For Women- What Does Being A Women Mean To You?

[mamachick]

Exactly Junebug, teachers, social workers, etc make a small wage in comparison to predominantly male positions. Where I live, a person with a masters degree in psychology or social work or counseling make about $14-$20 an hour, the same wage as a male( with or without a high school diploma) that can work in a warehouse and move boxes with a fork lift but has the physical ability, except the man will be paid overtime and the sw, teacher, counseling job is salary at 31K-37K and a fifty hour week. UPS drivers=85K yr, coalminers 85K yr. Does this make sense. Yes, some jobs are dangerous, but so is going into homes with violent people and school systems these days.

 

[ashdawn8287]

Thank you for that post.

We talked about the rule of thumb today. How disguisting!!!!!!

I think a lot of women's movements are labeled as crazy or man hating and for what? To prevent us from waking people up to real issues people would rather just turn there cheek on. I don't care what kind of crap or negative stuff people say about women's movements, I see, I gave witnessed, and I get the big and whole picture.

Thank you so much for clarifying that for me brat!!!

I will not sit aside or shut up or be made believe that I am crazy just because society misinforms people and people don't see the big picture. I am and will continue to fight this.

 

[mamachick]

I dont hate men either. I have few male friends. I just have not met one that I want to spend my life with. I think that it is just not my time right now. I am 5'6" and 120 lb, curvey for an old bag, lol. Since I dont want to be with my ex, now he says Im masculine every time I talk to him. (not much) He is insinuating that I must be a lesbian. That is common among abusers and he was not an abuser. They will sink to all time low when they dont get their way, but so will some women, not claiming to be a gender thing.

Working with women is what I have been meant to do, or at least was meant to do. It has made me open my eyes so very wide and become aware of things that many miss. It sounds like you have an eye for it Ashdawn. You will be an asset to your profession.

We have come a long way, but what I am seeing in our youth and how the media portrays women is concerning. Women seem to be as much or more objectified and sexualized as ever. We do have more rights and there is justice in the law in comparison to years ago. I think it is fine for women to stay home and raise kids and run a house if that is what a couple chooses, I also think it is fine for the husband to, and do not find it degrading. It is one of the hardest jobs on earth. My friend just got her PsychD a couple years ago and is Dr. now and her husband is school guidance counselor. They had second child and he was home all summer with 2 little ones, I think he has a new appreciation. Her husband looks fried at the end of the day.

Im a bit burned out from my profession and having ptsd, but I think that I would like to lobby for mental health issues, it would be a good channel for anger. LOL

 

[Padfoot]

Wanting equal pay and to be able to walk around the streets without an escort does not mean man-hating. The Jill Meagher case is a good example. People were demanding to know why her friends let her walk home alone that night. Nobody asked why the friends of the man who raped and murdered her let him roam the streets alone that night. An adult SHOULD be able to have a few drinks and walk home in total safety. It's not man-hating to expect that. Men can be feminists too. I know a few who are.

 

[intothelight]

I just realized that I cannot really answer this question. I tend to think of myself in terms of roles and not gender specific. Will have to think this through a bit.

 

[ashdawn8287]

Thanks. Yes I know a few men that are feminist too and I think that is cool and respect that. I am looking forward to continuing with my field and seeing where it goes.

My parents and grandfather never made me believe that I had to be pretty or down play being smart. Being intelligent was praised and that was pretty much it in our household. Yes, I have loads of issues with my parents, but they did do a good job to not make my sister and I feel like we were unequal. They never put my sister and I into gender specific programs. My dad and grandfather are very intelligent people and I think my sister, my niece, and myself got that from them. My grandfather always encouraged me to follow my dreams and education was huge to him. I remember him telling me when I was little, "Nobody can take away your education, you can loose anything and everything in life, but they can not take your education from you." I am obsessed with learning. I am starting to see exactly what he meant.

I realized when I moved out at 17 years old-all those follow your dreams, get you education, stand up for yourself, and don't take crap things I was taught was extremely hard to defend, not to everyone, but there were a lot of people who used to be in my life who didn't take me serious. I remember a psychology professor asked me one time, "Do you believe you are treated or stigmatized as dumb because you are blonde or that people don't take you seriously?" I said, "I don't really care if they think I am dumb or mark me off as dumb, because I know I am smart." He said, "Ashley is one of the best students I have ever had."

I moved straight out of my parents house and into an abusive relationship. Going to college was hard during that time, but I got straight A's and was getting abused the entire time. He would get jealous, I couldn't drive myself to school, he would sit on in the parking lot while I was in class and wait for me, when he would pick me up or drop me off at the building he would shout inappropriate things. I was really young and he was my out for not wanting to live with my parents. I guess I didn't even realize he was an abuser until after the relationship (as it started from throwing things at me, to shoving, then to full blown rage), he normalized that behavior to me slowly and overtime. He would call me a *itch and other degrading terms. A lot of my anxiety stems from that. My other ex had a thing to let me know I was a dumb*ss every chance he got.

There are bad women too. One gender is not better than the other because like someone said, we compliment each other and when we do, that is beautiful. I do care about women and I am concerned with the media, what children see on TV and the internet, and how sometimes people believe that they should follow what the media says. The media is kind of brainwashing (I use that term lightly). The playing field just needs to be more equal. We are told to be pretty or "sexy" yet when some females act like some males in regards to sex, they are called whores. The double standards are baffling.

No wonder we can't ever make up are minds lol. We are told one thing, then when we do that we are told we are wrong. I think it is confusing being a women sometimes.

