I Don't Know....Isn't Enough.

[Yamaha022]

I Don't Know....Isn't Enough.

It's been a little over 7 months since being home from Iraq. In that time (I'm sure I'm preaching to the quior but here goes.) In that time I've managed to loose several "good" friends, a 8-year Relationship/ Engagment, and a 6 year Job. After all that I still feel like I have nothing to complain about. Also in that time for the last 5-6 Months I've been dealing with what now has been brought to my attention "PTSD" and Extreme Depression (product of the ptsd?) I have more friends at the sucide prevention hot-line than I do at home. My real friends don't want to talk to me about my experience unless it involves gore-details that could only be found in a Hollywood movie and the number of people I taken lives from. My Ex thought she would help my sitting in on a memory (Flashback/ Nervous Breakdown) only to follow up with a refference to seeing already dead dog's and cat's in her labs at veternarian school!!! Holy S$!T!!! Who the F$%^ tries to relate to someone with that!!! Who the H$ll would even want to relate! Argg! Sorry I need to take a second and calm down,.......... ok I'm a little better now. Honeslty I feel embarassed about typing all that and a huge part of me wants to just "X" out of the site and forget I have problems. But I made a promiss to my father that I would take care of this. So here I am. I've been through the Wonderfull and Magical VA and now I'm a years supply deep of Prozac and Seraquil. Prozac sucks and the seraquil is only good for sleeping, which only makes the nightmares longer....Go figure. Therapy sucked, Well I shouldn't say that it did help the deppression go down....or was it the fact that my ex left me so now's there's one less problem in my head.....Wait a second NOPE! That just created a whole new one! Thanks concerning, sesitive and patriotic civilian! I'm on another rant again arn't I?...Be right back......
O.k. I'm going to try and get through this one. Honeslty I feel like crap and do believe my problems are very small compared to the right people. Which brings about the emarassment. I love being in the service and I love that I never have as much fun around anyone else other than the unit I'm with and acutally around any other service member, something just clicks automatically i don't know... Anyways, I'm cutting this really short but will try and get back to it tomorrow (my brain's locking up) but the reason why I'm finally here and comitting is becuase my head hurts, not only does it hurt but I honeslty do feel my Mind is out to get me. It starts out of the blue of something totally not having anything to do with the situation at hand and it just takes that thought and RUNS!!! My head can out run the fastest man, car or bullet with a thought. and when it stops is when I find myself shaking uncontrolably and in hystericks, also usually with someone holding me trying to get me to stop becuase it could cause a scene! (EX-Fiance...Nuff said) Also When I'm in that phase of the process I call Hell, the most excrusiating pain known to man (or woman, F#$k child birth, get load of this sh!t and see whats-up) The feelings are un-bareble and the ONLY thought of clearity is THE END! Thoughts of sucide are relieving in enviroment of this pain. It doesn't stop no matter how much you tell it to go away! It feeds on hate, anger and suffering and spits out only more pain, hate, anger and suffering. Thank god or who-ever, that most of my attacks are around family.
I'm on another rant again so let me actually put this on hold and return to it later, I never re-read or edit anything I write so please bare with me if I go "off-base" on a topic. I don't know who reads this or even if anybody really cares but I'm really near to the end of my rope despratly trying to hang-on, Please don't judge me for 1. I don't care, and 2. I just got done talking about potentially ending my life anyways, do you really think your 2 cents matter to me?..... see there I go on another rant. ok this is it...till tomorrow. bye.

 

[anthony]

Hey Yamaha, good to have you here. My actual name is Anthony, I am a veteran and I have PTSD, been helping people with PTSD for over 4 years now. I was diagnosed the severe end... something like what you're experiencing yourself, and let me just say, it can be managed and your life can become a whole shitload better mate. It sounds as though you made a promise to your old man to help yourself. Well... congratulation on doing that. Says something about you already.

