Relationship Question To Supporters: What Do You Do And Why Do You Do It?

[p-no]

Hello,

I would be grateful to all supporters if you could answer the above question/s for me (sufferer).

Here's some background info:

I have been getting to know a man who does not have PTSD on a forum for chronically ill and/or disabled people. He claims to be there because he has a back issue which forced him to end his previous career. He was married to a woman who had another disorder and whose behaviour had become intrusive/invasive that he had a physical and mental breakdown as he claims, so he seems to have experience with mental illness, on some level at least. All he's been saying has made sense, is coherent, seems real. I have no reason to not believe what he has been saying. The relationship has been growing steadily, for only four weeks now though. We haven't talked, neither in person nor on the phone, but have written long messages about every second day. Today we exchanged our mobile phone numbers (because I might not be able to access the internet much over the next few weeks). He's in his early 40s and now works in a home for the elderly as an "assistant" (silly word, even in German), i.e. he keeps the people there busy e.g. by offering memory training classes, gymnastics, outings like bowling, taking them to appointments. His job is about helping them stay happy and thus healthy. I increasingly like him.

So, he has always shown great interest in learning what PTSD is and what it entails. I provided him two sheets, one giving my own PTSD Cup explanation and another one giving an overview on PTSD with a focus on my symptoms, etc. He got it and read it and wrote that it has helped him understand and that he printed my e-mail as well as the two sheets and will keep rereading them to wrap his head around it. He has also asked some very good questions, "deep questions", as I call them. He's really trying to understand it on a deeper level than just the usual "PTSD bullet points".

So, my questions are:

1. What do you do to understand your partner with PTSD?
2. Why do you do what you do to understand your partner with PTSD?

The reason I am asking is that it's difficult for me to understand that it seems so difficult to understand PTSD and the ways our brain work for you. :) I know, sounds silly, but I explained something to him in detail and I personally think it's very well explained, so I don't understand why it's so difficult to "believe" it, so to speak. Also, I wonder what it is you hope for by understanding it more. What do you think will change if you understand it on a very deep level? I am really asking for your inner reasons to do it.

I'd appreciate only supporters replying (simply because I have tons of theories myself, but I want to know from actual people what their factual answers are).

Thanks very much!

 

[HEART BROKEN]

My husband was diagnosed after we were already married for 4 years. His symptoms manifested 2 years in to our marriage. Knowing him and who he was prior to the break through is what pushed me to find answers. He would often speak of his past (physical, sexual, and emotional abusive childhood, failed first marriage, and frequent dead end relationships), also sharing his feelings of inabilities, worthlessness, and fears. This was deeply saddening for me. After spending a year on unfamiliar ground with a lot of uncertainties I began researching answers, I was unwilling to accept things as they were without any understanding of why and how we got to this level.

The research I did lead me to this website, where I read familiar stories of pain and suffering. I wanted him to not only be a survivor of the abuse, but a thriver where he could learn to feel worthy of having fulfilling and safe relationships. To my core, I believe my husband to be the most wonderful, generous, loving, honest person I have the fortune of knowing, however his past causes him to at times withdraw and shut down emotionally and physically. I have learned that every one of his actions or in-actions has a deep level meaning of some sorts.

I am no expert and we have only been facing PTSD head on for the last year and half, however we have both gained a better understanding and mutual respect for one and other. My husband has worked really hard and still is, as PTSD can be a daily challenge. I keep myself well aware and sensitive to his body language and needs. I continue learning from him, therapy, this web site, self awareness, and self teachings to be the best partner that I can be for him.

I believe that if I continue to understand him and his PTSD on a deep level, I will benefit from having a deeper sense of sensitivity and connection to what happened to him and how that makes him who he is today. He will often say that I have no idea of what he feels, this is true, but what I can do is be the best supporter to him in his time of need.

Best of luck finding a supporter willing to understand and fight for the good.

 

[ISupportHer]

So, my questions are:

1. What do you do to understand your partner with PTSD?
2. Why do you do what you do to understand your partner with PTSD?

