Complete numbness

[frogthroat]

Too much pride to snap a rubber band but not too much pride to not self injure?

I don't self injure. I suppose that's what I don't understand about the rubber band. I think maybe it's supposed to be for obsessive thoughts. I have a tendency to shut down in therapy and I do need to be more direct about my confusion. Sometimes, it feels like once I get in the office my brain falls out of my head. Yeah, I guess I am angry at myself for feeling like I should be able to handle my problems but there's no shame in admitting I have them. Hell, I had to rape someone with a pocket knife once. Of, course I'm going to be f*cked up. Trying to be a wall is a good way to ignore pain but it doesn't work. I knew I was going to hit a wall at some point in therapy and I have. I have to get through it.

So instead of going to your therapist like a big girl and engaging in direct communication, you’re bitching about your therapist and how she’s not helping you, to a group of strangers on the internet. That sounds like a winning plan for moving forward in therapy!

Listen, I fortunately haven't had this experience on this website until now but if you ever address me this way again I will block and report you. I have never talked to anyone this way on here and I wouldn't do that. Yes, I'm "bitching" to strangers on the internet just like everyone else on this site. If you have a problem with me ignore my posts or block me.

It's pretty clear to me now that I'm probably really upset and resorting to trying to do everything perfectly and not needing anyone which is bad coping. I need T to explain things more clearly. While I don't feel I'm treatment resistant I'm not understanding where exactly I'm at with this and what exactly is required for me to a point where I process. I do this when things hurt too much and then I try to soldier it out but it just makes things so much worse. Once I shut down like this it's hard to get back out.

@frogthroat totally relate, except I learned to redirect or stifle much irritation or...

Your post describes everything so much. I get the definition of "strength" confused. I wasn't allowed to be emotional as a child so now to try to integrate that into the healing process is like Chinese trigonometry. I always was taught being strong is just handling everything yourself and never whining about it. My dad even told me after a suicide attempt that if I was going to kill myself then to just do it. I was 14. You see the problem. Everything has been suppessed and now it's this giant wad of hatred and rage. I compensate by just accepting depression because my anger is so insanely profound that I have no idea how to handle it properly so now I'm shutting down. If I get to where I'm handling my sadness then I have to deal with the anger and that seems impossible at the moment. It's not. It just seems too overwhelming and that worries me.

 

[Tinyflame]

I love your 2 posts above (though not what you've gone through :( ) @frogthroat , I think they are insightful and wise.

Yes I totally relate to your post directly above, but make 14 a 5, though not for SI as that was 14 on my own, after-the-facts. But not the anger, though I had a rage-stage, I call it.

Going slowly is so key. And trust. Because the lousy part about numbness is all emotions go, I can't be really present, I can't engage as I'm capable of, I can't let myself feel anything. And thus miss out on the good parts. But I think it comes from a place of Huge fear, terror and horror. So if that's what I'm unconsciously looking out for to avoid +/or protect myself and others from, that is going to be my underlying mindset. Needs, wants, trust, self-care or being present, etc are 'frills'.

The good (if not I would have thought even impossible!) part is that when or if the guard falls down I can feel 'normal', joyful, happy, peaceful, safe. And more present to others, even if I can give easier than receive, accept neutral even if not hope, feel safe in a moment even if not daily. Etc.

But yes, I too see it as a necessary component of independence, and strength. Also most trust is betrayed, eventually. But again, 'trust' is new so it's bound to feel frightening. So maybe you can feel a little. That's a start. It's (shockingly, to me?) easy to trust if founded, so maybe that's compatible to the converse of noticing right away 'something is not right'. It's just the mind can doubt it.

:hug: to you.

Ps, a few years ago I approached the only family member I have that I needed help with the SI, I knew I was going to do it and do it right without some way to stop myself, and they told me to do it and do the world a favour. Needless to say it wasn't helpful, as I had never reached out to them for help. And it wasn't in a moment of disregulation, I was serious and calm and begging. :/ (Btw, I know they had their own 'stuff', andd I take it within context, but I still find it hard to believe I wouldn't be doing the world a favour, after the fact.)