Honestly, most of what you have mentioned is all perfectly normal for a veteran to experience with PTSD. There is no magic cure to this, actually there is no cure at all, but it can be managed quite well... each person is different. Some still need meds, some don't, some can work again, some can't... roll the dice. It takes a minimum of 3 - 6 very hard months to heal trauma and then a further 3 - 6 months to just put what you learn into practice. Add another year after that to really refine your learnt skills and apply your knowledge within your life as you choose to do so. You may even find new lows yet, depends how much you want to help yourself at the end of the day. It does get worse before it gets better.

I won't bullshit you, and if you want my help I will help you. If not, this forum is also just here for each of us to talk shit, vent and get things out of our head. Choice is always individual.

I have more friends at the sucide prevention hot-line than I do at home.

As you mentioned at the end of your post... not going to preach to you regardless about suicide. If you want to die, then nothing I say will change that. Only you make the decisions for yourself. When it all gets too much, you either choose to ask for help or you choose to die. End of the day, your choice. Do I personally give a shit about you dieing? Actually... yes. Every single person with PTSD can learn to manage it and get more control over themselves and their life... it can be done. Honestly, I am quite sick and tired or reading about veterans topping themselves from PTSD... usually because they have lacked the right support and knowledge. I tried it... the only thing that stopped me was that the missus at that time had an instinct something was wrong and came home... thus stopping those plans. Relieved now though that she did.

My real friends don't want to talk to me about my experience unless it involves gore-details that could only be found in a Hollywood movie and the number of people I taken lives from.

It's not their fault though. This is what is portrayed on the media... all the bad shit, the newsworthy stuff. It is like telling a real veteran from a cock sucker upon a forum... no actual veteran who has taken a life goes screaming it across any forum, with their friends, etc. Those who have not experienced combat think its cool... they just do not understand. Age has a lot to do with it also... the younger they are, the less they understand.

My Ex thought she would help my sitting in on a memory (Flashback/ Nervous Breakdown) only to follow up with a refference to seeing already dead dog's and cat's in her labs at veternarian school!!! Holy S$!T!!! Who the F$%^ tries to relate to someone with that!!!

Sure, a silly reaction to what was occurring, but unless she is experienced with PTSD, she has absolutely no idea about what to say, do or how to handle things in regard to you with PTSD. Unless you know PTSD and are experienced in it, no idea. Not her fault... sounds to me like she was trying to help, she just failed that's all. Most will who have no idea about it.

Honeslty I feel embarassed about typing all that and a huge part of me wants to just "X" out of the site and forget I have problems. But I made a promiss to my father that I would take care of this.

That is incentive... a promise to your father. There is nothing you say that other veterans haven't seen, heard or experienced for themselves. You would be quite shocked to say the least just how much others with PTSD and especially veterans, will "get you" and what you say.

So here I am. I've been through the Wonderfull and Magical VA and now I'm a years supply deep of Prozac and Seraquil. Prozac sucks and the seraquil is only good for sleeping, which only makes the nightmares longer....Go figure.

The problem right now is that the mental health profession is so overwhelmed with cases, and the fact the industry is getting lazy and/or money hungry... is that medication is about the only thing they have the time or the inclination to do nowadays. Medication is not a solution, usually its more a hinderance or cause of more problems for you. Yes... it can and is a good relief / stabiliser for trauma therapy. Some people need it for life, some refuse it, some will use it as and when they need, then drop it.

Therapy sucked, Well I shouldn't say that it did help the deppression go down....or was it the fact that my ex left me so now's there's one less problem in my head.....Wait a second NOPE!

