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Husbands Family Have Gone Mad... Or Is It Me?

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CraftyCath

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I have a very close relationship with my husband and sons and although we have our difficulties (some of which make me want to leave at times) we do face up to them, discuss them and move on.

His sisters husband has had many a dig at me and my husband over the years, always speaks gruffly with us, points the finger but never in the presence of his wife. Even if he has not seen us for years as they live in Italy he will pretend to be asleep and not talk with us. I don't mind someone not talking but pretending to go to sleep?

I had had enough of him speaking to me in a bullying tone every time he saw me as this triggers my PTSD so I sent an e-mail asking him why he does it as it was inappropriate and hurtful.

I got a letter back from my sister-in-law (not him and they live in Italy by the way) saying they were bemused as to why I would raise these issues and said that he had just be joking with me. She said that it was me who had the problem and that only she understood how hard it was for him with his tinnitus and that he had been close to suicide with it. She said the only problem he had with us is that we always talk about ourselves and he can't get a word in edgewise. She said they expect us all to sit relaxed and quiet (even if er haven't seen each other for years) and be reading a book or sewing or something and then one person would say something another would reply and then we would all go quiet. I told them this wasn't the case and that we don't talk all about ourselves (although my husband often does - he's Aspergic but they told me I shouldn't label him) and that I had tried to engage him.

Anyway, they started to avoid us as did the rest of the family. The family would visit us at Christmas, Easter and sometimes Birthdays with cards and gifts and if my sister-in-law was home from Italy she would come but he never would - because he was tired. Now I have tinnitus as lots of people do. I am sure it is terrible for him and much worse than mine but not an excuse for such behaviour surely? Someone told me that the whole family were having a get together at Easter in Wales so I asked them what they were doing and they all lied and said they were doing nothing. When I asked them later why they had lied they made excuses, 'you have a fear of dogs,' 'you have and eating disorder.'

We found out in March that he had told her to leave as he had another woman. He is 51 and she is 27 and Italian. my sister-in-law stayed until June and then came back to the UK. She has told another friend that she still loves him, thinks it is a mid-life crisis and she is sticking to her marriage vows and waiting for him to take her back. I have said nothing but sent an e-mail saying I was sorry to hear this and hoped she was OK (she had moved in with a friend in Cronwall so not near home). She then moved in with her x-husbands sister for a while until she comes home to her sisters on the 18th of December. She is still friends with him on Facebook and he comments on her posts. His sister, who she is staying with, is friends with the 27 year old on Facebook and has said on there that she has spoke to her on Skype.

A week ago I get a phone call from my brothers other sister saying that on the 21st of December we are invited to her house (the other sister will be there) for a 'birthday buffet' for my husbands birthday. Glad I got the call, my husband hit the roof! What on earth are they up to? (A close friend of ours thinks they are trying to smooth things over now that her husband has gone and don't realise that this is inappropriate without talking to each other first. Cart before the horse). So he sent her a text saying he wasn't available as they had ignored him for years and his other sister had treated us terribly. He said he wanted to meet his sisters separately (she still tried to get him to see them both together) to put his views across. This sister has only ever had the opinion of her other sister (they are twins) to go by and when my husband asked her why they had treated him so badly her answer was this....'your Cath has a problem with Clive so we couldn't see you.'

So there it is... it is my fault! My biggest trigger is false accusation and bullying and it has been going on for years. All the dissembling they do, the sweet smiles and hugs and they have all talked about this. Over the years they have swarmed around my sister-in-law and done everything for her and she has been telling them falsities and half truths. This is the lady who had a panic attack during an MRI scan and told me she had 'Post Traumatic MRI Scanner Stress Syndrome,' as she spent months afterwards with her sister recovering from her anxiety.

So now my PTSD, which doesn't seem to matter at all to them is really bad. I am shaking, feeling sick, unable to sleep, nightmares, triggers going off, dissociating and generally feeling FUBARed.

They don't seem to care about my husbands General Anxiety Disorder, OCD and Aspergers or the fact that we are having terrible problems with the lads and who are both unemployed, have GAD and one is undergoing stringent tests for Aspergers as over the next 3 months which involves us having 3 interviews.