Thanks very much!

1)
\Too much, LOL. Well at the start. I've posted about this before. I staged an all out assault in trying to understand. Podcasts, books, internet sites, support groups, tried to communicate with her Social Worker, picked anyone's brain that I could. Several web forums as the potential diagnosis changed. She said she was told she had depression, so I found a depression forum. Then maybe bipolar, so I joined a forum about that. Doing ECT, so I joined a forum about that too. Went to 3 therapists a total of 4 times over a few years.

I did what you see many supporters do and what I see as a common reaction. I was in a panic and I over-reacted. Some was because of a fear that she would harm herself and that I had to do something to prevent it. It took time for me, as many new supporters come to find, that I cannot directly make the changes for my wife. I would read that and hear that but it took a while to understand that and accept that. I had to look at myself and my own reactions. Learn about my own part of it all before I could feel I could pause, take a breath and then absorb what I learned.

Probably this forum has been what helped the most as I learned how to be a supporter as opposed to reacting. Friendships I have had now for 3 or 4 years.

2)
I read others talk about their relationships and then find that they sometimes have only known each other for weeks or months. I don't know if I would have had the ability to keep going if my relationship was at that stage. This coming June will be our 35th wedding anniversary. I think that our established relationship has been part the reason we've stayed together. Not the only reason, of course. We all change with time, but I still see the person who I fell in love with over 35 years ago. She IS different now, but so am I most likely.

 

[p-no]

Thank you, hopeful in love and ISH, for your replies. I am getting a lot out of them on many levels, not only as a sufferer asking those questions and getting replies to that, but also as a former supporter and my own reasons for why I became a supporter of someone and later left. I relate to both of you a lot with regard to many things you have said. I do feel one or two follow-up questions coming up but it's three at night so I'll come back. Thank you.

 

[myvetswife]

1. What do you do to understand your partner with PTSD?

Join this forum (which he found, he is over the combat site now).

Watch the cup explanation. We even showed it to our son and draw it on a black bord in the hall, so my husband only has to point on it if he realises his cup is getting too full

And talk. Talk talk talk. Very important between us. He can say (most of the time) how he feels and what he needs and I try to give it to him (Space, a cuddles etc.)

2. Why do you do what you do to understand your partner with PTSD?

We are together over 22 years now, but he only got diagnosed 4 years ago. To improve our relationship and our family live. Simply because we love each other.

 

[BigBear]

2. Why do you do what you do to understand your partner with PTSD?

Because I care!

Even if we weren't married, I'd care. As a friend, I couldn't be there for her as much. But I'd do everything possible given our relative situations. As a friend, it would be very hard to learn about triggers, for instance. When you don't live it, it is just a word. The world also thinks of it as just a word. You just get over words. But that's not so for triggers. Triggers aren't something that you can just ignore. It takes main force and lots of time fighting it (on the sufferer's part), for each and every one. Well triggers are just one of many concepts that the world doesn't teach supporters.

1. What do you do to understand your partner with PTSD?

When I met Angle2Write, she was a woman in need. I didn't know what from. But I knew I could help. I guess I thought she was just getting over a bad marriage.

HERE, ANGEL SHOULD STOP READING!

REALLY, STOP READING.

PLEASE!

So anyway, the beginning was a desperate time. She said one thing but did the opposite. Every day challenged me. But I knew that I cared. And I knew that what ever was going, she needed me. If anyone needs me I will kill myself trying to help.

Closing on our 10th year of marriage (this is a rough estimate, I didn't keep notes.) I started to accept that there was more there then met the eyes. She had been searching and searching for answers. She had no memory at this point of the multiple sexual assaults going back (so for) to the age of 4, nor did she have much memory of the systematic torture by her parents. Both of whom by the way should have been put down as rabid animals. I think that she saw that I would support her there to and started including me. She was finally diagnosed a little over 2 years ago, at the age of 38 with PTSD.