Cognitive Behavioural Therapy is the best for veterans and for PTSD. It has the highest success rate to actually assist the person in learning how to manage PTSD, regain social skills and get back into life. EMDR is what many lean towards nowadays, though all that does is assist to recall the trauma... it doesn't diminish the overall extent of symptoms for PTSD. Trauma is the cause for many of the symptoms you experience, however; as a soldier you are also trained to have some symptoms of PTSD, being hypervigilance, extreme startle response and the aggression / anger is much worse in veterans due to training. Just think back to bayonet training, assault courses, etc... you are trained and programmed to respond aggressively to something you feel threatens you. The problem with PTSD is that the poor bugger minding his own business walking down the other side of the street who glances across at you, has now become the enemy and increased your fear response, which you are trained to respond aggressively, hence knocking his block off or getting into fights. Starting to ring bells?

Anyways, I'm cutting this really short but will try and get back to it tomorrow (my brain's locking up) but the reason why I'm finally here and comitting is becuase my head hurts, not only does it hurt but I honeslty do feel my Mind is out to get me.

The solution here is patience, and that you slowly learn everything you can about PTSD, about the symptoms and learn why you do things, why things are happening, etc... knowledge brings answers, which ultimately brings understanding for your brain. With that you can learn to retrain your brain. It is impossible for me to just tell you to do something without you knowing why and what it does... because you would just not do it or give up after one failed attempt. This is why you need to learn and understand everything PTSD.

It is nothing for the toilet paper to be the wrong way round and it sets you off. It has nothing to do with the toilet paper or the person who put it the wrong way round, it has to do with what is happening within you.

Anger

Many think anger is an emotion. Not exactly. Anger is an emotional response. That means to get anger, you actually first feel something else. You don't just get angry, you get frustrated, fear, disappointment, regret, etc... there is always an underlying feeling to anger.

A starting point for you. There is whats called the 10 second rule. When you are at the point of rage, likely open your mouth and begin abusing others, yelling, etc... learn to stop yourself, pause for 10 seconds, think about what is being said, think about what has happened and what you actually feel. If you feel angry, rage, so on... then you don't feel that at all, you feel something else. If someone is frustrating you, then using the 10 second rule you would instead respond, "you are frustrating me" instead of yelling, ranting and raving, pissing people off, upsetting yourself further, so on. You get the idea no doubt.

It works.

 

[Yamaha022]

Wow, um... I'm kindof speechless. "You hit the nail on the head" is the only thing that comes to mind. After reading your reply several times I feel as if we knew each other for years, not to sound wierd or creepy? but Usually when I spout off like that I get really lame answers back that couldn't be further from the truth or atleast it's "the right words" with out the experience or feelings behind it, you know? Being 21yrs old, what you said about my friends makes alot of sence, after going through the motions of being in the military and it's "way of life" I've always noticed I've become a little more mature than them, never stopped me from being around them because well, they are my friends but after what you said, it makes more sense now. Also since being over there, the only thing that we were allowed to watch "news" wise was BBC (Go figure) and since then I've watched nothing but it. kicks and giggles I tuned CNN on, got about 3 minutes into it and had to turn it off, it was sicking and I can't believe that this country allows that to go on. (Byast, Corrupted News) Anyhow, I really could go through all your points but they would all end with "It makes so much sense now." And also "It's like you were there." Which I'm sure you were, I'm sure everyone on this site was, and now I really do know that "Good, Genuine Help is out there." You did mention you would offer help but only if I was to take it and actually use it. My way of thinking latley has brought me to the style of "It can't get any worse so I'm in no position to turn down anything!" My E-mail is [email protected] I usually check it once a day (unless I'm racing then it's postponed a few days.
Once again After posting on this site I do feel genuine help is out there and I am more confortable about talking with well...everyone who is a part of this. Thank you Anthony, you help tremendous. I'll look forward to hearing from you.
Thanks again,
Doug.

 

[anthony]

Doug,

More than happy to help you and more importantly, extremely glad you want to help yourself. The reason I ask that from any person, is because you cannot help someone who doesn't want to first and foremost help themselves. Well done.

The deal is simply this. You tell me what the issue is, and I will begin educating you, pointing you in the direction of factual information, etc, that is going to benefit you. I am not a therapist, but I have read just about every piece of information that they have, most of which is useless shit and useless to assist with PTSD. Basically, peopel I help get the no bullshit version, the stuff that is going to help them.