But, I am still 'here', thanks to other's help.

Hang in there, and respect your limits.

 

[lostforgottensoul]

Everything has been suppessed and now it's this giant wad of hatred and rage. I compensate by just accepting depression because my anger is so insanely profound that I have no idea how to handle it properly so now I'm shutting down. If I get to where I'm handling my sadness then I have to deal with the anger and that seems impossible at the moment. It's not. It just seems too overwhelming and that worries me.

I know that feeling well. I too spent 10 yrs in denial and coming out of that denial, admitting that something bad happened, and then spending years and years and years with in a back and forth with my therapist, moving foward seemed impossible. I spent a good 6 yrs in therapy before finding this site. I still didn't see my trauma as trauma, abuse, or anything other then good, right, rightous, holy, and justified because it happened to me. What changed my entire direction is being challeneged on here between therapy sessions. One horribly painful, sent me to the edge immediately, night that changed my direction forever. Admitting they were f*cked in the head pedophiles. My entire trauma was felt that night. I was curled up in the fetal position throwing up in a garbage can. My entire trauma moved through me and I wouldn't of survived it if I wasn't on here more or less talking to myself. But typing on here. Admitting what happened to me! Feeling it. That is what povioted me in healing. That is what helped me to start to move towards healing. FEELING IT! I understand numbing out. I understand shutting down due to being overhwlemed. It happens to me today. I call it the crash. But don't be so quick to dismiss a challenge. Challenging distorted thinking helps you to move foward.

 

[frogthroat]

Going slowly is so key. And trust. Because the lousy part about numbness is all emotions go, I can't be really present, I can't engage as I'm capable of, I can't let myself feel anything. And thus miss out on the good parts. But I think it comes from a place of Huge fear, terror and horror. So if that's what I'm unconsciously looking out for to avoid +/or protect myself and others from, that is going to be my underlying mindset. Needs, wants, trust, self-care or being present, etc are 'frills'.

Also most trust is betrayed, eventually. But again, 'trust' is new so it's bound to feel frightening.

This is exactly what I haven't been able to verbalize. That's what's so frustrating. It's so incredibly hard and terrifying to try to decipher other people because for the first 15 years of my life there was violence and manipulation. To want any kind if affection came at a price so I don't feel like I deserve to ask for love, understanding, or companionship. It's really hard to integrate back into "normal" life things like dating or socializing. It's something I need to bring up in therapy next time. I have no idea how to emotionally handle things especially something as huge as my traumatic childhood. I obsess over what I'm doing wrong and then I work myself into a frenzy and end up feeling guilty and ashamed. I need to slow down and realize this is a process so I stop burning myself out.
Thanks for your input. I appreciate it. :hug:

I know that feeling well. I too spent 10 yrs in denial and coming out of that denial, admitt...

I agree with you. When I get to challenging points I get so agitated. I have years of distorted thinking to work through and sometimes I feel so hopeless. I'm not being gentle with myself at all and I'm punishing myself for not "doing it the right way." I need to be more patient with myself. I've done so much in therapy already. My T has even told me. This is just a bump in the road and I need to calm down and just get back on track. Thanks for your posts.

@frogthroat ... My apologies. I don't know how to put this gently so I'm afraid...

I know this is an issue but wow it's so hard and I'm just in no place to handle it right now. It's a delicate subject and I just don't feel confident or comfortable going completely no contact. That's something I know I will have to really think about when the time comes.

 

[Tinyflame]

Yes @frogthroat , well maybe processing (also) means finding words, and realizing what's to blame and what not, etc.

And something Anthony said is helpful ffor me- it's worse the second time through. And I stop and think about that: worse. Worse than what already was nearly destroying. But then- something different: a different understanding, a ~resoultion, of sorts. A different life to live (hopefully).

But like peeling an onion, lots of layers.

I think no contact has a wholly different downside, sometimes. There are options. It's not all black-or-white.

 

[frogthroat]

And something Anthony said is helpful ffor me- it's worse the second time through. And I stop and think about that: worse. Worse than what already was nearly destroying. But then- something different: a different understanding, a ~resoultion, of sorts. A different life to live (hopefully).

