Poll Have You Had Bad Experiences With a Church or Religious Organization?

[tardis]

Sado-Catholicism - that's great cragger! :) Was raised Catholic myself so I can empathize with the fear and manipulation of it, most definitely.

 

[cragger65]

Ahhh, there's nothing like harsh, nerve-wracking sado-catholicism to turn you away from church on a permanent basis, is there Tardis. I knew someone else would understand what I meant ;P

 

[patrick]

I went to a catholic military academy for a while when I was a kid. They dished out plenty of trauma there, but I was already so accustomed to that type of trauma I don't think it really did any further harm. Sado-catholicism. That's pretty darn good. Wish I'd thought it up. Did you ever hear George Carlin talk about the Catholic Church?

 

[Cindy]

Interesting, this is an old poll revived.

As I read through the responses and reflected on my own faith and beliefs I saw a pattern unfold.

I am interested in a religious faith in that it 'should' bring together like minded good hearted people. However, the reality is that it doesn't. Just as anything else the group dynamics ensue and the jostling for the ax to grind or righteous power begin.

Society's structures once again magnified even in the church where we all should be equal regardless of our conditions. I gave up on organized religion because I just couldn't stand the contradictions of belief in my eyes anymore.

I have joined a new church. Mother Nature. It is where I commune with my higher spirit. Just me and the elements.

Cindy

 

[jeapea]

Cindy~

That's the same church I've belonged to for years! Isn't it wonderful? Full of acceptance and glory and validation for us, just the way we are, no matter who we are or where we've been. And the occasional creature that overcomes its natural instincts to come sit with us and commune is a sweet reward, too. That brings an enormous sense of peace to my heart.

jps

 

[Still Trying]

Religion vs. Religious Organization

I have struggled with both of these over the years. Prior to the attack that caused my PTSD, I went through conflicts in two different congregations in two different towns where a few members had a vendetta against the ministers and tried to get rid of them. In the first I was in confirmation class in junior high and the second I was an adult member. Both conflicts reminded me of the politics Jesus disrupted in the Temple. As disturbing and upsetting as the conflict was, it never affected my faith in God - just my faith in people.

After the attack, it was my minister that helped me through the nightmarish days and weeks that followed, both with prayers and just being non-judgemental and there for me whenever I needed it. The few other "religious" (not ministers) people I told about the attack were horribly destructive. By various means, they told me God wanted me attacked. One couldn't understand why because I was so nice; another thought he was teaching me a lesson about pride; another felt God was testing my love for him. Those comments and attitudes have wreaked havoc with me ever since. I don't rationally believe that I'm either being punished or tested by God, but when the fear and anxiety are at their peak, I can't help but wonder what if... And in those times I struggle to hear "the promise of the Gospel" as my minister calls it and can only hear my terrible faults and failures.

Maybe it's hypocritical, but deep down (assuming I am being rational) my relationship with God isn't through or about those people. I go to church to explore and extend my relationship with God. The other congregation members are hopefully there for the same reason for themselves. They are a group of people, just like there are groups of people everywhere such as work, clubs, support groups etc. It's easy to want to hold them to a different standard because they're in a church building and all that implies, but they're human, too. Attending church doesn't guarantee they'll be the perfect Christian any more than wearing a police uniform means they'll never break the law.

To me, God is God, however and wherever we see or experience him. God is in nature, but nature's not perfectly harmless either - hurricanes, tornadoes, etc. God's also in people, and everyone here knows what harm people can cause. Religion isn't as much about God as it is about our relationship with other people who supposedly believe the same way we do.

I'm sorry if this sounds like a sermon, I certainly didn't mean it as such.

