The War On Terror - Your Thoughts?

[abnvet]

I whole heatedly agreed with going into Afghanistan and Iraq. Being a veteran of the Gulf War, I wanted to see Saddam get caught and killed. This was back when 9/11 was still fresh and I actually had ideas of going back to active Army status. Now that its been 10 years plus - regretfully I believe that we should leave both countries. It pulls on me everyday to think that once we do pull-out that we'll have all our KIAs and WIAs and what will we have to show for them? Another memorial built in D.C. ??? I just don't know anymore. We were told that the US would never fight another conflict/war, etc like we did in Vietnam but we continued to get tied up in politics and fearing that we will hurt others feelings. IMO - if we go to war, we should go in big, hard, and fast. Combat which is no holds barred and get in and out. HOOAH!

 

[willis williams]

I agree because fighting like we are these people have been doing for thousands of years. I still think that they will revert anyway you look at it the new president is acting like an american president promises and a good show of face but his actions speak differant. I know that there should be freedom of the differant clans but when they are armed gorrilas you can't ever establish peace no matter how big of a police force or army you have. We are talking about people that blow themselves up without question. I say bug out let them kill the shit out of each other then go back and kill anybody that is a militant of any kind. Then let some poor shop owner run the country because he knows what work and opression is. I don't think I could set around filthy rich from international funding and drug money and just send people to blow themselves up just so I could gain control of a country and make more money. I beleave that just like the US the groups we are fighting in afganistan are doing it for greed just as much as we are or they would not kill there on people. GREED it's a bitch.

 

[Wagon]

Thats how the Mongol's did it. Big and Heavy. Knocked em down so bad nobody even thought of trying to raise a finger after that. Imagine. The story goes in 1300 you could walk from Baghdad to Beijing with a golden plate on your head and nobody would touch you. Try that today you won't get 100 meters.

I don't know which military rule book anybody is reading any more, but the minute you say you are leaving, you have admitted you lost. I mean the attitude has to be "f*ck it, we're leaving anyway. Fight to win or don't fight at all.

No more Vietnam's. I remember Reagan's speech on that. Meanwhile he's arming Iraq to beat hell AND then later on doing some wacked out drug money deal to buy weapons from Iran to supply rebels in Nicaragua. Which of course his entire administration collectively forgot about.

Afghanistan was the first f*ck up. Should not have put a boot on the ground until the whole f*cking place was carpet bombed and somebody upped with Osama Bin Laden. And if he was hiding in Pakistan they should have carpet bombed North and South Waristan as well. I'm not into war or anything. But the monumental f*ck ups are frustrating.
wagon

 

[Zipperhead]

Canada never went into Iraq. The justifications for that fight didn't ring true as it were. But Afghanistan was a differant senario. A little history to start.

After 2 World Wars Europe was afraid of what would come next. After watching the United States sit by the side lines till the last minute twice, there was some movement toward forming a pact that would ensure they wouldn't do it again. Under the terms of that agreement should any country be attacked, all member nations would automatically come to their defence. This pact was agreed to by participants, and NATO was formed.

No one thought that the United States would be the country that got attacked. I have heard it asked many times "why are we fighting the American's war?" And yet these same people would have expected that the Americans would have honoured their part in the agreement. How two faced are the Canadian Civilians.

It was quickly determined that the organization that orgistrated the attack was Al Qiada, based out of Afghanistan. They were not a legitimate part of the Afghan Government, yet enjoyed the unspoken support of the Taliban Government. Negotiations were attempted, with the Isolationist Taliban refusing all requests of the Americans to hand over the guilty and disband the camps. The States were faced with sitting back and watching the next attack be planned, or going in and taking care of business.

Canada supported this action and we have lost 156 soldiers to the cause so far. It was a legitamate cause and it was initially well executed. But then we got entangled with the Northern alliance. The Northern alliance was a pre-existing revolutionary force bent on topling the Taliban. Instead of just going in and dealing with our problem we got tied up with "liberating" Afghanistan.

The Taliban was an Isolationist Society. They had no ambitions outside their own boarders. They represented no threat to us, and yet the bleeding hearts said "look at those poor little girls." Now we are trapped in an epic struggle of nation building in a nation that doesn't want to be built. The war was justified. The target was valid. The aim was off.

 

[reddevil1111]

I fought for the policy makers of America for the garbage in South and Central America. I was still pretty much a "hard corps marine" then.
Then I was told at the gate as i was leaving the Marines to go back and get all my gear that I had to stay.
That moment was the turning point for me. I began to hate the Marines and the government as well.
I went to the first gulf war. I was exposed to and I saw WMD's. 2 Marines in an amtrak in 2/7 died from a nerve gas landmine. Thats a fact.
I belive there could still be WMD's hidden away in either Iraq or they gave them over to the Iranian's for safe keeping for now. (remember they parked about 300 planes over there during the 1st gulf war?!)
I know you guys all bash the president and look at all the stuff they had warning them. I can tell you as I worked in intelligence That even if you recive a credable threat warning, in those days they did not act on them without several other sources saying the same thing.
That has changed but the old ways were from the era of Viet Nam and its politics. Try to get a feel for it. In Beriut, the marines killed in the truck bombing homicide, they all had unloaded weapons, they saw the threat coming and had to call 3 different people to even get permission to load a weapon, Whashington had to be called to get permission to fire back. How did they stand a chance?
Same as 9-11
We had no chance as no intel branch shared info with another. I know it might seem unreal but I doubt that the president was even told of the threats. 99% of intel data is "filtered" before it goes to him and then others decide what he need to know beyond that.
I view Iraq and Afghanistan as a pair of holes. At first I thought we could help and improve things. As the months went by I saw them as money pits where we can send troops and maybe kill off a generation of Muslim kids who think they want to fight us. I think its better there than in a mall or airport here in the US.
I could give a rats a$$ about politics now. All politics get members of the military killed....so f*ck them all.
You can say there are a lot of causes of war. I say there is only one. Greed. Greed for control,power,money but it is all greed. You cant figure out the motives of an attack? Greed. Someone is making money, someone else is getting power and someone else is gaining control. Thats my .02