Until then, I had only been supporting by being on her side. I also accept that I could never be right. Now finally I started to learn why. She had me read many things. (If you have the option, do not take a supporter who has a learning disability in reading.) Then she found this forum and asked me to join. Comparing notes here brought the whole thing into living color. It became understandable.

There were still some nasty surprises that kept me from getting the whole picture. As in we now have a solid diagnosis of DID with 8 for certain alters... That knowledge sure cleared up a lot more things.

What do I do:

• 
  *learn her triggers
  *avoid her triggers
  *watch for others that are going to stumble into her triggers and help her extricate from them
  *give her space so that in private she can put back in all of her stuffing that just exploded all over the floor
  *be encouraging
  *defend her against all comers
  *just plain love her

I'm sure that this list needs some adding to. LOL!

Hope this helps!

Bear

 

[Eleanor]

1. What do you do to understand your partner with PTSD?
2. Why do you do what you do to understand your partner with PTSD?

I've been thinking about how to answer these questions.

1) I'm a geek. I read and read and then read some more. I come here. I look at the research literature. I talk to him about what is going on with him. He first figured out the PTSD on his own, and then things came into focus more. We found a T, got him diagnosed... and we debrief and strategize and try to cope with life in the meantime. He is getting a lot better. I think about his trauma's I try to help him identify feelings. I search (mostly unsuccessfully) for ways to help him get "out" of episodes when he falls in. I also try to anticipate/notice when the cup is getting full and take evasive action.

I have to work hard NOT to take responsibility for his feelings and actions, and to expect him to be "normal" and "reasonable." At the same time I try to be sensitive to the fact that he is dealing with a really tricky set of issues.

I try to make sure he gets enough sleep, rest and his diet is working for him.

I don't know... A lot of stuff I guess...

2) Because I love him and he passed the Pooh and Piglet test. The Pooh and Piglet test is the one Pooh runs in one of the stories when he is trying to decide who to go see. "I could spend a happy morning seeing Owl. I could spend a happy morning not seeing Owl." And runs through everyone until he gets to Piglet and realizes "I could spend a happy morning seeing Piglet. I COULDN'T spend a happy morning NOT seeing Piglet." And thus the decision is made. I couldn't spend a happy life NOT seeing my H.

Plus he is the father of my daughter.

Plus he and I are both compulsive "troubleshooters." We fix things. :)

 

[BigBear]

he and I are both compulsive "troubleshooters." We fix things.

That's a super critical characteristic for a supportrer. But the supporter also needs to learn how to do it non-invasively... I'm still trying to learn that one!

Bear

 

[p-no]

Thank you all very much for replying! I really appreciate it!

Some things have brought up some others, so here they are. Even if a question is not addressed to you, I'd appreciate all your replies.

every one of his actions or in-actions has a deep level meaning of some sorts

This is very true. I think this is something every supporter should know.

I keep myself well aware and sensitive to his body language and needs. I continue learning from him, therapy, this web site, self awareness, and self teachings to be the best partner that I can be for him.

What I have found in all supporters’ replies and many other posts from supporters around the forums is a deep level of commitment. I wonder though, how do you manage to not cross the line to getting co-dependent, to give him more credit and more attention than you’d give yourself?

I was in a panic and I over-reacted.

Yes, I know that well, I did the same with my then husband and his disorder. I think many people do this in an attempt to find ways of dealing with things.

I learned how to be a supporter as opposed to reacting

Also something that all supporters should know.

35th wedding anniversary

That is a long time! Very happy to read this.

Talk talk talk.

So, this is another thing. Does this “talk” include talking about the actual traumas? I mean, do you want to know the actual traumas? How deep in detail? Would it have made a change if he had told you very early into the relationship? What would have been good for you?

He can say (most of the time) how he feels and what he needs and I try to give it to him (Space, a cuddles etc.)

And back to the question of crossing the line and becoming co-dependent, or not. Can you do the same with him, i.e. tell him how you feel and what you need and is he able to give it to him (generally speaking)? I am asking this question because I wonder if most relationships between a PTSD sufferer and supporter are unequal with one giving more?

