Relationship Am i naive??

[ByrnesT]

Trying to cut a long story short, I live in Wales in the UK. Just over 4 years ago I made friends with some American students who were studying in the UK & I put them up for a night in my home to show them my hometown. It was a very random event but it was a lovely thing & I think they really appreciated being taken care of & getting a real experience with real locals from their travels rather than just doing the tourist thing. At the time I was going through a lot in my life as well & it provided me with a much needed sense of joy & relief. They were 2 women & one guy & there was never anything romantic about any of the relationships. We have remained in contact ever since.


This Summer the one girl was returning to the UK to study in Scotland for a few months. Understandably she wanted to return to Wales to visit me & my friends. Being a student she was obviously on a tight budget & she needed a place to stay. If not then she could not afford to make the trip at all. My two other friends she had met 4 years again are not in positions to help her with accommodation & I still live alone in the same 2 bed apartment that they had stayed in before.


The difference is this time I’m in a relationship with my sufferer. I understood & made it perfectly clear to her that I appreciated this was no ideal situation to be having another woman stay with me for the night whilst in a relationship with her. I offered for her to be with me the whole time if it made her feel easier & tried to get across this was quite a unique situation but that I felt compelled to help my American friend. I obviously made it completely clear that I had no romantic interests in this other girl. And having other women stay the night in my home with me it goes without saying is not common practice nor ever would be!


Unfortunately my sufferer has severe jealousy about me being around any other woman. A great difficulty for me as I pride myself on having a great number of female friends, none of whom it would ever be anything more than friendship with. This has led to many explosive & unnecessary arguments in the past (as well as the inevitable breaking up with me!).


My sufferer did in all fairness say she understood the situation with my visitor needing a place to stay & although she was understandably reticent about it, she gave me her blessing. (As it turned out my sufferer was not with me the night my friend visited.)


Half way through the night my friend was with me tho I started to receive the inevitable tirade of anger & abuse about it (over text message). About how I don’t care about her, I don’t respect her, I don’t care about her feelings. And the usual that I’m controlling & a bully who’s too arrogant to think of anyone but myself. It’s now 12 days later & I am still getting all of the same comments without any movement forward. I have also been told that I must promise that this will never ever happen again or she will have nothing to do with me.


I have explained that it is highly unlikely for me to ever be in the situation of having any other woman stay in my apartment with me again, just like it had never happened before in the previous 2.5 yrs of our relationship. That I’m not an idiot & I know it was a little unusual but that it was quite a unique situation. But, I have also said I won’t agree to anything that comes from a place of anger or jealousy or anything that I believe to be unhealthy. That she needs to learn to trust me & see me for who I am. I have said I am not going to respond to threats & ultimatums either.


Am I being naive here in feeling that as much as this was an unusual & not ideal situation, that it would also be nice for my partner to trust me & work with me to compromise? Rather than just throw the gauntlet down at me in anger again?


As an aside, i guess I find it even more hurtful as I have had to deal with my sufferer going on trips away with her ex husband & their two children in the first year of our relationship (there were reasons that I won’t get into). And as much as some people thought I was crazy for “allowing” it, I always insisted that I understood the context of why it was happening & that ultimately I trusted her & it was not for me to dictate to her what she does. Trust for me is such an important factor of a relationship.


Am I naive to expect the same back from a relationship?

 

[Neverthesame]

No. I don't think it is naive. At least it shouldn't be.

The thing about jealousy in a relationship, is how it says more about the person who is jealous, than the person who they're jealous of.

Why is it ok for her to go off alone with her ex husband, yet you can't put up a friend for the night?

Trust has to be both ways, or it's not trust. It's simply faith.
Aside from God no mortal relationship can thrive on faith alone.

If she doesn't trust you, what's the point?
This is the same woman who refuses to get any sort of help for her other issues?

I would be far more sympathetic to her if you had been sneaky about this, or prone to jealousy yourself. If you've been as transparant about this as you say you have, well...
I would never suggest someone need to "get over" a crit A trauma. But a bit of silly jealousy? Yeah.

