Massive backfire in therapy - don't know what to do

[beaneeboo]

Wow thank you for all your replies/ questions/ answers everyone .. I feel very supported... have tried to reply to all your comments in one post as per below..

Yes he is a trauma therapist. He has let me know he has first hand experience of trauma...hasn't said what but hinted he understands ptsd issues first hand. He has lots of experience working with various trauma types...

No I don't think he was attacking me. He was attacking the dissociative disorder specialist and how he framed some things in the video. (Some things were valid. Others less so e.g 'there's no evidence for these disorders/ how to deal with them'. Which is unfortunate as I think I'm right in saying the guys recommendations in these videos are based on national/international guidelines as well as lots of general trauma therapist experience). But T being contrary to what the specialist was saying felt invalidating to my perspective (like he was saying 'You're wrong!,) because I'd told him for the first time, I have someone describing what alot of my experience is. Which is comforting on one level I tried to say I thought there was a difference between experiencing dissociation episodes (e.g depersonalisation) and having a disorder where I have amnesia, (i feel I'm living separate lives though I have awareness of this - it's not a full amnesic barrier). So I was trying to say there needs to be a distinction between the two because there needs to be different therapy approaches for each. And the guy in the videos did a good job at suggesting strategies for having a disorder e.g communication with parts (which I've found hard to do and think I need help with). T's response was 'Why do we need to make a distinction?' And that felt invalidating to me. Because my life feels very affected by my OSDD. T doesn't like the word disorder- says what happened to me was abnormal, not my reaction to it. Fair point. But also, my life is adversely affected and I can't pretend I'm normal when my life is not. My life feels disordered. And there should be no shame in recognising that.

Good point about not expecting T to watch the vids and be trained. I don't think i expected that but I think there's good training on dissociative disorders out there if he wants to access it. So I don't buy the 'I don't have access to training' thing. Though I take your points about it taking a while to learn these skills. He has alot of knowledge and skill in trauma work. But I think less so specifically for dissociative disorders.

I think you're right @Movingforward10 - he misjudged his reaction to what I was saying (and did bring his own shit into the relationship) and it was a poor thought out moment. Which I know he'll regret. I understand he's human (he definitely wasn't going on a rampage).

OK I'll take on board from everyone about ruptures in therapy. Right now I can't see how i can go back. But maybe things will settle enough for me to be able to just go and see what happens. I didn't have a voice in session. He needs to know i felt threatened, blamed and that he was angry. (I don't think he was angry with me - that's what I felt. I own those feelings. But I do think he felt threatened. And I think it's unacceptable that a therapist hints that the client has broken trust in the relationship- especially when all I did was try to broaden our understanding of my situation. How can I see that as anything else other than finger pointing from his side? He also needs to know his ego got in the way (don't know if I can say that though).

In all honesty the fact I'm not allowed to email between sessions is very hard for me. I don't expect a response but it would help immensely to know i can send it and we can address it in session. Yes I could journal but this isn't easy as I have to do it electronically. And by the end of the week I look back at what's written and it's too overwhelming to bring to session to discuss - so I don't. Then the gap widens between us. If he has it to bring to session, I know we have to address this gap.

I also can't hack the sessions only being 50 mins. Today was the first time parts came out in session. And the session ran over by 20 mins because 50 MINS WASN'T ENOUGH!

 

[Friday]

I also can't hack the sessions only being 50 mins. Today was the first time parts came out in session. And the session ran over by 20 mins because 50 MINS WASN'T ENOUGH!

Book 120 minute sessions?

 

[Teamwork]

Interesting conversation . My t has said that he does not spend a lot of time reading what’s out there in order to help me. He uses his training and it works. I do plenty outside of therapy of using the stuff that is out there that helps me come back to therapy session ready to work. The fact that he recognized the dissociative state and worked to ground you so you could leave safely is a measure of what he already knows about you and has the skills to help you ground. 10 months is a huge investment. When I dissociate to the extent you describe it also dissipates to a degree what I’m perceiving is actually going on. You are a team or at least should be aiming to work together so this material was hopefully presented as I found this, I like it, what do you think about it? Are you familiar? Do you use any of it? This way you are inviting a dialogue and in that you can say how stuck you feel. It’s great you recognize it. Half the time I’m not able to do that but my t recognizes it. This is a possibility of growth. Doesn’t sound as if anything is broken just it went a little off the beaten track. Probably for both of you. Hopefully you can use it on your own and see if you hear anything in it that your t uses with you already. This happens for me a lot where I have these aha moments of recognition that he is employing this or that theory. All told consider the 10 months and if there are ways to team up.

 

[beaneeboo]

Book 120 minute sessions?

Bit too long... could ask for 75 mins. But I'm afraid the answer will be no. He has never offered any other time.

 

[beaneeboo]

Interesting conversation . My t has said that he does not spend a lot of time reading what’s out there in order to help me. He uses his training and it works. I do plenty outside of therapy of using the stuff that is out there that helps me come back to therapy session ready to work.