 

[fin]

Faith as Opposed to Organised Religion

It didn't sound like a sermon Still Trying, I agree with you. I don't think religion, organised religion has an awful lot to do with God at all, most of the time. It is about people, seeking to try to find some answers and trying to find a way. And certainly people are flawed, a church isn't exempt from peoples behaviour good, bad or indifferent; and thats church's as well as the people in them. Although the problem I have is that they seem to believe they aren't flawed, sometimes they really think they know it all and sometimes peope in them think they are God, and I don't mean in a mental health way....(that wasn't meant to sound like that either sorry). I mean they really think they are and that everyone needs to treat them as such. This is sounding worse...how about this...

I for one agree with you, I knew an absolutely amazing minister, very spirit lead. Not in an Evangelical kind of way, he was Methodist (That wasn't meant to sound quite so funny ish). I knew when I talked with him and he asked me at the time why hadn't I lost my faith, well I knew when I talked with him that I was talking with someone that was in relationship with God, or higher power, whatever you want to call it. I knew he wasn't carrying the arrogance that can accompany many self righteous religious people. And I am not talking about everybody here, please people don't go getting upset. But I hope you know what I mean.. I met one minister who was nine to five, I couldn't believe in how he looked at his faith, his walk with Christ. And again I don't mean he worked nine to five literally, or that he had some boundaries I couldn't cope with no...No I never really went to him for counsell, probably because of it. I mean, he seemed to be believing nine to five but living differently altogether, but it is not for me to judge, I don't know what heppened to him and I don't know maybe he was struggling and had lost his faith...or way I don't know.

My point here is I think we can forget that churchs are just buildings with people in them. We expect the people to be better somehow because we believe they are more "godly" but often they aren't. But they do answer to a higher power, and that is what they believe, and while they may be judgemental or whatever, they will be held to account for their behaviour one day.

That was one of the problems I had, I was judged constantly and no matter what I did, I was never going to be seen as anything other than shop solied or used goods. And this I believe was what helped some members to see me as something they could use (I wont go on about that here), and then it was impacted further when I approached the elders and minister for help.

But I do think that "the church" does or should take responsibility for its actions, it has set itself up as a church afteral, so therefore maybe it needs to have some accountability here on earth. Just as I am accountable for my actions on this planet now, I believe they should also be. Although again I believe the only one that can judge where someone's heart really is, and truely know anyone's intent besides themselves is God, or that Higher Power. So earthly judgement aside, someone somewhere knows.

(that last bit sounded kind of spooky like a thriller or something...sorry...cue the scarey music)

 

[DrDanger1979]

Did not cause, but seems to perpetuate

Due to their lack of understanding, the fellow believers assist in perpetuating my trauma. Comments such as "you need to pray more" or "rely on God, he will help with anything" or "the power of Holy Spirit can conquer all" foster resentment inside me.

 

[krispy]

Yeah, Dr. Danger, sometimes believers forget how to be human and speak english instead of "christianese"!

 

[Deleted member 1860]

My PTSD was caused by being molested by the minister's wife when I was 4.

 

[fin]

Due to their lack of understanding, the fellow believers assist in perpetuating my trauma. Comments such as "you need to pray more" ....
"the power of Holy Spirit can conquer all" foster resentment inside me.

I am soo with you on this Doctor Danger...I heard this a lot, coupled with if you had stronger faith you would be healed, you wouldn't be like this. And then was teated like I didnt believe by many and the rest just thoought it was ok to abuse me as I wasn't seen as worth anything by anyone.

And not just resentment either it can really make you doubt whether you are saved or know God or anything along those lines and even if you are worth being saved and loved, because after a while you just start to believe that you really must have been so bad because even God has turned his/her back.

I do not hold with this...at all any more. I refuse even if I am unsure, I still refuse to think or believe that God if there is one is like this...especially if you look at what it is that they are supposed to be saying. So very hard and so very difficult to live with.

Churchs are a real good place for abusers to find and pick out and off the vulnerable and if it goes unchecked, that is when I believe the church should be accountable. Too many peoples lives ruined and some of it could have been stopped, just my opinon though so.

~fin

 

[Chrisc0295]

I was raised a lutheran and converted to Catholicism. The church did not cause my PTSD but some of the things that the evil priest said to me triggered me