yet that are in the books he asked me to read..."
Then nothin. Nada. No communication. Completely opposite then before.
Finally did get a response and they are 1 word texts - no engagement & definitely no phone calls.

I was thinking (& still find myself thinking sometimes) I must of messed up somehow - he doesn't want to continue this & he is gonna be a 'typical guy' and just ignore me until it fades away into nothing.

Then I went back to the books & found these forums. Learned more about isolating & emotional numbness.

So I send the upbeat twice a day "Hi. Hope you're having a good one." & "Good night. Sweet dreams." (have always said that since we first started talking)
I'm just hoping that this isn't pushing to hard or stressing him out more - or that I'm being delusional in thinking he'll come out of it and start talking to me again.

Whew! Sorry! That got long! But thanks again for giving me some hope and if anyone has any advise to impart, I'd love to hear it!

I'm here with you all too & sending positive vibes to everyone!
 
My, my - Fargo and QLD, thank you so much for your candidness. And thank you Steph for voicing so many of the same concerns that I have. I'm off to post an intro....
 
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