 

[Wagon]

Try to get a feel for it. In Beriut, the marines killed in the truck bombing homicide, they all had unloaded weapons, they saw the threat coming and had to call 3 different people to even get permission to load a weapon, Whashington had to be called to get permission to fire back. How did they stand a chance?

Except for the cases where they can easily cover it up. Just kind of pencil whip history. My whole deployment and what I call "Little Lebenon" is completely gone. WTF did I get the Navy Expeditionary Medal for?? Which is what you got for Cold War/Hot War operations.

 

[reddevil1111]

I lost a cousin there in the barracks bombing. My uncle was so upset. His kid was in admin running a typewriter...how could that be bad? What all the legs were in bunkers they dug around that building. The HQMarines took over the building and slept in the real beds. I know they were cursed for having the cushy jobs until that homicide bomber hit them.
I never got to see a battleship fire. For the 4 years I spent in the Marines, we felt a .50 was heavy arty. Then came the Gulf war and MAN! I got to see some serious and heavy stuff. That was cool till they fired some back....
I have been on a few ships and even a sub. And I think I would have killed myself if I had to stay on one for any length of time. I would rather have trench foot and crotch rot and have to hump in a jungle with a 90 pound ruck being eaten by snakes,bugs and leaches thank you very much. f*ck the ice cream that boat stuff sucks!

 

[Wagon]

3 years 2 months and 20 days. Straight. We got an ice cream machine on the ship..... Was f*cking brilliant.....until someone took a look at the powder (yes you heard right....powdered ice cream.) and found out it had petroleum products in it. That ended the happiness about the ice cream. We also had fake milk. Damn Navy.

Us and Special Forces kicked the shit out of Hezbollah in 89. They had hung a Marine Colonel on video and then had a priest hostage (big deal). But the real problem was that Israel was near ready to invade again because there was some serious action going on at the border, And Syria was feeling their oats again at the time. And the Russians were there as well. So we f*cked around for 2 months and then made a guest appearance IN Beirut Harbour a month after.

But this never happened so keep it quiet. :tup:

 

[reddevil1111]

yeah. I have a few stories about stuff that never happened as well. Most of it never even hit the news so I guess its all still hush hush. I did sign some papers so I cant tell and never will. Most of it was no bi deal...but one thing that happened is a trigger for me and I cant even talk about it (not like I want to but you know what I mean)
We had everything powdered so if you ever have seen a beef or pork "patty" reduced to dust....or so called freeze dried consentrated fish and rice balls with grey goo inside them...we ate those some times when our poop had to match the locals...your ice cream sounds yummie.
Did you know oil wells produce styrofoam naturally? When they put out the fires in Kuwait I saw it myself. I think you see a lot of strange stuff you just ignore it from being hyperalert or without sleep.
Here is a funny one: when Lyme's hit in North Carolina we were told by command to wear panyhose to avoid the tick getting on our legs. I lived in dread of being killed while wearing them. It did work at keeping the ticks off but who wants to die wearing them? lol

 

[Wagon]

It's been 22 years. I signed shit too. I also don't give a f*ck. We had a task force, but most people did not know what the f*ck was going on. (Need to Know.....you know?) I used to listen to the net chatter on the crypto phone. Our Marine spotters were assembled every day, ready to go. And then practice in the afternoons. But SEALs took care of all the f*ckery along with our drones and pleasant diversions.

Funny thing is....or not so funny. The Russians had the very same crypto phone on the bridge of every one their ships. The Walker spy bastard gave em that. If a shooting war had broken out, We were absolutely f*cked. This was found out 5 years after everything was over.

Marines in pantyhose. I knew something was up with you guys.

Styrofoam and Ice Cream. Same thing in the Navy. Just like radiation and sunlight. They can't hurt you...... so much. I still refuse x rays for physicals because there is no telling how much I got in the Navy.

 

[Ned]

No-ones mentioned egos. Politicians egos. We tend to have pride, not egos.
f*cking egos have got us into a lot of messes over the last few years.
Said this before but we had a medal-hunter in Bos, I told him where he could go and really wish I'd had that same ability with so-called 'leaders'. f*ck'em.

 

[Jimmy1]

The worst part I think is when you know there is risk of life (like everyday in the Red Zone or Afghanistan) but you still have to send people out on pointless patrols.

I lost a couple of good Marine mates to the red zone because they were told it would be a safe patrol and they wanted some excitement. They were comms guys at Baath Party HQ. They wanted to be top gunners on the Humvee. Never saw them again.

Wish this war on terror would end, but its only going to get worse.