MJ Docu Triggering anyone?

[EveHarrington]

I see no problem. MJ was a brilliant performer & he was a pedophile. He can be both. Happens all the time. Beloved minister & keeps a mistress on the side. Brilliant highly revered law student & a serial killer. Can be both.

I’m referring to the not wanting to believe it part, not the loving him as a performer part.

 

[Sideways]

MJ was a great musician & he was a paedophile. Can be both. See it all the time. A married renowned minister who has *saved* many people & has a mistress on the side. Successful/respected CPA who has saved the financial lives of many people & embezzled my from his company. A brilliant law student who helps everyone he knows & a serial killer.

Can they stay that though?

Do you keep listening to the minister about how to be a good person, or is he now waaaaaay too much of a hypocrite? The successful CPA has his ‘success’ taken away and gets thrown in prison, because now people understand what that ‘success’ was really all about. The serial killer law student (wtf!?) ends up in prison for life.

Yes, he was a great musician. Makes my stomach turn, but previously, that’s what we thought. Brilliant musician.

Now though? Perspective changes. We have insight into what the cost was of all that ‘brilliance’.

Certainly for me? He may have been a brilliant musician. I may have loved his music. But what I know about him now? That simply can’t co-exist with his previously revered status, but more than that, I can’t listen to his music anymore and simply ignore the part where “and he was a pedophile” or somehow let that ‘coexist’ with his musical brilliance.

Sometimes, people do things that are so awful, that me personally? I think it does make it irrelevant what their achievements were in the past. His music is tainted with the children whose lives he destroyed. Listening to his music not only reminds me of that, it tips my hat towards his legacy by sending some more royalties to his estate.

Nup. I can understand some people don’t wanna let go of the music. For me? That music has come at way too high a price. What he’s done absolutely swamps any ‘greatness’ he may once have had.

 

[Starfire]

His music is tainted with the children whose lives he destroyed. Listening to his music not only reminds me of that, it tips my hat towards his legacy by sending some more royalties to his estate.

Nup. I can understand some people don’t wanna let go of the music. For me? That music has come at way too high a price. What he’s done absolutely swamps any ‘greatness’ he may once have had.

Have the same reaction. Can't listen to his music without thinking of his *crimes*. Don't know if that's my history unable to separate where others can.

After I replied I remembered the Catholic priests who are still in office & supported by their parishes even tho they are listed as abusing kids. The statute of limitations has expired. So they can't be prosecuted. BTW the serial killer was Ted Bundy & he was executed.

 

[blackemerald1]

The serial killer law student (wtf!?)

BTW the serial killer was Ted Bundy & he was executed.

Bundy abandoned Law school so he wasn't that brilliant. He made a lot of noise about going into Politics etc., but he didn't have the talent.

He did volunteer at a hot line for victims of trauma - so he probably was getting off on hearing ppl tell him things he'd otherwise not be privy to. Possibly he learned a lot about victims, police procedure etc from sitting in that chair.

He was apparently quite charismatic but behind everyone's back he was killing women... so though nobody is accusing MJ of killing anyone, it's easy to see how the right type of personality can hide such dark & sick secrets.

Yes.. Bundy was executed.

It seems obvious now, what MJ was doing. I mean I thought his behaviour was always a bit odd but I didn't know about these children. I really wasn't taking any notice and I wonder if that's why he got away with it all. His 'star power' blinded those close to him, his money and influence drowned out and overwhelmed any lurking concerns.

I too don't think it's important that these victims did not report crimes of sexual assault by MJ at the time they were being molested. Their parents were not protecting them and in fact were likely promoting the circumstances and MJ's behaviour with their sons.

I wish he was around today to go to trial and be prosecuted and be put in prison. That would be justice. Money wouldn't save him in there for too long. :)

 

[Friday]

Nup. I can understand some people don’t wanna let go of the music. For me? That music has come at way too high a price. What he’s done absolutely swamps any ‘greatness’ he may once have had.

I’ve just never really been a fan of lynch mobs. They get it wrong far more often than they get it right. Righteous horror. Not a lot of things more dangerous in my experience.

Just look how fast most people have tried, convicted, and sentenced a man based off of a single highly edited video with a clearly stated agenda. Did it take anyone the whole 2 hours, do you think?