But apparently it is my fault. My husbands Dad rang up while he was at work asking why my husband had sent 'that text' to his sister. I had to put up with trying to explain things to him for over 50 minutes while he had a go at my husband, his son. He also regularly has a go at my husband about the lads both not having jobs.

My husband is seeing one sister on Wednesday morning. When he told her some of the things his other sister and her husband had said and done she said,'Oh I don't know anything about that.' So it seems it has been one sided or else she is trying to protect her sister. Both of his sisters and his Dad just keep saying, 'can't you and Cath just put this behind you?'

No! I have been asking her for years to please meet with me on a one-to-one in a public place so we can talk but every time she has refused. We haven't dragged his other sister and her husband or Dad into this but it seems the other sister has. Even now they are still covering for her husband by saying he is just not himself and will come round and take her back. They are all evangelical Christians and my husbands sister says she is praying for her husband to return. Although he has been saying for many years that he wants to stay in Italy while she has wanted to come back to the UK. My husband has told them that he is sick of his wife being treated as the 'black sheep' of the family and I have said that it is unhealthy to brush things under the mat and pretend with smiles and hugs that it hasn't happened. I don't know if his other sister will see us, I have tried so hard to reason with her but she just quotes forgiveness which has nothing to do with anything. It isn't about forgiveness, it is about reconciliation. And then there is the 'love covers a multitude of sins' thing which isn't scriptural. A friend told me that I could use the verse that says something like, 'If one of you sins against the other you should go to that person and be reconciled.' So she will know that is the Biblical thing to do.

I am so scared and ill and frightened and I know they will be feeling similar (except no PTSD for them). They have been very protected and padded in cotton wool in their lives and have had little life experience (no work when they got married, just looking after husband and home, no kids, plenty of money, nice homes, cars, holidays) until the one's husband left her. They are twins and have always had each other but they are nothing alike apart from the lying. Dad and the twins have never even had a relationship with my sons which I don't care about as they would be influenced but my husband does.

What on earth do I do now? What if they continue to blame me for over 28 years of problems which could have been solved with a 5 minute chat? I feel like I'm sliding down a slope and I just can't stop.

How do I deal with this, so close to Christmas which is always a difficult time for me anyway?

If anyone can help then I am all ears.
 
He doesn't know what he wants Ghostlybear, he is so confused, upset and angry. He says it wouldn't bother him if he never saw them again but I think that is just a reaction to his hurt.

He has said however that if they continue to treat me like I'm the bad guy in all this he will refuse to see the sister who is causing it, so I guess that is up to her. If she can't face me then she can see him but if she refuses again I doubt there is anything we can do.

It is so confusing when you are in the middle of it all.
 
Well in that case, I would let them play the next move. I would not go meet them or join them anywhere but on my turf. If they really want to see you guys, then they will come to you (your home). If they decide not to come to over to your house for the visit, then it is most likely they wanted to cause "shit".

Both you and your husband will be more comfortable with the situation and if it starts to get ugly, then you have the power to control the situation. Ultimately, you can send them on their merry way with a smile on your face!
 
Wow, no WONDER you're so stressed out. What a bunch of busybodies! That they will contact each other to grill a person on behalf of a third party is bullying by proxy.

The first way to take away their power is to stop letting them get away with speaking for another. Truly. If that person can't tell you to your face, then it doesn't need or deserve your attention. My family members and I used to really tie each other in knots this way until I learned how to successfully extricate myself from that relationship chaos.

When someone would contact me and begin famsplaining (speaking for the family instead of themselves) my therapists and mentors taught me some of the following responses to shut them down.

