I feel like my issues are too complex to recover from

[shimmerz]

I may have missed it, but I haven't read anything in this thread about attachment issues. Does your T have any background in attachment theory? Attachment would explain the reaction to the split up with your girlfriend. The BPD would explain the black and white thinking of 'I am so too ill to heal' vs. the 'I just need someone to love me - then I will heal'.

Under normal circumstances, when one has large attachment issues, it is best to deal with them (thus your relationship to yourself) before diving into trauma. Otherwise you will always be looking for an external element to ground to.

Just a couple of thoughts.

 

[ms spock]

For someone who is dissociating 24/7, you are concentrating, reading and writing quite well. I can't do that while dissociating.

See @DharmaGirl I can do what the OP does whilst be profoundly dissociated, depersonalised and derealised, so it is a quandry, I had to be able to do that to protect my sisters and brothers. I thought I had really stepped out of doing what the OP does when recently a whole lot more dissociation dissolved, shifted, became less prominent, but hellishly hard feelings of vulnerability have arisen as well as all these other feelings. (We have to feel these? Every day? Surely my psychiatrist is engaging crazy talk?) So whilst I can understand people's scepticism, I lived my a large portion of my childhood and teen years like this.

It took me a long time to get cognitive distortions as well.

This is a really interesting thread, seeing how people break open and these things up. I am enjoying seeing how other people's brains work.

 

[Sideways]

I can do what the OP does whilst be profoundly dissociated, depersonalised and derealised

I keep relating a lot of what the OP describes to things you have described about your symptoms. It’s one of the reasons I’m persuaded the OP is sincere.

One of the glaring differences to me, and something that does kind of concern me, is that @jameson , in his previous thread in September, describes his situation thus:
“I entered therapy about a year and a half ago after lot of little innocuous things bothered me an extreme amount”.

There is a massive difference with your situation. Here, the OP has stated that his T has diagnosed him with CPTSD, but has been unable to set out any Crit A trauma.

His explanation for this this is that his mother left him when he was 4 years old, and the conclusion he has reached with his therapist, seems to be that unrecalled trauma that predates her leaving is evidenced through his bodily experiences.

I am not, for a second, doubting that unrecalled preverbal trauma can give rise to CPTSD. But in your case @Disco Dancing Queen , the trauma was extensive and evident and predated your diagnosis. Whereas there are elements of the OPs description throughout his threads, CPTSD seems to be being used primarily to describe bodily sensations with trauma being implied as the cause. Without the central role that trauma played in his presentation. In fact, the OP has described what he can recall of his life as including only fairly typical stressors, like the death of pets and breakups and such.

Whilst the OP has previously described having what he referred to as a “constant state of flashbacks”, he later elaborated (in his previous thread), that these were ‘emotional flashbacks’. The actual traumatic experience being implied doesn’t otherwise feature (at all) in the OP’s presentation, which is typically a fairly essential ingredient in diagnosing ptsd.

And now that the OP’s therapist seems to have come up with “complex and conflicting” results with a personality inventroy and declined to offer the OP any diagnosis at all.

That massive difference, the lack of the centrality of the trauma, seems to me to be a fairly significant issue that isn’t being discussed. At all.

Trauma therapists (and according to the OP, his is the beat that the local industry has to offer) can, and do, sometimes do more harm than good, in people that may never have had PTSD to begin with. IFS has a particularly shady history in that respect. I can’t help wondering if the T now declining to offer a diagnosis suggests a possible issue there.

ETA: if finances allow, it may be time for a second opinion on the diagnosis of Ptsd. I am surprised, given the OP’s decline in funciton over the last 18 months, that this hasn’t already been initiated by the OPs own T. There are documented examples of Ts who have made a person without any ptsd incredibly unwell, while having the best intentions, and I would hate for that to be happening here.

 

[Deleted member 39476]

I don't honestly see anything that makes me think "borderline" with you and there are some common "borderline-ish" things that usually send me running for the hills. But, "what ever".

What makes you say that? I certainly feel like I nail all of the borderline traits.

Thanks for sticking at it. Hmm. What do you mean by whole?

