- Post starter
- #985
@KwanYingirl how did it go? How are you feeling? I've been thinking of you today.
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Strange Star
- Post starter Hope4Now
- Start date
KwanYingirl
Diamond Member
I am feeling sore and bleeding still. I did sleep all night though. I'm feeling all the needle sticks not so much bone pain. The teeth slid right out. As usual, it was much easier than I worried about! Thank you for asking.
I hadn't drumming cued up as well as a Tara Brach talk, but alas, I had no reception on my phone in his office. So we listened to country music instead. Ha ha!
I wanted to tell you that I think you are very interesting, brilliant and articulate. I am sure at the events you go to, the other people enjoy your company. If in doubt, always ask people about them. Everyone enjoys the chance to talk about their interests. And it sounds pretty cool that you go to dinners and lectures. I always admire folks that can do that. Good for you! ( however, I totally relate to how shaky you feel about staying present )
I hadn't drumming cued up as well as a Tara Brach talk, but alas, I had no reception on my phone in his office. So we listened to country music instead. Ha ha!
I wanted to tell you that I think you are very interesting, brilliant and articulate. I am sure at the events you go to, the other people enjoy your company. If in doubt, always ask people about them. Everyone enjoys the chance to talk about their interests. And it sounds pretty cool that you go to dinners and lectures. I always admire folks that can do that. Good for you! ( however, I totally relate to how shaky you feel about staying present )
- Post starter
- #987
- Post starter
- #988
Horses yesterday. Interesting. I told the therapist it is a bit like the cards I use with my therapist (I have made cards of different parts and I lay them out as a way to get to parts) except doing this with horses (i.e., assigning "parts" to them) is wildly different because they are ALIVE and have their own ideas about what they want to do and how they want to interact with me. Perhaps this is why equine therapy is supposedly effective? I don't know yet. I do know that I like hanging out with the horses. Yesterday I had three with me, and we got to be outside which was quite wonderful. I have learned something though...I try way too hard.
When I finally gave up on getting the horses to do what I wanted, I sat down on a rock at the edge of the ring and just watched them. And two of them eventually came to me. Which was totally cool and fun and I loved it. So something vaguely therapeutic must be happening. I will keep going for a bit. Sort of like the group therapy--I will give it a try and see how it plays out and whether it is worth my time and expense.
Bonus...last night at dinner I found that the woman sitting next to me takes care of horses for her job, and she invited me to come and hang out with her/them. I might do that. Maybe it was meant to be.
Today I submitted a few art things for a juried festival. Made me sick to my stomach. I haven't done anything with my art since I was around 14. But it is time. I did it, and that's what counts. Whether anything is accepted doesn't really matter. Just the fact that i got my act together to go through the steps required and actually followed through with it is a big deal for me. No paintings. Just one sculpture and two photos. And I submitted a few poems to the same festival via a different submission, but that did not feel like the art stuff. So, I will know at the end of the first week of June if they've blackballed my work or accepted it. Then it would just a matter of waiting for the final juried results. This feels like a big deal to me. It isn't, but it feels like it is.
Had good/weird talk with my yoda therapist on Friday. He wants to know if I have accepted how much trauma I experienced as a kid. Umm. No, not really. Just vaguely. He also said something odd. He was asking if my husband knows all of it. And then he said he's not sure he really knows all of it. And I realized I have no idea to whom I've told what, and how much I have told. Yoda seemed surprised when I indicated that the stuff with my dad had gone on from age 3/4 to around age 12. I think he may have thought it was a single incident. My bad. I have to get better about being clear I suppose, but so many things are not clear in my own head that I never know what will pop out of my mouth and to whom. And then I forget what I've said. It makes for very challenging therapeutic conversations.
I have begun to say, "I don't know if I told you this, but..." and so on.
What I did say yesterday, and it is true: I am needing to grow myself up all over again. My self got lost in the cosmos a very long time ago, probably after birth. I found it again a little over a year ago. And I am now in the process of figuring out how the hell to grow myself up into a self the way it was meant to be...but at the same time living the life I find myself in. Very challenging and weird and interesting. And completely exhausting. I am exhausted. Took a one-hour nap today that lasted for 5 hours.
Sometimes I think if I could just go away somewhere and sleep for a few weeks, I might be in a much better place. The exhaustion is worse than the pain and the flashbacks.