  • "I need to go now. Bye. *click*"
  • "That person knows how to contact me if s/he has something to say. I don't care to hear it third-hand. Thanks anyway."
  • "If you have something you'd like to talk about, instead of someone, let's discuss that."
  • "Why are you telling me this? This communication didn't involve you, why are you inserting yourself into this?"
  • "My relationship between me and [person's name] is between me and [person's name], and if I want to hear your opinion, I will ask you. Otherwise, please don't bring this topic up again."
  • "I thought you were calling to say hello, not to gossip. Do you have something you'd like to say for yourself instead of speaking for someone who isn't even here?"
  • "Even if that person asked you to tell me, it violates my boundaries and I don't appreciate it. Please speak only for yourself or I have other things I need to attend to."
  • "Ok, I've heard what you've said and I will contact that person myself."
  • "Does that person know you're saying this about him/her?"
  • "I'm dialing this person up now and I'll put it on speakerphone so you don't have to relay the message. (Dial the phone. It makes both of them extremely uncomfortable to be called out on their collusion.)
  • "I'm not going to speak about [that person.] If you have a question, you need to ask that person directly."
  • "If you wish to have contact with me then you will not speak about [person or situation] again. It's my choice what I choose to speak about and I do not choose to speak about this topic with you anymore."
I did discover that I really only had to enforce the "no speaking about/for third parties" rule with even the worst manipulators because they learned I was willing to hang up on them. Our conversations got more shallow but far less manipulative and hurtful. Yes, they still gossip about me, and over the years it has been amazing the made-up stories that have become family legends in my absence, but that drama is not my drama.

People who pick apart our words and ask us to explain them aren't interested in resolving conflict, but creating it. We say what we say, hopefully speaking honestly yet directly, and they feel about it whatever they feel. Their feelings are their own and even if we turn ourselves into a pretzel trying to figure out the exact words to not provoke new issues, they will still take the delivery, words, and meanings according to what's inside of them.

It's better and healthier to refuse to play that game with unhealthy people. They don't have to like what we say. We still have the right to lay down our boundaries, speak only for ourselves, and steal the power of the best manipulators in the family system who try to hurt us by proxy. It's like an insane telephone-of-the-damned game. But we only play it when we choose to take part in it by listening to it, reacting to it, or getting upset by it as it rewards the conflict igniter.

We have a choice. Avoid them at all costs, set boundaries and remove ourselves from their communication if they disrespect that boundary, or continue trying to make them understand and hence, change. I was taught it was my responsibility to listen, to apologize, to accept each person's gossip as fact. I thought it was only my family that did that but

Now that I'm better, it turns out a third party rarely has my best interests at heart. Often they are greatly mistaken in their comments anyway. I don't have any of those family members in my life anymore except my older sister, and annual email from my younger, but our communications are respectful now. That's saying a lot considering the war zone our childhoods were.

We have the power to disarm all gossip said against us by refusing to hear it or entertain it in our heads. I'm sorry your family is like that. I know how bad that hurts. You and your hubby deserve better.
 
Oh CraftyCath, I am so sorry you are dealing with this! It looks like you are the scapegoat, but you don't have to remain that way. Tell them to own their own part in this fiasco. Don't accept the blame. Even if they can't see it, it doesn't matter as long as you can. These people might just be people you have to be superficial with. There are people like that who can't handle more then that. Sounds like they are those people.

I think it is great that your husband is standing by your side in this. I hope he continues to do so. That can make all the difference in the world. When I had a great mishap with my husbands family, he told them one thing and me another. Which I found out and called him on. He would defend his sister saying well that is the way she has always been, as if I was suppose to accept ill treatment, because that is just the way it is. I'm glad your husband is not doing that. Thankfully, she moved far away and I only have to deal with her once a year with all the falsities that brings. Smile smile kiss kiss and then no more. Though I have to say, I avoided seeing her for years. I made it through this year. Just smiled and pretended. I think I can do that in short bursts. Plus I knew that sharing with her anything important or relevant was out of the question. We don't get personal.

Take a deep breath. Do what you need to to feel secure and safe. Remember that these people aren't worth the aggravation and walk away if need be. You are worth respect.
 
I am sorry you are going through this. Sounds so frustrating! The others have already hit on doing what is best for you guys, staying safe, taking care of yourself, and some boundaries, so I don't really have anything to add because they explained it so well.
 
Thank you all so much for your replies, I am deeply grateful.