 

[scout86]

Honestly, having a visiting friend stay at your home doesn't seem like with big deal to me at ALL. Regardless of gender. I have a lot of male friends. I wouldn't give a thought to whether or not it's ok to stay at their home when in town, or have them stay here. Of course it's ok, I'd be hurt if they didn't.

I'm female. I have PTSD. I find that kind of jealousy to be a total deal breaker. People don't own other people. Period. If she can't trust you, how can she be in a relationship with you? This kind of thing doesn't suggest a long, healthy, and happy relationship is very likely.

 

[Sweetpea76]

That's a personality thing, not necessarily a PTSD thing.

Don't fall into the supporter trap of excusing all bad behaviors as part of her PTSD. We all tend to do that. It's a common question here "is he/she having a PTSD reaction, or just being an asshole"? Sometimes they're just being assholes just like any other person.

She gave you the OK, but now she is punishing you for it? f*ck that noise...

 

[Freida]

When your sufferer starts determining who you can have as friends you don't have a ptsd issue. You have a domestic abuse one

 

[nowthisisme]

My opinion is a little different. It can be a PTSD issue depending on her type of trama. Her trust in people can be broken, I have PTSD and i find it VERY difficult trusting people, I have been married for 13 years and still get jealous or have trust issues with my husband. I am not very vocal about them because i don't want to cause drama but they do pop up in my head ever once in a while.

I don't trust anyone else, I feel like the closer i get to someone the more harm they can cause me. It's a big challange of mine. Also control is a BIG factor, I NEED to be able to control everything or i won't feel safe. I think her gaving you the ultimatums is her way of trying to control the situation.

Go meet with her, face to face, texts just make things worse. Don't promise her anything you cant keep because if she is anything like me, she will hold it against you if you screw up.

I know it's hard being in a relationship with a sufferer but if you lasted for 2 years then their women truly loves and cares for you, each suffer has different ways of dealing with different situation and sometimes we cant tell why we act a certain way. But since she stuck arround for this long then there is trust there, I'm guessing she just needs you to remind her of it, face to face not via texts.
Good Luck!

 

[ByrnesT]

Thank you all for your responses. It’s really good to get the different perspectives.

I do think that like you say @nowthisisme that my sufferer has real difficulty with trust as a result of her trauma. Not only the abuse she has both witnessed & received but also just in general life. It’s broken her general sense of trust in anyone. And even tho not directly affected herself she is also very aware of some important men in her life & their infidelities. This leads to the cynical & depressing belief that “all men” are only after one thing etc. All that I can understand. And I think you’re right when you say her fears come from the fact that she does in fact trust me (oh the irony!).

All this understanding however doesn’t mean that I think that it’s a world I should live in. And what I find hard is I don’t see her even wanting to let go of this fear. It’s like her fears are her possession & her identity & she doesn’t want to let go of them.

I did manage to see her today in person & it certainly did help an awful lot. And as much talking properly face to face calmed things, she still isn’t really letting go of her position. She tells me she hates being so jealous, yet I don’t see her wanting to step away from it. A healthy dose of jealousy in any relationship I think is normal, but I see her attitude & stance as massively stepping over the line. I see her trying to control me as you describe. She needs that & that’s not something I can sign up for.

This is what I find so hard, we talk here about how we can only control ourselves & our own emotions etc & of course this is absolutely right. And no I can’t change her views etc. But as a partner I do want to be able to talk & reason with her. I want her to see the alternative view. We all occasionally can listen to someone & change our opinions can’t we? Is this a mistake I’m making?

 

[nowthisisme]

Thank you all for your responses. It’s really good to get the different perspectives.

I do think tha...

Does she go to therapy? The only way I was able to distinguish between my PTSD symptoms and i own personality was through therapy. I refused to listen to anyone sugguestion that i was over reacting or i was reacting as much as I should be.
When someone commented on the way i behaved i would shut them down and accuse them of trying to control me. This is not healthy and only destroyed relationships.

If you feel like she's crossing the line then she is. And if you don't feel she's not doing anything to help resolve this then you have a decision to make.