There is no one solution fits all for PTSD. We may get it right for you straight away, it may take a few different approaches / methods to find what works for you. Again, there is nothing in concrete with what will work for you. We will get the result though at the end, being you feeling much better day to day and atleast able to get back into life in some aspect more than you are now.

There are plenty of topics on this forum, so as it hits you, create a topic and tell me the issue. I do not need to know anything of a secret nature, anything that you know is a military secret and you are only allowed to discuss with those who served that mission or military pers. If there are things that you do not wish to put here, then you can send me an email... I have sent you one to your account.

I honestly prefer most of the discussion to be on this forum, because what I have found from running ptsdforum.org all these years, is that what helps you will have a flow on effect to help many many more who just read and relate. Hope that is ok.

Look forward to getting you into a better way of life mate.

Anthony

 

[Yamaha022]

With this I agree with you. I guess then I'll start off with the most current being tonights events. I recently moved north of my original location by 270 miles, moved in with close friends (the ones I mentioned before) Though probably not the best I do find myself closest to them and do find more happy times than bad times around them, (home wasn't a good atmosphere to be in so...) My friend Brett's 22nd birthday was today so we celebrated with pizza and a beer, already this morning something wasn't feeling right (I tried to ignore it) sure enough we get to the parlor with his parents, Brett, my other friend Jeff and their female friend from school who I've met before but nothing more than that. The whole time at the parlor I'm in the "Hyperension, always looking around and basically (Not on this planet) mentality" So the whole time I'm a "bit" edgy. Remaining silent the whole time because in past experiences when I'm feeling this way I've tried to talk it out or explain it to others I'm around and it always ends in horriable failure (can't blame them, if I was normal I would probably think the same thing) So the whole time I was dead silent and could honestly sware that I was infact a ghost and could easily slip away andno one would notice, in fact I stared at a "Oddly dressed" Male and had he flintch I probably would've jump the table and so on.... So once again silent and constanly looking around "Being Vigilant" Bretts mother grabs my arm to get my attention to ask me how are things going in my life. I flintched and jerked my arm away without thinking about it and scared her, by the time it was over, I felt worse, as if I can't be in public around the ones I love and care for and mainly the reason why I went to "sacrifise 6 years of my life" (who knew it would end up costing more ;} )..........where was I?.... O.k. so I scared her and promtly replyed with "I'm sorry I'm just not paying attention and you startled me, that's all.
After staring out the windows watching people, cars etc. go by (which none had indications of I.E.D's haha) My ears picked up on the converstion they were having about my friends dad (is a cop) and his partner served as a helo pilot in Vietnam. First question out of Jeff's mouth was did he kill anybody!? (My head instantly ran with it!!) Anger, Fustration, Hate, and anything else that I can't describe filled my head and soul. (sorry to go Hallmark on you but it's what I felt) His dad handled it well actually by thinking logicaly and replying back with "Well he was a pilot so NO, the "Gunners" in his helo did but he did not." my emotions started going back to normal....but wait it just can end like that!...Can it? Jeff fired back with an excited COOL!!! I couldn't contain myself, I had to say it....."Jeff if you think killing is so F-Ing cool and sweet, why don't you join the service, do some crazy ass job like I don't some kind of Special Forces or the Forgien Legion? Whats there Death to Kill ratio?" his reply was the best I've ever heard! "Why would I go waste my life on that!?"