@BloomInWinter Your words are absolutely spot on and if you don't mind I would like to print off the 'shut down' sentences and read them until they are lodged in my tired brain! I am so sorry you have had problems with your family but you seemed to have learned some valuable lessons and I only hope I can learn them too. Bullying by proxy is something I had never thought of and have just relayed it to my husband. That has opened our eyes as we can see that that has been going on. Thank you. :hug:

@Britt.f7 I am also sorry that you have to deal with family too, why are people so superficial? Is it a result of their own fears? My husband never used to defend me but it has gone so far now that it has pushed him over the edge and he just won'r tolerate it any more. It is so good to have his support. My therapist taught me about the ripples on the water. They form concentric circles and some people will be on the inner circle (usually only a few who you can trust), some will be in the middle but some will have to be kept on the outer circle. I used to let this sister-in-law into my inner circle but I have realised that she turns everything I share against me. I once told her a friend had accused me of deliberately making her daughters depression worse and that I had accuse said friend of child abuse. Non of which were true and the accusations hurt me deeply. Then I told her that my brother had climbed on a bridge when we were out and dropped a load of leaf litter onto my head casing me to be triggered back to my childhood. The 'friend' would not speak to me and has had no contact with me in over 10 years (she was my closest friend), my brother went off in a huff but I wrote him a letter explaining the PTSD and although he will never apologise we now get on much better than before. When I mentioned that her husband was bullying me (although I did not put it that way, I said he kept having a go at me about personal things. They lived in Italy and I had not contact details for him so I sent a letter to her. She said that it was me that had a problem with all these people including her husband. She has since turned the abuse I suffered as a child against me by saying they don't invite me because I have an 'eating disorder.' I have realised I need to do what you have done Britt and, after I have seen her, if she chooses to stay in our circle it will be the outer one.:hug:

@WillowMarie Thank you for your input, it is good to know that others agree with what Bloom and Britt have written.:hug:

OK so the next phase is to see said sister-in-law on her own without her sister body guard. I spoke to her on Christmas day, just polite P's And Q's but when I mentioned meeting up she becomes very 'spiritual.' She says things like, 'father God knows that I have not lied' (Father God knows she has!) and 'Father God sees all.' She seems to use God as a defence mechanism and although my husband and I are Christians we have suffered spiritual abuse and this is difficult for us to deal with. Rather than being open and honest she uses God and forgiveness and become 'preachy' to the point of being condescending. It freaks us out and I'm not sure we will be able to break through that defence.

But, we could try setting boundaries and saying that spiritual talk is to be avoided. It is a big trigger for me so I could ask her to stop it just for the duration of the conversation.

We haven't set a date to see her yet as we are both full of cold and I have a feeling that I have a sinus infection. I will let you know the date when we are better.

Thank you again everyone, it is great to have your support.:hug:
 
Someone quoting God that much has her own issues that she is trying desperately to run from. For people like that, some possible responses:
  • Of course what you say is true for you. Just as what I say is true for me. What's true for me doesn't have to be what's true for you, and that's ok.
  • I choose to keep my spiritual beliefs out of this conversation out of respect for your right to have your beliefs. I'd appreciate the same courtesy.
  • I'd like to spend time together but I don't care to be proselytized. If you must have your God repetitively invoked, I'll have to speak with you another time.
  • Your God may know all, but I'm not your God. I can only go by what is said, observed, and the results.
Not even the Pope feels the need to invoke God into every conversation. Truly healthy, caring people don't need to point out their holiness because it shows in word and deed. The rest are having their own issues. But their issues don't have to be our issues. We don't have to figure out why they do what they do. We only have to trust ourselves and our feelings to know if they are healthy for us to be around.

Also, third parties who bully by proxy are rewarded when we take on the emotions and react as they expect. We stop reinforcing their bad behavior by staying calm, reminding ourselves that they may not be accurate or truthful, and refusing to reward them with anything but a "since I haven't heard this directly I'm going to reserve judgment. Now, let's talk about something else."

People who can only communicate through gossip soon learn to leave it out of the conversation because they realize they have nothing of their own to communicate about.
 
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Oh Bloom thank you so much I think this will be really helpful to Steve and I. :hug:

You are right about the 'bully by proxy' being rewarded by our emotions - they kind of feed off it. I guess this is a big learning curve for me. I will again copy your advice so hubby and I can read it together and feel more prepared when we see his sister.

I cannot thank you enough for sharing your experience with me bloom. :hug:
 
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