It's a complicated concept, but in short by whole I mean a consistent person with parts pulling the same direction. Right now I have a ridiculous amount of internal conflict to the point where I often cannot decide what to do and sit in one place for hours not doing anything, It's pretty impossible to apply therapeutic techniques when you are this disorganized internally.

 

[Deleted member 39476]

See @DharmaGirl I can do what the OP does whilst be profoundly dissociate...

I don't really see why its a contradiction. If you look at it from an evolutionary point of view, dissociation is a survival mechanism meant to shut down emotions and help you survive when in danger. Sure, it happens to be the most counterproductive of all the survival mechanisms, but its still a survival mechanism, it happens for a reason. In other words when very dissociated its hard to do anything except for react to things that might be a threat, everything else gets shut down. In our case writing probably counts in our brain as a way of escaping/fighting a threat so we can do it even while very dissociated.

 

[lostforgottensoul]

It's a complicated concept, but in short by whole I mean a consistent person with parts pulling the same direction. Right now I have a ridiculous amount of internal conflict to the point where I often cannot decide what to do and sit in one place for hours not doing anything, It's pretty impossible to apply therapeutic techniques when you are this disorganized internally.

No it's not. I grew up in a cult. I was still doing cult rituals when I came to this site. My head still going through what I describe as auto pilot as it's the only concept to explain what I mean when I say the cult aspects and ritual aspects are coming back. I was doing things that made a ton of people on this site very upset, understanding that it wasn't "normal morally" right, was "bad", not good (however you want to say that), but couldn't stop but still couldn't explain what I thought would happen if I did stop. I had to completely change it to stop. I couldn't "just stop". I have been in therapy for 8 (almost 9 now) yrs and my therapist said I may need therapy, at least intermittent, for the remainder of my life. I may not but I may. I call that rather complex. I have BPD as well as PTSD. I disassoiate so deeply that I have moved from a point A place to a point B place having no idea or memory how I got there. But I was still able to apply CBT and DBT concepts. CBT was quite helpful with the internal battle. And it was (and is still) a battle between me and me. Against my own brain. And it sucked really bad for a few years. My therapist and I would go back and forth like a court room. He had me defending my position and then he would defend his and back and forth we went, for a very long time and I always ended up at the end saying "I know it doesn't make sense but I believe it anyway". But I still could apply some simple CBT concepts to that thinking. I would come here (appearing to fight repliers as well. Just ask a few that were here) go back and forth here, chewing up all the replies in my head, applying CBT concepts is actually what got me moving foward. I had to accept a big idea but CBT got me moving foward after that.

I have not read this entire thread. Only the last few replies but I assure you that nothing is too complex to recover from. Did I think that? ABSOLUTLY and said so to my therapist every single week for years. It is too complex, too complicated. But its not. Will I 100% recover? I don't know but chances are I will likely need to see a therapist when the thoughts come back but I think I can get to a place where I don't need weekly therapy visits and can live a half way normal life. I work but I also need a service dog to function in any other way. I taught myself as soon as I got out how to compartmentalize and numb off that entire part of me (most of my brain and myself - I am very numb at work) and retain my ability to work. That has worked against me many times but ability to work or not does not equate ability to function as just going to get a gallon of milk can result in me disossiating so deeply that I move places and have zero idea what I am doing. That is scary. I ended up on the train track by my house once. It's the Sunrail thus super active. That's scary. How I have not been spotted by the cops (they keep a very close eye on it for suicidal people and cars that stop on it) is a miricle but my point is, I would not classify that as impossible. I have no idea what, if anything, is your trauma but nothing is too complex for treatment. Will you fully 100% recover? Maybe and maybe not but obtaining more functionabilty is always possible. The question is, will you challenge your own brain and fight for it?

 

[Sideways]

Never yet heard of a therapist telling their patient, “Yeah, you’re pretty simple and straight-forward”...!:rolleyes:

 

[scout86]

What makes you say that?