I guess my real answer is right there in that last statement, I mean here I am serving my country because I feel I owe it, I had a great life growing up, I was rich but I wasn't poor, I earned my keep like everyone else. Hell I had a job at 10 years old wiping down motorcycles at the shop my mom worked at. Lol it wasn't much, actually I think I made all of 50 cents a day which was enough to by a soda and a hand full of skittles (I Don't recomend mixing the two together by the way lol) O.k. so you have the point, I was a 19 year old KID yes KID Thought I'd serve my country, pay my dues, then go to college and start my real life (which actually I consider my military side my real life, I love it.....Even still.) So all in all, his statement blew me out of the water and, out of shame for him but also embarassment on my behalf (Because I forgot why I did what I did) I bowed my head and went on to drink my beer. The rest of the time was spent talking about brett and his future ( it's his birthday so thats what the topic should be anyways, I wasn't bothered by it.) The pizza ended and we left, his parents in thier car and the female drove the rest of us home, I rode back left window (lol the same position in well, over there.) New cars these days have window locks, personally it could be freezing outside and I still will have the window down, I love fresh air and thats it! So I kindly ask the female to lower my window, she does and half way it goes, Ill take what I can get (training kicked in) and be happy with it. no more than a minute later It goes up, I kindly (still in super shit mode from earlier) ask why and also can it go back down? Female replies with "No it makes a stupid whop whop air sound because the rest of the windows are up!" I'm not adding the ! marks, she really was pissed off at me about it!
without thinking twice (yet again) I unlock the window and open the door, (I needed to the air to pull me back down to reality) I don't know why, it just helped for some reason and I couldn't wait till home. I wasn't going to jump out or anything, I just wanted some fresh freaking air, and honestly a F-ing thump whop sound is miniscule compared to where I was in my head! I'm sure someone out there understands, like it's not just that, the other day I was in the grocery store and the person in front of me called the manager to fuss about a expired couon that was only good for 20 cents off the product anyways, like COMON YOUNG MEN AND WOMEN ARE DIEING EVERY DAY OVER A WAR NOBODY SUPPORTS IN THE FIRST PLACE!!!! I CAN'T COUNT HOW MANY 18-20 YR OLD SOLDIERS I SALUTED GETTING ON A F-ING PLANE!!! AND THATS JUST 18-20 YEARS OLD!!!! HALF OF THEM NEVER NEW WHAT A BEER TASTE LIKE, A WOMAN/ MAN FEELS LIKE OR EVEN SEE THE LOOK ON THIER PARENTS FACE WHEN THEY RIDE DOWN THE ESCILATORS AT THE AIRPORT AND THE FEELINGS OF ACOMPLISHMENT AND PRIDE FILL YOUR BODY TO THE POINT OF UNBARABLE ONLY TO FALL INTO THIER ARMS AND FOR THAT MOMENT KNOWING THAT ABSOLUTLY NOTHING CAN HARM YOU....... o.k. brake time...... o.k. back, I write as if I'm talking to someone in real time ( I feel it helps visualize eveything, and also it's more personal.) Anyways tonight just shouldn't have happend, I went becuase I care about my friends and what I consider family to the point of puting myself on hold, unfortunatly I'm just not as good as I was at going about it.
Right now all that I want to say is I'm sorry, this has been my thought process and it's going to eat me alive, I say I'm sorry because I feel that when I share whats going on in my head I feel after all is out that I've only put my burden on them which is not right, it mine and mine alone, so I tend to stay quite, and I loose the ones I care about anyways which only brings me back to the head topic of all this and that is simply "I don't know." I'm at a point where both sides of the equation equal to nothing, If I push through then I'm a freak kid with some f-ed up head that can't act "Normal" around anyone, and if I do my-self in I still end up with nothing, and now I've hurt the ones who actually care! Then that starts in on "Why can't I be happy with just those ones that truelly care! Why can't my head focus on that aspect and feed off that!? It's like my head's hungry and my family and friends who truely care are Vegitables and all the evil, anger, fustrating pain and suffering around me is like... Sugary Krack!....Did that last one make sense? I re-read it and it checked out (which usually means the opposite) anyways, I need to stop while I'm ahead, I appreciate the direct e-mail, and will continue to use this method as you have asked. with this moment of clarity in my head (So nice!) If anyone else is reading this and ANY of this makes sense to you, please come forward, in only 48 hours of Venting on this site, it has helped, I feel I can vommit all the thoughts onto this and what doesn't make sense to me someone else it might and can shed light on it. lol even with trying to show others hope I ramble and rant. Anyways, till tomorrow.