I am just more interested in studying women then men, because I feel a lot of women need to gain their voice against things that are not right in society, so they can follow their dreams, and not be solely dependent on a man. I see women a lot who are very quiet, don't have a voice, and are the definition of targets for abuse. I guess because maybe I use to be like that. I am interested in equality and peace. I do not want to stir up tension between females or males. I do not want to hate men. We need men to protect us and stand up for us. So it is getting those men to do that and to tell the bad men hey we are not having that. We do need a voice and those "rallies" are that voice- I think.

 

[Tinyflame]

I tend to think of myself in terms of roles and not gender specific.

Exactly. Roles, and also just 'as myself'. It is a moot point to me.

I was raised in a family of 4 girls, raised to be or do what we wanted, even those roles weren't gender-specific, (but encompassed them as well).

My mom was very strong. My parents marriage in many ways very egalitarian or complementary. For example my dad would build the fence, my mom/ we would paint it. My dad valued my mom's femininity, but they worked together as a team.

My dad died quite young and I did not have brothers or uncles to speak of, so what would have been considered physical (typically male) work we did. We did before he died, also.

In my grandfather's day, he said (made reference) to 'awful things done to children he knew of'; it took til I was born for him to even give a 'hug'. In my mom's day attempted rape was called 'he made a pass'. I don't think they ever told parents, it was taken for granted. In my day (generation, I am 44), there were always teachers etc who did the same; we all 'knew' it but made no big deal about it (except to cringe if we were 'called in for a private conversation' :( ). By the time I was graduating, teachers just asked me out (directly). Now, my neighbours children know more at 9 or 10 than I probably knew by 14. Yikes.

But, I rarely find jokes etc as such offensive, if not meant in a spirit of ill-will or blatant sexism (which I ignore). I seem if anything to relate to older men the best. Probably because being single and never married or divorced, and not a 'mom', I have similar concerns (i.e. work, repairs, etc). But I am very glad for the steps to "re-educate" ALL people to hopefuly treat one another with respect and kindness and equality.

Though I don't think it's necessary to define 'men' in order to define 'women', I must say all of my help, best friends, best bosses etc over the years have always been predominantly men. I don't know if that was because I was a 'woman' per se, but all I know is that I am very thankful for good people, regardless of gender.

I don't think 'good' men find it harder to speak up. I do think it takes courage however, and won't necessarily win them points with their peers.

 

[ashdawn8287]

I read in the trauma workbook that most women don't even know what being a woman means and cannot answer that question and therefore don't have confidence. I thought that was interesting. When I asked that question to others I know, a lot of them did not know how to answer it as well.

I am grateful for good people too, regardless of gender. I am studying gender at my university and am part of the women's and gender department. It is interesting.

 

[Deleted member 12723]

This is a very interesting topic. I have been married to the man I love for thirty six years and he died four months ago. I find that I have to build a life for me now.

There are so many things I do not fit with so I find it hard. I am fifty eight years old, overweight and suffer self esteem about that. I find that I am having to come up with new defintions about what it means to be a woman.

I find in the US that women are portrayed as objects, very thin and beautiful. I have two granddaughters. The oldest one is a tom boy and the little one is following the trends of being beautiful. She even has a boyfriend and is only eight years old. It makes me feel very sad.

I wish things were different in our world, but everything is turning into sex and thin beautiful woman that are young.

I find it a difficult transition to be growing older. I need a lot of help in this. I think it will take time and effort.

Thank you all for all of your words of wisdom. It really provoked me to think about this topic. I wish I could feel better if I could raise my self esteem. I find I am continually bombarded by images of a Barbie doll woman.

There is so much strength that I have.

Being a new widow, I am not interested in men at all. I am just now learning how to live without having a man in my life. It sure is a radical change for me.

 

[ashdawn8287]

Gizmo you have life experiences my dear. You are beautiful just the way you are. Celebrate that and screw Barbie! ;)

 

[mamachick]

I was raised in a house with no father, not brothers and grandpa died before I was born. I lived with a mother and 4 older sisters. One sister was book smart and less concerned with looks. I watched all my sisters and mom "doll up" with make up and hair and be social. That was nothing like it is today. I do think women are objectified and sexualized regularly, there are just laws against sexual harrassment and they are free to and do report much more frequently.

Even so, I have seen women re-abused in the court system after being abused. I had a male professor that would tell stories in his lectures and when it regarded a woman he was always descriptivie, ie "this bombshell red head client in a short skirt sat on my desk and said.....", or " this man tied his naked wife to a tree and left her there, she was huge, had only a few teeth, hair a wreck and desheveled , she was this big....". This is from a well known university, this professor well respected. On break, only 2 of us (out of 30 students) even noticed that he regularly did this and was appauled. I dont know what they say about me, but they call my friend who noticed this a man hater and feminist. Women will attack women to defend this kind of behavior too often. Both this woman and I worked at womens agencies but different ones.

I agree that attempted rape was called "making a pass". I had a teacher who was inappropriate. We just cringe and hope not to be the target back then. Now the news if full of abuses daily. Back in the late 70's I was in a marriage and regularly abuse. There was no such thing as marital rape at that time. There were no protective orders. Employers would fire you if your ex showed up at work and made trouble and your landlord would hold you accountable and evict you if he showed up and kicked your door in. The police did not arrest if they did not see it happen, even if witnesses did. We have come a long way. We have a long way to go. But unless women make a point to be aware of all of this, it will not get better.

 

[ashdawn8287]

Wow Brat, that is scary. I am so sorry you went through that. I can't even imagine how the 70s were.

If someone doesn't make a voice or stand up for this, I agree it will continue. I will not shut up about it, no matter the cost. I mean I am not going to go get violent or anything lol. I will handle it with the up most respect.