I think specifically with childhood trauma it's worse the second time through because you can't use the escapism you used as a child. You have the added responsibilities of adulthood. Plus, I know I can't run away from the horror of it if I expect to ever recover and that's so distressing. I realize everything I learned was wrong and that's terrifying. How am I supposed to be a functional adult if everything I know is distorted? It's like I've realized I don't really live in a nightmare but my reality was. Now I have to unlearn everything I internalized even things I internalized before I learned to talk.
You don't remember anything that well. You wonder what's exaggerated. The things that stand out are so horrible they feel unmanageable. This is dramatic but I feel like a small child and I have to untangle a tower sized ball of barbed wire by myself and I have no idea what I'm doing. Medication would probably soothe this constant distress enough to where I can even begin this process. I'm so upset I don't even think I'm upset. I'm just coasting. I'm so burnt out by the immensity of dealing with this I'm afraid to even start.

 

[joeylittle]

Medication would probably soothe this constant distress enough to where I can even begin this process. I'm so upset I don't even think I'm upset. I'm just coasting. I'm so burnt out by the immensity of dealing with this I'm afraid to even start.

Medication might or might not help with what you are describing. Hard to say.

I think there are three ways to understand how we interact with the past, while trying to make sure to live in the present.

• Rumination
• Compartmentalization
• “Stuffing”, or Denial/Avoidance

Compartmentalization is fundamentally the most useful concept. It’s whats going on when we are asked to put the memories away in a metaphorical box, or some other kind of mental ‘container’. Compartmentalization involves both the action of putting away AND the action of taking out again.

If you put something away and then actively seek to never take it out again, especially while it’s still unresolved - that’s “stuffing”, or denying.

Black-and-white/all-or-nothing thinking styles - cognitive distortions - easily lend themselves to the kind of extreme thinking that says “I can choose to live my life in the present and I never need to acknowledge or accept or process the trauma that caused my PTSD”.

A more balanced statement would be, “I can’t be thinking about this all the time - so I will put it away and take it out again when I’m ready, and will do so with the right kind of therapeutic support”.

And sometimes, those things can stay compartmentalized for quite awhile, so long as you don’t start trying to deny their existence altogether. They are there - they just don’t have to all be laid out on the table right now.

Rumination is what happens when you allow those thoughts/memories to take over all your daily functioning. And when there’s a lot of effort involved in stuffing - the effort itself can become a form of rumination.

I think most folks who go a long time managing to function externally while just sitting on a big pile of past trauma, are doing various combinations of effective compartmentalization and ineffective stuffing. Eventually, it becomes impossible to stuff everything. Generally, there’s a catalyst that makes the overstuffed mind burst at a seam or two, and then, denial isn’t a working option.

Learning to just look at the pile of compartmentalized things requires a certain amount of cognitive training, in order to manage the accompanying thoughts and feelings. And even with that, I find compartmentalization to be an active process - I engage in it several times a day, either putting things away, or taking them out in order to process them a bit.

Only you can know how long you can sustain keeping things boxed up before it’s necessary to look at them again, even briefly. I tend to find that simply going to therapy - even if we are taking a break from specifically working on the trauma - sort of forces me to acknowledge the reality of what’s in those boxes. It’s actually a relief to do so, b/c if I ignore everything for more than a couple of weeks, it starts pushing back at me.

 

[frogthroat]

I do all or nothing thinking alot especially when I'm really frustrated. I have a hard time with concentration and violent images flashing in and out all day. Some of these images were shown to me during abuse and T said that's a form of mind control and that it's going to be hard to undo the programming. I guess what I haven't addressed with her is how hard it is for me to concentrate. It's even hard for me to concentrate long enough to put the things I need to in the box so I just react to therapy things I can't seem to do well with fury. I would say I have very little cognitive skill and I go back and forth between rumination to denial. I can't concentrate enough to read a book or draw anymore. It just makes me feel lazy. Even housework that would maybe take a half hour tops takes half the day because I'm constantly spacing out.
I think it would probably be in my best interest to make a list of issues I'm having and take it to therapy because I'm terrible in the heat of the moment. T says I don't have anxiety so I'm not sure what the lack of concentration is. All I know is I'm very frustrated and I'm not sure if I'm getting better or worse at thus point. I know I'm not making it any better by being so vehement but sometimes something just clicks off. I wish I knew what it was. My emotions seem to be either on or off. I've never learned how to control them. It's really difficult for me to grasp.