When I finally gave up on getting the horses to do what I wanted, I sat down on a rock at the edge of the ring and just watched them. And two of them eventually came to me. Which was totally cool and fun and I loved it. So something vaguely therapeutic must be happening. I will keep going for a bit. Sort of like the group therapy--I will give it a try and see how it plays out and whether it is worth my time and expense.
Bonus...last night at dinner I found that the woman sitting next to me takes care of horses for her job, and she invited me to come and hang out with her/them. I might do that. Maybe it was meant to be.
Today I submitted a few art things for a juried festival. Made me sick to my stomach. I haven't done anything with my art since I was around 14. But it is time. I did it, and that's what counts. Whether anything is accepted doesn't really matter. Just the fact that i got my act together to go through the steps required and actually followed through with it is a big deal for me. No paintings. Just one sculpture and two photos. And I submitted a few poems to the same festival via a different submission, but that did not feel like the art stuff. So, I will know at the end of the first week of June if they've blackballed my work or accepted it. Then it would just a matter of waiting for the final juried results. This feels like a big deal to me. It isn't, but it feels like it is.
Had good/weird talk with my yoda therapist on Friday. He wants to know if I have accepted how much trauma I experienced as a kid. Umm. No, not really. Just vaguely. He also said something odd. He was asking if my husband knows all of it. And then he said he's not sure he really knows all of it. And I realized I have no idea to whom I've told what, and how much I have told. Yoda seemed surprised when I indicated that the stuff with my dad had gone on from age 3/4 to around age 12. I think he may have thought it was a single incident. My bad. I have to get better about being clear I suppose, but so many things are not clear in my own head that I never know what will pop out of my mouth and to whom. And then I forget what I've said. It makes for very challenging therapeutic conversations.
I have begun to say, "I don't know if I told you this, but..." and so on.
What I did say yesterday, and it is true: I am needing to grow myself up all over again. My self got lost in the cosmos a very long time ago, probably after birth. I found it again a little over a year ago. And I am now in the process of figuring out how the hell to grow myself up into a self the way it was meant to be...but at the same time living the life I find myself in. Very challenging and weird and interesting. And completely exhausting. I am exhausted. Took a one-hour nap today that lasted for 5 hours.
Sometimes I think if I could just go away somewhere and sleep for a few weeks, I might be in a much better place. The exhaustion is worse than the pain and the flashbacks.
We can compare notes. I am doing this right now as well. May I ask..... what do you (or Yoda) know about ISH (Internal Self Helper?) I am thinking this is the SELF we are looking for. And it is already there.
- Post starter
- #990
@shimmerz, I've read about this thing called ISH. It isn't a word that Yoda uses, but I think it is the same as or at least similar to true SELF. And Yoda uses "self" all the time.
In DBT they call it "wise mind" but I'm not crazy about the way DBT frames it because it is very cognitive/intellectual (and my "wise mind" is one of my real difficulties...I used to insist to the DBT people that I have more than one wise mind...and they didn't believe me, but it it is true).
Last night in my shamanic class, the leader was talking about this notion too. The true self. And I liked the way he described it. It is the self that "sees" ourselves.
I think the ISH for me is my spirit-self (the one I always insist does not live inside me, but Yoda swears that it is just protector parts keeping me separate from it because they don't believe it is safe for it to connect with me/my body etc.) This SELF is, I think, my true self. It is very wise and knowing and connected to all things. Occasionally now, I can manage to connect my body and mind with it. When that happens, things are good and I can see all this chaos I live in differently from usual--like I'm not drowning in it, like I can heal it. I would like to get to be able to do this more often, but as I've said before it only happens in certain conditions (quiet, no people, no expectations, lots of time, etc....not much like the "real" world).
My problem is that I have these other parts that "think" they are my self. I have a part I call the Observer who seems to see and know a lot. But it is very cold and disconnected...has no compassion or care. Just kind of watches things. It is helpful when it's up and active, because I can remember certain things, and it holds a lot of my memories--or at least parts of them. Very complicated.
I also have these "wise minds." Which are very different. And they drive me crazy crazy crazy. Pull me in too many different directions. Too many expectations and directives etc. I think what they are, actually, is the "minds" of some of my parts. And they take over pretty regularly. And some of them are highly functional and drive me to do all sorts of things "normal" people do. And then I crash. But they pose as my true SELF.
I am working on figuring out the differences among these. I KNOW the difference in certain situations. When I am in SELF, I can see all the parts and what they do and how they confuse me and fight and take over, etc. But when I am caught in some part that thinks it's self, I can't see beyond it.