If I were you I would give it a couple more days try not to discuss this topic. If she really loves you and has a fear of losing you she'll take a step back. You shouldn't take a step back because you seem to be in the right position.

 

[The Albatross]

Not a mistake you're making, no. Part and parcel of being in a partnership means being able to do that... listen, have good communications skills and habits, mediate disputes or resolve conflicts, yeah perhaps change an opinion. It's intensely difficult to do for someone who hasn't resolved their issues... but the desire to keep the relationship was motivation enough for me to endeavor to do the work, and my spouse has done his part as well (I'm a PTSD). Aiming for reasonable helps. However, if she is intent on holding her position... she is free to keep that attitude but it can and does affect how the relationship proceeds.

It is a misconception that trauma woundedness is a lens through which we have to look at our partners, friends and coworkers... it is hard though for people to "risk" they think, trust ... but it is harder to lead lives in that defensive position because it is so damaging to the people the care about and themselves in the longer term.

 

[Friday]

I have also been told that I must promise that this will never ever happen again or she will have nothing to do with me.

That you'll never take her at her word, again? That when you directly ask her something, to completely disregard her answer? :O_o:

But, I have also said I won’t agree to anything that comes from a place of anger or jealousy or anything that I believe to be unhealthy. That she needs to learn to trust me & see me for who I am. I have said I am not going to respond to threats & ultimatums either.

Yay! Nevermind... Your answer was better than mine!!

Am I being naive here in feeling that as much as this was an unusual & not ideal situation, that it would also be nice for my partner to trust me & work with me to compromise? Rather than just throw the gauntlet down at me in anger again?

Nope. Not naive. Trust might not be there, but showing someone respect? That's a choice. It's a decision she's making to vent all of her emotions on you, instead of dealing with them herself.

Her trust in people can be broken, I have PTSD and i find it VERY difficult trusting people

My trust in people is broken. Doesn't give me the right to bully and abuse them.

That's the thing... I may feel jealousy, anger, etc. Those are my feelings. The *moment* I turn around and lash other people with them? Reality check. I've chosen to make myself feel better by hurting someone else. Nope. That's wrong. That's MY treating them badly. And needs to stop.

 

[ByrnesT]

Thank you @nowthisisme & @The Albatross , it’s really interesting & helpful to get your perspective on things as sufferers. @nowthisisme it sounds like you have been through very similar coping techniques in the past to what my sufferer is going through now. Can I ask, what in the end was your motivation to finally get help to improve your coping strategies?

The advice to step back for a few days will work after I spoke to her today, but only to the extent that she’ll just move on. I can pretty much guarantee that her position will not shift in the slightest. This is one thing I do struggle with, even with hindsight she will so rarely shift positions or hold her hands up to what has happened or what she has done/how she has reacted. And for a lot of things, like in any relationship, sometimes that’s fine to move forward agreeing to disagree. When it’s something like this about trust etc, I personally find that needs more than just the agree to disagree approach. It’s always difficult to talk about “rights & wrongs” because so little is that black & white, but, such fierce & misplaced jealousy towards me does feel like it’s wrong. That she can’t change that even after the “heat of the moment” I find unhealthy.

Oh and in answer to your question, no she is not in therapy & never has been. (Well, apparently a few sessions as a teenager that she then refused to return to; she’s 31 now.)

Thank you @Friday . It’s so difficult trying to distinguish the lines between understanding & dealing with the raw emotions she experiences etc & trying not to judge her too harshly & trying to forgive her & work with her; and also just thinking, no. This is wrong. This is not the way to behave & this is not the way you treat people you love & not the way you achieve any sort of happiness for anyone involved. I feel I’ve always known the line is being crossed & the reason she both loves & hates me is because I will stand my ground & inform her of what she’s doing. But after a while with no signs of change you start to worry you’re just losing yourself to being the next victim in all this. Trying to decipher between the illness & the flaws in personality is also a tricky business.

 

[scout86]

Just another thought on "trust". I don't trust easily or often. But I believe in giving people the chance to screw up. It's the fastest way to see how trustworthy they actually are. If you try to control them, it's a lot of work and usually impossible to pull off. You just slow down the process of setting their true colors.