 

[joeylittle]

I can't concentrate enough to read a book or draw anymore...T says I don't have anxiety so I'm not sure what the lack of concentration is.

This could be a depression symptom.

I think making a list and bringing it to therapy is a great idea.

Something I did once with my psychiatrist that was very helpful to me - I was having a hard time understanding what my symptoms were actually called. Partly because I tended to minimize, and partly because my experience of them didn’t match the words used to describe them. Example: I experienced working very hard to concentrate, and that my work output was slow. I also had a headache all the time. I did not think this would be described as “difficulty concentrating”... in my own understanding it was more like, “trouble thinking”. But, according to the language of psychiatric diagnostics - those are the same thing.

It was a game-changer in terms of my ability to name what was happening to me. Being able to name it is the first step towards being able to change it.

I don’t know if your T is qualified to diagnose. If she’s not, you may want to ask for a referral to a psychiatrist. But, she should be able to talk with you about what you are experiencing, and help you understand how to name them.

I’d also encourage you to look into a PHP or IOP. They are great for learning the foundations of cognitive therapy/cognitive skills. Once you’ve gotten a handle on some of those basics, you’ll find you can be much more effective in managing the things that cause you distress. And that’s a very empowering thing.

If a PHP or IOP isn’t an option, you can ask your therapist to take you through the basics.

Ultimately, I’ve found DBT (rather than CBT) to be more useful in providing a set of skills for me to use. But it all starts with the basics of CBT. You can of course learn them on your own, but I believe it’s valuable to learn them from a clinician. They’ll teach you how to start dismantling your cognitive distortions, and b/c of those distortions, it’s easy to mis-understand the information if you’re just trying to teach yourself.

 

[Starfire]

I've been in therapy for 4 months now and while I would say that I'm doing better I still feel there...

Familiar with the feeling or nonfeeling..been there. Sometimes want to go back. Awfully peoplely out there. Here's what happened with me: started getting irritated at everything, big & small events, important to me & unimportant to me people etc. Decided stoicism would help. Massive misunderstanding of tenets there! Well, a little alcohol might be beneficial. It was. But a little only helped for a short while. End result..back where I had been with the feelings years later. Kind of say it was worth it as I ended up with a great T who really understands. Only say that on really good days!! Almost left in the first couple months as I wanted a date for my mission accomplished. May your journey be much shorter......

 

[frogthroat]

I’d also encourage you to look into a PHP or IOP

I had to look up what those were.:wacky: I'm not sure it would work with me working full time. The PHP near me was for people post - hospitalization with severe mental illness and I couldn't find an IOP. I will ask about DBT and CBT though but I'm wondering if she's wanting me to get my depression somewhat under control first which is why she suggested anti-depressants.

irritated at everything, big & small events, important to me & unimportant to me people etc. Decided stoicism would help. Massive misunderstanding of tenets there! Well, a little alcohol might be beneficial. It was. But a little only helped for a short while.

Yes, this is literally how I lived through all of my twenties. There just came a day last year when I snapped like a twig and cried for hours and probably slept for two days straight. I knew it wasn't going to work anymore. The cynicism and alcoholism was too much. I knew I could never feel anything good continuing on that way.

 

[MyWillow]

An odd anecdote that seems to kick me in the @r$e whenever I think of it.

Middle of a T session. Dissociated to the point where it feels like I’m not in control of my thoughts or speech. It’s only my job to find the words. Terrified child is frozen and offers nothing except 2-3 word responses when really pushed. T eventually asks “what are you thinking?” And my mouth replies “numb is better.”

Just reminds me where that feeling of numb really originates from. I think?