I don't know if that makes any sense at all. But to answer part of what you wrote, yes, we all have one. Even those of us who experienced deep trauma before we were even born. I think it comes with conception--when a "spirit" is sent into this world. And it doesn't go away ever, except when we are traumatized all these other things come up to protect it, so when we finally start doing the work to heal, we have to sort through a lot of smoke and mirrors to find it.
In DBT they call it "wise mind" but I'm not crazy about the way DBT frames it because it is very cognitive/intellectual (and my "wise mind" is one of my real difficulties...I used to insist to the DBT people that I have more than one wise mind...and they didn't believe me, but it it is true).
Last night in my shamanic class, the leader was talking about this notion too. The true self. And I liked the way he described it. It is the self that "sees" ourselves.
I think the ISH for me is my spirit-self (the one I always insist does not live inside me, but Yoda swears that it is just protector parts keeping me separate from it because they don't believe it is safe for it to connect with me/my body etc.) This SELF is, I think, my true self. It is very wise and knowing and connected to all things. Occasionally now, I can manage to connect my body and mind with it. When that happens, things are good and I can see all this chaos I live in differently from usual--like I'm not drowning in it, like I can heal it. I would like to get to be able to do this more often, but as I've said before it only happens in certain conditions (quiet, no people, no expectations, lots of time, etc....not much like the "real" world).
My problem is that I have these other parts that "think" they are my self. I have a part I call the Observer who seems to see and know a lot. But it is very cold and disconnected...has no compassion or care. Just kind of watches things. It is helpful when it's up and active, because I can remember certain things, and it holds a lot of my memories--or at least parts of them. Very complicated.
I also have these "wise minds." Which are very different. And they drive me crazy crazy crazy. Pull me in too many different directions. Too many expectations and directives etc. I think what they are, actually, is the "minds" of some of my parts. And they take over pretty regularly. And some of them are highly functional and drive me to do all sorts of things "normal" people do. And then I crash. But they pose as my true SELF.
I am working on figuring out the differences among these. I KNOW the difference in certain situations. When I am in SELF, I can see all the parts and what they do and how they confuse me and fight and take over, etc. But when I am caught in some part that thinks it's self, I can't see beyond it.
I don't know if that makes any sense at all. But to answer part of what you wrote, yes, we all have one. Even those of us who experienced deep trauma before we were even born. I think it comes with conception--when a "spirit" is sent into this world. And it doesn't go away ever, except when we are traumatized all these other things come up to protect it, so when we finally start doing the work to heal, we have to sort through a lot of smoke and mirrors to find it.
Yes, exactly. I have been reading up on this on a guys website (Allison) at dissociation.com. He so describes my experiences and it seems to be gluing stuff together for me. I feel like the ISH is the 'voice' that helps me, knows wtf is going on and is my guide. I am going to use this as my SELF because I know it is in there. It knows what has happened. The shamanic stuff makes more sense now too, as do my 'sessions' where I knew stuff I shouldn't have known. I feel like I have been wasting a ton of time trying to 'find' myself when it has been here all along. Now I just have to train myself how to incorporate my body. That's the plan, anyway.
I have given this a bunch of thought. I think the protector parts and rescuer parts are different. Just my opinion.
I can relate very well to these types of parts. The voice I am speaking of is a different voice. It has a different tone, a sense of calmness, not coldness, and is absolutely certain of itself. It never pushes, just suggests. I think this is one of the reasons I know it is different.
Yes. agreed.
Thanks Hope. I wasn't sure whether to ask this or not in your diary. I appreciate your input. It has been helpful. I hope I didn't derail you too much.
- Post starter
- #992
@shimmerz, I'm delighted you asked here. This is one of the only places I go on the forum these days...I'm not available much except in this sort of selfish diary way. Going through rough time. Psychiatrist just agreed not to "pink slip" me (a term I've never heard) because I could not or would not contract for safety. I am okay at the moment, but in bad place generally.
I would like to have some rescuer parts that are a bit more assertive over the other parts. I think I do have one, but it does sort of extreme things like make me pass out just before I am going to really do something stupid like kill myself. So maybe it's a firefighter part. I don't know. Sometimes all the vocabulary gets confusing.
How do you define rescuer parts? Is this the ISH?