 

[anthony]

I do find myself closest to them and do find more happy times than bad times around them

That is all that is important really. One of the most important things to help yourself deal with your past trauma, is to be within an environment you feel your best within, or atleast safe, secure and nobody is adding to your issues.

I'm in the "Hyperension, always looking around and basically (Not on this planet) mentality" So the whole time I'm a "bit" edgy.

What is normal Doug? Normal can be determined individually or collectively, ie. what you perceive to be normal or socially acceptable. Socially acceptable is the defined term for normal, though does not fit individually. There is a line you must draw at wanting to fit in with also being yourself. Don't ever forget who you are as a person over fitting in or trying to be something you are not. The only person who suffers is you.

Bretts mother grabs my arm to get my attention to ask me how are things going in my life. I flintched and jerked my arm away without thinking about it and scared her... ...O.k. so I scared her and promtly replyed with "I'm sorry I'm just not paying attention and you startled me, that's all.

I would say... well done. You had a reaction, you explained that reaction to her... which no doubt she likely accepted considering it was true. She did startle you.

His dad handled it well actually by thinking logicaly and replying back with "Well he was a pilot so NO, the "Gunners" in his helo did but he did not." my emotions started going back to normal....

This is an exact type of response that you obtain using something like the 10 second rule. You said it yourself, "logic". The first response that can often come to your mind is one based on their ignorance, likely resulting in aggression. 10 seconds is enough time for you to process your own response if the first response is aggressive. The choice is always yours though. The idea of this is to slowly retrain your brain into rethinking your responses. Whilst it may take a little longer at first to do, and you could look a little silly not responding immediately, you only ever need say something along the lines off, "I am thinking about the response for a few seconds" and leave it at that, then respond with a more logical view. As you get better at it, you will then respond quite rationally and what is perceived a more normal quick response. The more accurate name is called, assertive response.

Jeff fired back with an excited COOL!!! I couldn't contain myself, I had to say it....."Jeff if you think killing is so F-Ing cool and sweet, why don't you join the service, do some crazy ass job like I don't some kind of Special Forces or the Forgien Legion?

You have two or three options that come to mind with people who say such things:

1. You bite your tongue and say nothing, absolutely zero response, even walk away if required, get a drink, go to the toilet, etc, or
2. You ask them the question... "What do you believe is cool about killing another human being?" Even cocky teenagers can struggle with that one... Again, the response can be walked away from or questioned... but at no time should you defend.
3. Tell them the truth about what its like to take a life, in detail, the emotion, the after effects, the damage it has upon you after the fact. Again, most cocky teenagers even shutup after it has been explained in not a sarcastic method, but an honest and emotional one.

So all in all, his statement blew me out of the water and, out of shame for him but also embarassment on my behalf (Because I forgot why I did what I did) I bowed my head and went on to drink my beer.

Do you really think you are at the stage to take on such conversation though? Don't be ashamed of walking away from such topics, many veterans do because you cannot explain something like war to someone who hasn't experienced it. I honestly never tried myself, unless it was someone who was legitimately interested in me, not what I had done.

lol the same position in well, over there

Now, this is something you can change by forcing yourself to not be in that position within a vehicle. Sure, if it ends up that way, but otherwise, try to intentionally be seated in other positions. Logically work through the reality of the situation. The situation is that you are no longer in a war zone, you are home and in a civilian environment.