I feel this is what I did. My own research, brought it to therapy where it was rejected. I wasn't allowed to bring it in the room as far as he's concerned because he doesn't have that training / doesn't agree with some of it. But where does that leave me? I have a diagnosis of DDNOS (OSDD)...If he doesn't agree with it where does that leave me and my experience? Is it not valid? The other thing is I told him about this within the first 6 weeks of therapy. We're now around 10 months in. Could he not have said back then he didn't have access to training on it then?

I'm finding it really hard to know how we're a team if he thinks that in sharing what I did i broke the trust between us. I didn't imagine this.

10 months is a huge investment.

It really is. Biggest I've made in therapy. I've already been to hell and back to get this far. If I stop with him now I don't know where that will lead me.

When I dissociate to the extent you describe it also dissipates to a degree what I’m perceiving is actually going on. You are a team or at least should be aiming to work together so this material was hopefully presented as I found this, I like it, what do you think about it? Are you familiar? Do you use any of it? This way you are inviting a dialogue and in that you can say how stuck you feel.

I thought that is how I presented it. But maybe it didn't come across that way. I certainly didn't say to him 'You don't know what you're doing but this guy does'. But maybe he could have clarified during the session - 'What did you want us to use from this advice? Did you want me to find out more about it?'

All told consider the 10 months and if there are ways to team up.

I think that's what I was trying to do. Add another perspective and strategy to our basket. But it got interpreted as me breaking the trust we'd built up.

 

[beaneeboo]

Notes to self on this:

Try to separate objectively what happened from what you felt whilst it was happening.

You felt he was above you getting angry and forcefully blaming you for how bad of a person you are and that you are to blame for ruining your relationship with him. You felt threatened. You felt invalidated. You felt he was trying to mess with your mind to break you down.

He was sat in his chair. He didn't raise his voice. He spoke softly through a lot of it. He said some dumb things in the moment (like intimating the trust was broken because you brought what you did to session)... but other than this the things he said weren't directed at you (too much of it wasn't about you and about his feelings instead).

Trying to hold on to objectivity. But at the same time feeling like I've done something very wrong. And that he wanted to make me feel that way. Keep the 2 separate.

 

[whiteraven]

I sent him an email (which I'm not supposed to do)

Did he tell you at some point you are not supposed to email?

I told him about what I have found interesting about this information and that I think, as the videos suggest, that I should start trying to communicate with my parts.

This is all so hard. I applaud you for doing your own research and trying to understand what might help you move forward.

also wrote how I'm feeling stuck in therapy because so much happens during the week which i can't bring to the therapy room. Because I can't remember it, or, if I've made a log of different feelings / thoughts / states I experience, I then can't relate to what I've written and it feels too big to discuss in a 50 min session. So then I don't bring it. And the gap between therapy and what happens between sessions gets wider. I need more structure and options to manage this and him to help with this - didn't say that last bit. I hoped the videos would give us suggestions. Including working on my increasingly failing memory.

I'm having this same issue--with being stuck and not able to remember/talk during session. I do sent him email, though, and he is able to guide me in discussions based on those. My T has been upfront in saying he's not sure where to go next--I continue to see him more for just support than therapy these days.

When I went in the room he was welcoming and asked me to tell him about it all which i felt relieved about because I thought I'd done something wrong by emailing. But he then quickly started questioning the material that I'd brought, in an consistent negative way. Didn't agree with alot of it. I felt he was gently challenging me on the other guy's view points. T's body language and eyes told me he wasn't interested in really hearing why I felt these videos struck a cord. He was waiting to prove they weren't as useful as I thought.

So, I used to see a psychiatrist who did NOT believe in DID (which I was diagnosed with)--he had no interest in discussing techniques that might benefit my dissociation, and I found out later that he had been taught in medical school that it didn't exist (he was really old and graduated in the early 70s)--I continued to see him, but our sessions were limited to treatment for depression, which was also an issue.

It then got more heated and he started saying he felt to blame (I think because I'd said I felt stuck in therapy?) and that we'd spent 9 months building trust and that I was now bringing this to session, and he didn't know what to do because he's not trained in those therapy approaches... and doesn't have access to this material (which is incorrect - all the videos are free on line)...

My therapist said exactly the same (except for the part about the videos). I took it as him being straightforward, honest, and wanting to let me know where he was in his thinking then.

As others have said, training in a particular mode would need to come from a reliable source and not just videos on the internet.

I felt threatened and that he was angry and felt I'd done something really wrong. He told me I hadn't and he was my ally and that all my reactions were hard for me but really useful to share more with him so he can understand more about what happens and what triggers me/ how I react..

I think your reactions here are very common. I react like this often and later often learn that I interpreted things incorrectly.

.I simultaneously felt gas lit because he said those things to me and pointed a finger which triggered that reaction, then the session was about me and my reaction - not how he had triggered it. He did say he realised he needs to be more careful and handle these things with more care. I don't think he said sorry but I felt he should have done.