Righteous horror.

Get the rope.

Pass.

 

[EveHarrington]

For those who saw the documentary, can you comment on whether the victim(s) whose parents handed them over to MJ in the middle of the night, etc, are these victims angry at their parent(s)? Are they holding their parent(s) responsible?

I can’t remember where I saw one of the parents admit to the whole “midlife the night supply” thing.

 

[blackemerald1]

I've not seen the doco in it's entirety - just cannot concentrate that long atm.

But I did see where one of the mothers said words similar to, 'I only had one job and I f*ked it up'.

But of course she is using that horrible thing called hindsight.

Personally I have a lot of things I would do differently or undo if I had hindsight at the time I did them! :rolleyes"

 

[Sideways]

can you comment on whether the victim(s) whose parents handed them over to MJ in the middle of the night, etc, are these victims angry at their parent(s)? Are they holding their parent(s) responsible?

This was really interesting, because the mums of both victims were a big part of the documentary, providing their own recollections, and attempts at justification, as the guys told their story.

At the time of the documentary, it seemed to me that at least one of the victims hadn’t forgiven his mum, and that seemed to be largely unresolved pain for both of them, as well as the siblings.

For the other, it was hard to tell. The mum seemed to catch on earlier, but that seemed to be because the impact on her son’s mental health was far more apparent at a much earlier stage (and I think he told his mum much earlier?). He didn’t have any siblings to comment, but certainly his wife spoke at length to the way his mental health had fallen apart over the years, and how he had in fact taken a much earlier stand against MJ and stopped supporting him (for example, he refused to testify at the criminal trial on MJ’s behalf, which the first victim agreed to do).

It was actually the way the doco involved the family members who were present, and their insights, that largely kept me watching. Why would a mother leave her son alone to sleep with a complete adult stranger (albeit a superstar).

I thought it was an interesting insight. And it certainly left me wondering if maybe I’ve got some of my own unresolved anger at my parents. It was definitely an unresolved issue that one of the 2 families were dealing with at the time of filming.

I watched all of it in parts. Whilst I can see what you’re saying @Friday, I think there’s a point where you add up what’s been presented to you and decide: can I support this man’s legacy or not? For me? The answer is a clear no. That’s not about lynching. MJ won’t spend any time in prison as a result of these allegations. Doesn’t mean I ignore it altogether simply because it hasn’t been proved in a court.

MJ paid the first alleged victim $10 million to keep it out of court. That’s not a guilty verdict, but it’s a long way from a vindication. As to the trial? The star (then child) witness has recanted. I’ll switch radio stations based on what I’ve been told. He’s never been convicted, but I simply can’t support his estate. Just can’t. Too much of what I heard? Is exactly what I’ve said myself over the years, and victims aren’t obliged to stay silent simply because their abuser can no longer be tried before a court.

Difficult call though.

 

[Starfire]

For those who saw the documentary, can you comment on whether the victim(s) whose parents handed them over to MJ in the middle of the night, etc, are these victims angry at their parent(s)? Are they holding their parent(s) responsible?

I can’t remember where I saw one of the parents admit to the whole “midlife the night supply” thing.

They got caught up on the whole celebrity thing as well...Best hotels, no expense trips, anything, anywhere. One mother seemed to actually consider him a son figure. MJ played up his lack of normal childhood, his inability to just go out for a walk as an adult. Actually did with one child at night. Grooming the whole family. Both boys, now men, said they were working on forgiveness. Boys weren't *sent* to MJ. They spent the day with him then seemed an extension to watch movies in MJ's threater, play with MJ's train in his bedroom etc. MJ invited kid up on stage to dance with him, which launched his career at 10 years old. MJ repeatedly told the boys he loved them & nobody loved MJ. As well as if anybody found out they would *both* go to jail for the rest of their lives. They even played a game to see how fast the boys could get dressed even tho MJ had alarms set outside all his rooms. If you don't want to watch 4 hours, just view Oprah's short interview. Eye opening.

 

[ChildofGod]

I used to be a huge fan of his music, dance and voice. I am sorry I watched any of it. No longer a fan. That's my two cents.