You just get over words. But that's not so for triggers. Triggers aren't something that you can just ignore. It takes main force and lots of time fighting it (on the sufferer's part), for each and every one.

Bear, I would just like to give you some courage in that it is possible to lower the impact of triggers considerably. I have been in (and out of ) therapy for almost 20 years now, starting at 19, then diagnosed with anxiety. With regard to triggers, I can say that the longest a trigger knocks me over now is about 3-5 minutes. Those are the absolute longest-lasting and there was one last year. My other triggers, and no, they’re not gone, usually last seconds to a minute maybe, and I deal with them myself. I doubt anyone even notices, at least most of the time.

From what I understand you said that you come across words (i.e. “trigger”) when reading up/learning about PTSD, but they at first hold no meaning until you have experienced one (as a supporter), or even more. When learning about them, have you ever come across someone (PTSD sufferer) explaining the trigger inside out? I mean, not just something like “the man’s breathing reminded me of my ex-husband”, but rather very much in detail, i.e. that first part but also the whys, and the effects on my body and feelings, the panic, the connection to the one trauma with the ex-husband, but maybe more connections to other traumas, because sometimes triggers can send you back to several traumas on different levels at the same time, etc.? If so, i.e. if you have ever come about a sufferer giving detailed information about a specific trigger, did you understand it? Were you able to accept what they said as something real? Or were you not able to really believe it?

If anyone needs me I will kill myself trying to help.

Again, that same question. How do you maintain your own self, your own boundaries? How do you not make her the center of the relationship? (I am asking this question with regard to not doing anything myself to make that happen without any intension to do so. So I’d like to make myself aware of what could be my share in letting it get that far.)

Comparing notes here brought the whole thing into living color.

Again, the question as to how much would you like to know? I have no trouble with talking about my traumas so I can communicate them well (despite few details of few traumas). Since I don’t want to cross anyone’s boundaries, and certainly not those of someone trying really hard to understand, I need a gauge telling me how much is okay. I mean, once you’ve said it you’ve said it. I talked to my therapist about this and she said that I have such an extensive, intensive trauma history that she could easily imagine overwhelming someone who has not experienced trauma themselves. So, where do I start, where do I stop?

I do realize it’s a personal thing, i.e. you may want to know all, no matter what, and supporter X would not be able to deal with any details, etc. All I can do is ask some of you and make my own decision when it is time.

So far, the man I have been getting to know has asked what my PTSD is from and I said there are several things. He hasn’t asked more about it for now, and I, personally, would say that we’re not there yet, on a level where you would talk about them directly. (We have not met in person as he lives quite far away.)

I have to work hard NOT to take responsibility for his feelings and actions, and to expect him to be "normal" and "reasonable" At the same time I try to be sensitive to the fact that he is dealing with a really tricky set of issues.

Same thing, Eleanor. How do you keep the boundaries, how do you not let his needs and wants and the PTSD take over?

 

[BigBear]

When learning about them, have you ever come across someone (PTSD sufferer) explaining the trigger inside out?

Yes, but you just can't get the reality without the experience. Having lived through Angel being triggered completely changed how I viewed them for ever.

If a person was born Blind, you can tell them all about the color green. They'll get to know a lot about the color. But when their eyes are suddenly healed. their understanding of green will suddenly change!

Before I experienced the trigger, knowing what it was, I misunderstood so many things...

f you have ever come about a sufferer giving detailed information about a specific trigger, did you understand it? Were you able to accept what they said as something real? Or were you not able to really believe it?

In ways, I understood it. But in other ways, the reality changed so vastly with experiencing it. Further, more iterations of experiencing it enhanced that understanding. We are growing beings. 16 years later, I still grow in my in my understanding of what she goes through.

Again, that same question. How do you maintain your own self, your own boundaries? How do you not make her the center of the relationship?