So, by pointing a finger do you mean that he started questioning the info you were talking about? That doesn't feel like finger-pointing to me; it feels more like letting you know where he stands on things.

I haven't often heard the words "I'm sorry" in therapy, but an acknowledgment that things need to be done differently is common, and it is a way of apologizing, at least for me.

We went over the session by 20 minutes because he made sure I was back in the room... and feeling OK enough to leave...

Actually, this is pretty amazing. I've had only one T who was careful about that, and there were lots of times I shouldn't have left!

Do I go back? Or do I walk away from what feels like it was a breach of power and trust? Very confused and upset right now.

I understand how hard and disappointing this was for you, but I don't quite see a "breach of power." Maybe I'm missing something?

 

[Charbella]

Does he not believe the diagnosis? If so he shouldn’t be your therapist. Doesn’t matter how long you’ve invested, kind of hard to get anything out of therapy for a disorder your therapist believes you don’t have.

 

[tofubreadcoriander]

Ok. He did not go on a rampage (my bad). He was calm during the entire conversation. And he grounded you for the extra 20 minutes. That's good. However, this does not rule out the fact that you felt invalidated. And I think you've a good point. I too would expect my trauma therapist to be open to suggestions for new material, explore it together and draw a conclusion. If you find that material useful it means it is meaningful to you. I wouldn't rule it out. It may point you towards a new direction in finding someone who is better fit for you. Have you researched therapists that specialize in dissociative disorders in your area?

 

[Movingforward10]

I think there is a difference in T's understanding and specialising in parts, fragmented selves, disassociation (which your T does) and T's who don't.
Your T seems to not see it as a disorder (he has said that right?), but a natural part of coping with trauma.
So, how ibread this, is him not invalidating your experiences, how you are made up, and what happened, but just not putting a 'disorder' label on it.

T:s make mistakes. It's horrible horrible horrible when it happens.
But also, learning to recover from these things is vital. No relationship is perfect. It feels so painful when T's make these mistakes. But, he will learn from it. I'm sure he bitterly regrets the session. And I am sure he will take it to supervision. He was taking responsibility for things in the session and reflecting.
You have 10 months of him being caring and getting his intervention with you mostly spot on. 1 bad session out of all of that? Is worth working through.

How many threads have I started with things like this?! Quite a few. And, whilst I still feel the pain of the really big rupture, I understand it now and it helps with other ruptures and with relationships in general.

I hope you can go to your next session and talk it through.
Maybe say you feel you need an apology. Let him explain himself.
I believe you'll feel much better if you do.

 

[Friday]

Given how distorted (you’re a terrible person) your filter was running in session… how sure are you he was blaming you for breaking trust, rather than..

<facepalm> Nearly a year to build trust, and when she finally does? I can’t do what she wants me to do >.<

 

[beaneeboo]

Did he tell you at some point you are not supposed to email?

Yes. At the beg of therapy he said not to unless it was for admin. That he would have to delete my emails due to GDPR reasons. Which I don't agree with because if I consent to the emails being sent to him, knowing the risks, there's no GDPR issue.

Its a problem for me because it means I can't have this experience in therapy (as you describe):

I do sent him email, though, and he is able to guide me in discussions based on those.

My T has been upfront in saying he's not sure where to go next--I continue to see him more for just support than therapy these days.

Sounds like a good relationship you have. Open and honest.

So, by pointing a finger do you mean that he started questioning the info you were talking about?

Yes.

That doesn't feel like finger-pointing to me; it feels more like letting you know where he stands on things.

I get this. The reason why it felt like finger pointing was he asked me to explain my thinking around why it was important to me. But the whole time he had a facial expression of not understanding/ agreeing what I was saying and argued against my reasoning. I felt like there was nothing I could have said to get him to hear what i was saying, he wasn't truly open to listening (i felt flustered and embarrassed because his face was saying 'What you're saying doesn't make sense). It was challenging.

Actually, this is pretty amazing. I've had only one T who was careful about that, and there were lots of times I shouldn't have left!

I agree. There have been times he wasn't aware of my dissociation. But I feel he's tuning in more now.

I understand how hard and disappointing this was for you, but I don't quite see a "breach of power." Maybe I'm missing something?

Maybe I am too. I think the reason I felt this was because he invited me to share my thoughts on the matter, didn't truly listen, negated my perspective, intimated I'd brought something to therapy which has compromised 10 months of us building trust, that he feels in a difficult place because I'm asking him to treat me in a way he doesn't have training in, but actually he's known for about 8 months i have DDNOS. All these things made me dissociate because I felt under threat. He then said at the end it was a big step forward that parts came out in therapy. Where as I'm thinking they came out because a protective mechanism kicked in due to how he handled the situation badly. That didn't feel like a healthy 'coming out' of choice. All the while the focus is on my dissociation- not his role in it also.

Very easy to put the problem on the person receiving therapy and highlight their coping mechanisms whilst ignoring the therapist's part in it.