Problems With The Feeling Of Healthy Entitlement/expectations As A Child

[Hashi]

Recently I spilled hot soup on myself and had a strange reaction. I felt like I was a child and there was a sort of wrongness to it, like I was entitled to not be accidentally scalded or at least that I didn't expect it. It's hard to explain, because I don't remember ever feeling anything like this as a child. I was abused and very dissociated. The sensory memories have always been without any sense of entitlement or expectation.

I don't see this as any kind of flashback or memory to something I'd forgotten, but maybe to something I had to suppress? It felt like a sort of processing/re-wiring.

It was actually a shock to think that sort of feeling as a child even exists. In the same way that it's a shock to find our how much easier life is if I have a day when my long-term depression eases a bit. And, like with considering how different life would be without depression, it's hard to consider how different life would have been if I'd had a different kind of childhood. Of course I've always known that cognitively but this experience made me feel it on a non-cognitive level, and it's a struggle to process that.

I just wondered if anyone could relate or had any thoughts?

By the way, I wish very much I could be back with my therapist right now working on childhood stuff but I can't afford it. Unfortunately , therapy will have to wait a bit but childhood stuff coming up for me doesn't seem to want to wait.

Also, just to explain that I don't relate to "inner child" ideas at all. Not going to discuss that further (been there, done that before) but just saying it because I'd really appreciate any responses that don't reference an "inner child". Thanks.

 

[Resilientbibliophile]

Your nonreaction could have cued memories of habits of self repression where translating thoughts to action was disallowed for circumstance. To presently register that choice does in fact exist to exclaim discomfort is part of your healing process I do believe. Call it a trauma echo; i.e. memories of a fitfully constructed adaptive mechanism dating from your youth that can now be retired.

While not quite the same thing, there was a time when I fitfully tried to adapt to a work environment where I was surrounded on all sides by evangelical Christians who perceived the world in a very specific way that I did not strictly share. I didn't possess the maturity or self-understanding at the time to register that many of the things said and done there were not strictly reconcilable to my own way of thinking and believing, whereas please understand that no one in this environment could honestly register the legitimacy of my severe discomfort for being so-situated. In short, my discomfort could not be officially recognized by those I was surrounded by - as though no conceptual language existed within them to lend the slightest weight to what I dared not communicate.

In an adult sense this would parallel the experience you describe for then I had no outlet for what I was really feeling and felt no recourse to defend myself from felt harm. Reading your words now cements this impression within myself. Thanks...

 

[franciemarnie]

I trust what you felt - that it was a processing/rewiring. And that, though strange, could be good. I have to think about if something similar ever happened to me.

 

[Seasounds]

What I like is the self-respect that comes through; I think it can be a sign of deep healing.

Just had an experience, where healthy righteousness resounded in my being, instead of hopelessness, after a trigger. I don't know if this resonates with you.

Nevertheless, with all the psychological theories (blank slate, learned slate, etc.), I do wonder if, as animals, we hold, inherently, a knowingness of respect (a baseline of sorts), from which we compare our daily experiences?

On another note, that you might use while processing your wxperience. mirror neurons give us the ability to psychophysical my register people's intentions, before we can form language.

Healing.

 

[Leigh925]

I am sorry to say that I don't have an answer for you...only that you are not alone. I have had very similar experiences and had this feeling of being in trouble or shame wash over me. I have been working on more immediate things with my therapist but your post reminded that this is something I had wanted to discuss with him but got sidetracked. I really want to know what this is. I am grateful your post brought this to my attention again so I can address it! I am anxious to hear the responses of others. Maybe we both can get some answers! That is what I love so much about this forum.

 

[joeylittle]

...In the same way that it's a shock to find our how much easier life is if I have a day when my long-term depression eases a bit. And, like with considering how different life would be without depression, it's hard to consider how different life would have been if I'd had a different kind of childhood.

I remember the moment my depression briefly lifted; it was four years ago (before I presented with PTSD) and the effect was about 20 minutes long.

I had been on Wellbutrin for about a week, titrating up, seeing if it would be a good add-on to my other meds that weren't working well enough. I was driving and suddenly I actually had the experience I've read and heard about so many times: colors actually got brighter. I wanted to be alive. Nothing felt insurmountable.

It was so shocking I pulled the car over and just sat there. I literally did not know how to process what I was seeing and feeling.

(Turns out there's a common effect with that drug, a sort of "false positive" that can create a euphoric state for a brief little window. I never got the feeling back again)

Possibly a more relevant example: when I first started treating my depression with medication, 6 years ago, it was because of a really pronounced shift from Dysthemia to a major depressive episode.

The first positive effect I noticed from the meds was that I could physically feel hungry - you know, that empty-stomach feeling (sometimes with growling)? I had lived the previous 20 years or so going for 8,10 hour stretches without eating - because I literally never felt hungry. I are when I could feel my blood sugar sink.