like it's not just that, the other day I was in the grocery store and the person in front of me called the manager to fuss about a expired couon that was only good for 20 cents off the product anyways, like COMON YOUNG MEN AND WOMEN ARE DIEING EVERY DAY OVER A WAR NOBODY SUPPORTS IN THE FIRST PLACE!!!! I CAN'T COUNT HOW MANY 18-20 YR OLD SOLDIERS I SALUTED GETTING ON A F-ING PLANE!!! AND THATS JUST 18-20 YEARS OLD!!!! HALF OF THEM NEVER NEW WHAT A BEER TASTE LIKE, A WOMAN/ MAN FEELS LIKE OR EVEN SEE THE LOOK ON THIER PARENTS FACE WHEN THEY RIDE DOWN THE ESCILATORS AT THE AIRPORT AND THE FEELINGS OF ACOMPLISHMENT AND PRIDE FILL YOUR BODY TO THE POINT OF UNBARABLE ONLY TO FALL INTO THIER ARMS AND FOR THAT MOMENT KNOWING THAT ABSOLUTLY NOTHING CAN HARM YOU.......

Ok... now we are getting closer to some of the normal issues that veterans have. Anger towards civilians. Why? Because you have experienced something that they have not. Something you must understand and come to terms with in your own time, is that your experience has changed you, it has changed your priorities in life. When you have seen life and death, been in charge of life and death, many day to day decisions become obsolete to you, they are a nothing decision, however; to any other person they are an important day to day decision, something that they find important. Are we as veterans any better than any other person in this world? The answer is NO. We chose to serve our countries, we volunteered to serve which we knew could mean serve within a war zone. We are responsible for our PTSD, not the military.

In many cases off PTSD, the sufferer is not responsible for it, ie. raped, abused, childhood abuse, robbery, assault, etc... people are not responsible in such circumstances because their was a person who did wrong by them. We unfortunately did wrong by ourselves the moment we chose to sign on the dotted line. Sure, we didn't know about the consequences of PTSD, but we knew the consequences could be death. We accepted all consequences the moment we accepted the likelihood that death was the result of our actions.

I feel that when I share whats going on in my head I feel after all is out that I've only put my burden on them which is not right, it mine and mine alone, so I tend to stay quite, and I loose the ones I care about

Doug, been there, done that one and learnt the hard way also. Here is the most important thing you must come to terms with in this regard. DO NOT think for others. If someone is legitimately concerned for you and they want to help you, then do not think for them, do not presume you know what they think, only ever ask or explain your feelings just as you did right here. People can understand the truth, what they cannot understand is being told nothing when they see you hurting. If someone close to you is open for you to talk too, then don't think on their behalf, just respect their decision that they want to listen to you. If anything becomes too much, then they should say stop. You can even set such a boundary to someone you feel safe with and they wish for you to talk with them personally. If it gets too much for them, they only need say stop to rest and process what has been said. This is the exact reason we veterans push our loved ones away from us, partners, family and friends. The most important thing is learning not to think for others and instead ask them.

and if I do my-self in I still end up with nothing, and now I've hurt the ones who actually care!

I'm actually pretty impressed and relieved that you stated this Doug, because quite honestly many don't think about the aftermath of suicide, they just think that it will end their pain. Well... it usually only causes more pain. This says that your not going to do anything stupid, which is a good thing. Well done.... progress in such a short time.

Doug, most of this above though is the sugar coating on the actual problems. The core of the problems that produce all these symptoms is the trauma itself. The trauma is what we need to work on mainly, in conjunction with any now issues you have or experience. Present is always important, though the past is what's causing the majority of the issues for you.

If you had to list the 10 worst traumatic experiences of your life in point form, what would they be? There is no requirement to use names or locations if you are not allowed or feel you do not want too, just what you are comfortable with. Example:

• Ambushed on a vehicle control where a buddy died whilst watching others trying to revive him...
• etc etc...

These points are usually the top 10 thinks on your brain that are causing you the most distress as a result.