I totally understand this. When I found my SELF around a year ago, I had a major AHA moment! But it is often very distant--gets covered over by parts most of the time. I too am working on incorporating it into the body. This is way easier said than done. I have been working on it in all sorts of bizarre ways. I don't know if this helps or just sounds weird, but in the journeying stuff, one day I was looking for an entrance to the upper world. I got to one level of it and a guide told me I had to look into my own heart, that the portal was there. I shared this with the shaman who led my workshop and she said there is a different sort of heart chakra/energy center that some people acknowledge and some don't. It's within the regular heart chakra. Anyway, I seem to have managed to get there now and again. It allows me entry to the upper world as well as significantly better access to some of my parts. But often it is hard for me to get through. I have a lot of gunk and goo that gets in the way. I'm drowning in it right now.
Tell me more. I'm not sure the difference. I only have the IFS language that has protector parts (which include managers that make you functional, and firefighters that are very destructive and jump in when they feel like the managers aren't doing the job). Bot sets' jobs are to keep the exiles (wounded parts from the past) from flooding the person with too much emotion/memory/whatever.
I would like to have some rescuer parts that are a bit more assertive over the other parts. I think I do have one, but it does sort of extreme things like make me pass out just before I am going to really do something stupid like kill myself. So maybe it's a firefighter part. I don't know. Sometimes all the vocabulary gets confusing.
How do you define rescuer parts? Is this the ISH?
- Post starter
- #993
Dark night of the soul.
This was a really good piece I just stumbled upon. I googled "dark night of the soul" because I couldn't remember where the phrase came from. And I found this. And wow, does it speak to me. @shimmerz, I think you might appreciate it too. http://www.themystic.org/dark-night/
I am home now, and safe. No "pink slip." I think psychiatrist understands I am on that odd precipice of being able to make the decision to stay safe vs. not. She did not call the police when I was talking with her on the phone tonight while I was at the beach experiencing a crisis. I appreciate that. And I appreciate that my parts somehow allowed me to text her as she had invited me to earlier today. This, this little bit of reaching out, this is progress for me.
Maybe all these mentors of mine are right. Maybe I need to trust them. Maybe there really is a purpose to my being here. Maybe I really can be a whole self who is not in constant torment. The spark of hope remains. It is dimming fast, but it is still there. Still alive. And, of course, everything always looks better in the morning.
This was a really good piece I just stumbled upon. I googled "dark night of the soul" because I couldn't remember where the phrase came from. And I found this. And wow, does it speak to me. @shimmerz, I think you might appreciate it too. http://www.themystic.org/dark-night/
I am home now, and safe. No "pink slip." I think psychiatrist understands I am on that odd precipice of being able to make the decision to stay safe vs. not. She did not call the police when I was talking with her on the phone tonight while I was at the beach experiencing a crisis. I appreciate that. And I appreciate that my parts somehow allowed me to text her as she had invited me to earlier today. This, this little bit of reaching out, this is progress for me.
Maybe all these mentors of mine are right. Maybe I need to trust them. Maybe there really is a purpose to my being here. Maybe I really can be a whole self who is not in constant torment. The spark of hope remains. It is dimming fast, but it is still there. Still alive. And, of course, everything always looks better in the morning.
No. The framework is simpler than you are speaking about.
1. Protectors (they get us in shit (containers for anger/fear etc)
2. Rescuers (try to clean up mess protectors get us into but as well can get us into shit)
3. ISH - Inner Self Helper (perhaps a high ranking angel could be used to conceptualize the role of the ISH?)
4. CIE - Celestial Intelligent Entity (helper to the angel.... not sure, myself on this one)
The ISH that I have had experience with. No idea what the CIE's are as I don't identify with these through my experience at all. But the ISH.... now THAT I can tell you hundreds of stories about.
I don't want to, in any way derail what your doctors are doing with you, so I won't get into any details. But the idea is that the ISH is the essence (SELF) that we are born with. If a trauma happens before the age of seven that is life threatening then an alter(s) is created. Another trauma, then another alter(s). The ISH knows the entire story.... and when it comes time to 'put Humpty Dumpty back together again' can provide the means to communicate with alters and also has the complete road map as to how, when, why those alters were formed.
The idea that most psychotherapists work with is that you need to get to all of the dissociated parts to get to the SELF. Then integration can happen. With the ISH, the idea is that you get right to the ISH through hypnotism and the ISH will work in tandem with the therapist to unwind the trauma. Therapists will laugh you out of the office if you were to present such an idea, as I understand it.
Much of my shaman work as well as my 'sessions' worked with my ISH (or an ISH like component of myself)
Thanks Hope. I haven't read it yet but will shortly. Thanks for thinking of me. I hope that you are feeling better today.
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