And then, poof, this feeling that made me feel like I was seven or eight years old: my stomach was wanting food. Eventually that, too, faded, but not for a year. And every time I felt hungry it felt like a foreign feeling. It was a good feeling - it seemed like I got something back that most people had felt all their lives.

But it was also frightening, because it pointed out how I had lived without this basic human response for two decades. It made me wonder what else I didn't know. I still wonder that.

I don't have anything smart to say about the phenomenon of feeling something new that isn't bogged down in old - but I know I can identify with it, and I've held onto those moments like talismans. They teach me (I think) what "healthy" is...or at least, some version of way, way less pain.

So I say, call it a good thing and try and notice things like that. I do think they are glimpses into a healthier self.

 

[Hashi]

New
I trust what you felt - that it was a processing/rewiring. And that, though strange, could be good.

...translating thoughts to action was disallowed for circumstance. To presently register that choice does in fact exist to exclaim discomfort is part of your healing process I do believe.... memories of a fitfully constructed adaptive mechanism dating from your youth that can now be retired.

Yes, I believe this too.

I like the idea of all my maladaptive responses being retired/rewired! But this one would be a very good start.

as though no conceptual language existed within them to lend the slightest weight to what I dared not communicate.

I wonder if I had a conceptual language myself. I think that's one thing that's confusing to me about this experience - the feeling of it being a sort of natural concept. Which ties into what change said:

I do wonder if, as animals, we hold, inherently, a knowingness of respect (a baseline of sorts), from which we compare our daily experiences?

And where language fits into things is always a puzzle to me. Due to neglect it was a long time before I learnt language and I wonder how that fits into various things.

the ability to psychophysical my register people's intentions, before we can form language.

I feel like I did react to this with language-thoughts as much as non-language thoughts, pretty much equally I think - which is possibly a healthy thing in itself. I like your word psychophysical. I think I'd have to add energetic into that somewhere. I was aware during this experience of a feeling of my own will. That's not a completely new feeling for me with childhood. I know it might be unusual, but I was very strong-willed as an abused child. Previously I've remembered/re-experienced my will directed towards withstanding the abuse and opposing (if only in an inner way) the abuser. To feel my will directed towards something more natural and healthy was strange.

...the phenomenon of feeling something new that isn't bogged down in old - but I know I can identify with it, and I've held onto those moments like talismans. They teach me (I think) what "healthy" is...or at least, some version of way, way less pain.

This really ties in to what I'm noticing about the feeling of will as I used to experience/the healthy feeling of it in this recent experience.

It was like an adjustment of how I used to feel when I was little, and my adult observing of it felt there was something about it being part of growing up to learn that bowls of hot soup are going to fall on us even though we don't think that's right... unless we're more careful what we do with bowls of hot soup.

Which is very uncomfortable to feel, because - clearly - I'm still not careful enough with bowls of hot soup. I didn't learn this properly, or many other things that most children learn. I'm very clumsy, and then my response is not normally the healthy feeling of this experience but an out of control road-rage type anger. This was like some sort of correction of that, like part of developing more mindfulness rather than dissociation/overwhelm.

I had lived without this basic human response for two decades. It made me wonder what else I didn't know.

Yes... I don't think my mind can really handle thinking about it. Or my heart.

I have been working on more immediate things with my therapist but your post reminded that this is something I had wanted to discuss with him but got sidetracked.

I think it would be so helpful to get a therapist's views on this. I can understand having to deal with more immediate things, but if you're able to discuss this with him I imagine it could be really beneficial.

Thank you all for your responses. It helps me think about this.

 

[franciemarnie]

I don't know how I could have forgotten this so quickly. Maybe because I am in a lot of physical pain and it drives out my natural thinking and remembering ability. (Torn muscle. It will heal.)

Anyway, about six weeks ago, I was carrying a plate of spaghetti from the kitchen to the living room. My husband was already seated. Halfway there, the plate slipped out of my hands and fell on the carpet. I stood frozen and looked, per my husband, like a little girl. I felt like a little girl, like this was the greatest tragedy. I was crestfallen and mute. He was so kind and came over saying, That's okay, that's okay. We'll get you another plate of spaghetti, etc.

I stood there like a helpless three year old for a while before I "came to" and could speak and help clean up.

I don't have anything new to add to the comments, but I did feel exactly as I would have if I were 2 or 3 prior to trauma and not 57. Bizarre.

I have also felt the barriers put in place decades ago to prevent natural direct feeling are unpredictably falling like scales. It has actually been alarming at times. So new. But I see it as part of healing.

I can't wait for my healer to get back from Peru. I want so much to get thru this to the other side so I don't feel so much half in and out of the feeling world and the dissociative world. But I guess it is organically changing and going at its natural pace.