 

[DeadParagon]

Welcome brother. You are definitely not alone. Rant as much as you need to bro. Its really therapeutic. I can relate to so much of what your going through. That feeling of not being a part of the world. It's almost as like the world is in a giant bubble. Everybody is in that bubble and so are you physically, but you're really floating on the outside looking in. And so many things seem meaningless. Why the hell do these civilians care so much about this crap?! Maybe if they got a little taste of some death, destruction, and helplessness, then they would really know whats going on. Then they would see things the way we see them. Unfortunately(fortunately?) it doesnt work that way. We have crossed a line of no return and we must now accept that this is who we are and where we are. Anthony (Generic) is the best with the advice. He helped me understand more about my issues in one post than my efforts of making sense of this in the past 2 years.
Haha..the Magical and Wonderful VA! I used to call it the Evil Empire. I got over that though. I used to be so resentful of them. Even to the point where I thought about running into the claims building, shooting the security guards, holding the claims reps hostage (only the civilian ones, not any veterans of course), and demanding that the VA immediately and correctly handles all veterans' claims that are disabled, suffering, and being subjected to their nonsense. I was suicidal too, so I knew it would be a one way mission. I knew I wouldn't make it out of that building alive, and I was fine with that. That was how I was thinking about half a year ago. I thought about suicide by cop. I thought about jumping off a bridge. I thought about jumping in front of a train. I thought about overdosing. The final draw was putting the barrel of the loaded 12 gauge to my mouth. Then I thought about my mother finding me with my head blown off and blood splattered all over the place. I thought about the funeral and all the people I would have hurt. My dad's guilt, that he somehow failed at being a father. My grandparents that lost their only grandson that they loved dearly. And I thought about all the other troops and soldiers that survived the war overseas only to end it all when they came home. You get the picture. I checked myself into the VA after that. I spent 6 months in Montrose. It got worse before it got better. Im still struggling tremendously, but Im no longer suicidal. I had to really become educated about this and really accept that I have PTSD. Staying in denial was going to kill me.

I honeslty do feel my Mind is out to get me

That statement hits so close to home for me. I used to say that iraq is still trying to kill me even though I made it home. And even when I made it home... did I really make it home?? My mind tells me I don't belong here. My mind tells me that I cant successfully work a civilian job, because I belong in the war zone. My mind tells me I can't be in a relationship because I am incapable of loving anyone. And no bullshit! My mind tells me I need to go back to war to "finish the chapter" (die!). Almost as though I was supposed to die the first time, but there was a glitch in the system that needs to be corrected (with my death).

I dont know if you seen "The Hurt Locker" (if you didn't, then I wouldn't suggest you do (at least not yet) because war movies have the tendency to "bring us back"). But if you did, then Im sure you recall the seen towards the end when he was in the supermarket with his wife. That scene made so much sense to me. I dont think too many civilians can understand it though. That short scene was so profound for me and actually messed me up for a while (I hope you guys understand).

Trying to explain how you feel to your old friends can get really frustrating. I try to stick really close to my veterans now. You guys are my brothers.

Im all scatterbrains right now so I really don't know where Im going with all this. I just want you to know that I feel your pain and I know what your going through. However, I almost had my life taken away but didn't have to take a life. Im deeply sorry that you have to go through that. But stick to these forums and let it all out man. Don't carry the crap around with you for too long.

And as far as the VA. The therapy sucks at first but it gets better and you will get positive results. You wont be cured, but you'll get positive results. It helps to talk it out with the vets in your groups. I am so damn grateful for them. And I am so damn grateful for this forum and all the feedback. BTW, try to get a good psychiatrist. Don't let them overmedicate you. My email is [email protected]. I get emails directly to my phone so hit me up anytime.

Take care brother
Mike

 

[anthony]

And as far as the VA. The therapy sucks at first but it gets better and you will get positive results... ...It helps to talk it out with the vets in your groups..

Excellent points Mike... if the VA has group therapy, that is beneficial because you get out of it what you put into it. I found understanding from others who whilst in the same bad place as myself at that time, we all had our positive attributes where we were all at different places within our own heads that we could help fill in the blanks for one another for many aspects. Group therapy with other vets I found extremely beneficial.