I'll try to answer your exact question. I want to stress that I don't think I KNOW you and I'm not qualified to diagnosis you, even if I did. I'm totally basing this on my own, personal reactions to you, as you appear in this post. And I'm going to apologize in advance to anyone with a "borderline" diagnosis. What I'm saying is based on MY reactions and how things feel from MY point of view. It's not a judgement, or a condemnation, or anything like that.

I mentioned before that my relationship with my mother wasn't very good. My T says he thinks she was what he calls a "passive-aggressive narcissist". But, she also had some borderline-ish traits. Like she could be nice a pie one second and turn on you in a flash for reasons I could never figure out a second later. It never felt safe to deal with her. As I've come to understand it, this probably happened because she was distressed about something and it was her expectation that someone else (me) was somehow responsible for that and also supposed to fix it. She would do what my T describes as "spewing a bunch of emotions around and expecting someone to make her feel ok." And when she turned, she was vicious. What I think I've noticed around here is that the people who say they've been diagnosed with Borderline Personality Disorder tend to..... I'm not quite sure how to put it.... "explode"? when they get frustrated. I mean, I can have a pretty short fuse too, but there's a way this happens that never fails to remind me of my mother. At that point, sometimes I hang around (exposure therapy. LOL) and sometimes I take off, but it's ALWAYS hard to hang around. I don't get the feeling with you at ALL. You're not necessarily buying into what people are telling you, but you are staying engaged in a very reasonable way. You feel "safe" to engage with. So, you're not setting off my "borderline meter".

Like I said, that's ME. It's not a diagnosis. But, I'm pretty good at reading the energy of a situation, according to my T, and I'm not getting a scary vibe from you at ALL. From what you've said, I'd EXPECT you to have some attachment issues. Those can be dealt with, or so I'm told.

 

[scout86]

Never yet heard of a therapist telling their patient, “Yeah, you’re pretty simple and straight-forward

Actually, mine has said I'm "perfect" but he also says "normal is over rated". LOL

 

[lostforgottensoul]

What I think I've noticed around here is that the people who say they've been diagnosed with Borderline Personality Disorder tend to..... I'm not quite sure how to put it.... "explode"?

Yup. That's exactly what it is. It is an extreme level of emotions is exactly what it is actually. When all you feel is extreme levels of emotions and have no idea how to regulate them, explosions happen, a lot.

At that point, sometimes I hang around (exposure therapy. LOL) and sometimes I take off, but it's ALWAYS hard to hang around.

I find that intresting. You've tend to hang with me a lot. Just something intresting.

So, you're not setting off my "borderline meter".

Ahahaha! Sorry, that's funny!

 

[Deleted member 39476]

What I think I've noticed around here is that the people who say they've been diagnosed with Borderline Personality Disorder tend to..... I'm not quite sure how to put it.... "explode"?

I explode internally really badly, I'm just too disorganized to explode externally to a significant extent unless I am in an actual danger situation. I definitely feel the urge to break things, hurt myself, yell, etc, I just generally don't do it because I'm equally afraid of the consequences of doing things like that as I'm motivated to do them, so I generally just seize up and punch something. I used to break things regularly when I lost at games.

 

[scout86]

You've tend to hang with me a lot

You've come a LONG ways in the time you've been here. :)

In the beginning, it was very MUCH "exposure therapy". But it was also that you were obviously (IMO) trying really hard. That's something my mother never did. She never in 100 million years would have done therapy. Because, as far as she was concerned, there was nothing wrong with HER. All of her issues and distress were 100% dumped on other people and, in the family, that was part of my ":job".

These days, @lostforgottensoul , you are genuinely someone I like and respect and you aren't scary at all. But you very much were. Or, rather, "fear" was my own reaction to you. The exposure therapy worked. :) It STILL bothers me sometimes, with some people, and I think it's something I'm pretty sensitive to.

@jameson , I can't know exactly what you're feeling, of course, but what you're describing sounds very much like what I experience too, in the right situations. It's the lashing out, and flipping for reasons that aren't obvious to the observer part that means "borderline" to me. Again, I'm not saying I'm RIGHT, just that this is how I experience it. (I'm pretty sure @lostforgottensoul will forgive me for saying this, but if you go back and read some of her posts when she first joined the forum, I think you'll see what I mean.)