I'm afraid that is not such a good question for me. That's just the way I'm wired. I need to make her the center of our relationship. Sadly that frightens her. Even after 16 years. I have to hide a lot of that to prevent that.

However, I do have days that I need to put myself first. I feel very guilty about those. Much more guilty before I got my own therapist.

So I’d like to make myself aware of what could be my share in letting it get that far.

To that, I'd guess I'd say that your supporter has a right to care more deeply than you can initially stand. I think it is really a critical part of a good supporter. They are going to be strong em-paths and you won't want that. But it is part of who they are and they can no more be rid of that than you can cut out an eye.

Just watch for things to get out of hand. And then stop and talk about them...

how much would you like to know?

I want to know everything, about Angel. But I started with limits. Remember, you are not actually hurting us. But we do feel for you. Start easy... Talk afterwards about how the trauma talk went. Feel for the current limit. Get him to express how near his limit you are. Remember that his range will grow. Also, He'll start to expect the new traumas.

Angel keeps coming up with new trauma's and new fuller ways of expressing them. I can see the gaps where there are new traumas that she hasn't been able to see for herself. I believe now that I am ready for anything that she has to tell me. If it were some sort of sci fi bio feedback, maybe not. But telling, yes I think that I got it covered. And it only took 16 years...

The most important thing I can say is to keep the lines of communication open! And start slow. You have to learn to trust them, too!

supporter X would not be able to deal with any details, etc.

I'm afraid that I'd say that was pretty much not a supporter. But that's just me...

He hasn’t asked more about it for now, and I, personally, would say that we’re not there yet, on a level where you would talk about them directly.

A suggestion, ask if he'd want to know some non-detailed things. If yes, afterwards debug. Find out if you shocked him. Also, if he hits a trigger (of yours), help him to understand why the trigger happened, if you know. That means providing some details.

Last thought. Get the "safe word" going but in reverse. You've probably established a safe word with your therapist. Have him establish a safe word with you so he can tell you when he's maxed out. Then when he gets it settled go back and see how and why he got maxed out. You'll be surprised how much you are learning about you while you are learning about him...

Bear

PS: Sorry this was so long! One of my personal problems to trigger (used improperly) on.

 

[Eleanor]

I wonder though, how do you manage to not cross the line to getting co-dependent, to give him more credit and more attention than you’d give yourself?

I'm afraid I am back and forth over this line all the time. It helps that I have a standing T appointment and that my T is very good about "throwing the BS flag" on me. I pay her good money to nag me on this stuff! :)

Does this “talk” include talking about the actual traumas? I mean, do you want to know the actual traumas? How deep in detail? Would it have made a change if he had told you very early into the relationship? What would have been good for you?

Yes. Actually he told me one of his key traumas on our second date. I was honored that he shared this with me and had NO IDEA what it meant. :bag: This is a hard question for me to answer. I don't think our relationship would have started/flourished if his PTSD had been bad when we started dating. I have many many times thought that I didn't sign up for all this. And likely if it weren't for our daughter I would not be tough enough to stick it out. But I think we are over the biggest hump, and I'm glad we are all here. My H's traumas are not (so far as I or he knows at this point) sexual, however, and that might well be a significant difference.

I am asking this question because I wonder if most relationships between a PTSD sufferer and supporter are unequal with one giving more?

I think all relationships are a "dance" with a shifting balance over time. The intention is that it evens out in the long run.

How do you maintain your own self, your own boundaries? How do you not make her the center of the relationship?

This would be the 64,000 dollar question! It is a continuing practice/inquiry. I probably suck at this. PTSD has a kind of "black hole" quality to it - sucking everything in. I moved out. We've yet to get co-located again - I think it has been almost two years. He still needs the space a lot of the time. :( but we are moving toward all living together again. Now L and I are sad when we leave... That's new.

Again, the question as to how much would you like to know?

As much as I need to to understand him and help him understand him. I don't watch yucky movies or have much of a taste for scary or violent stuff... So I guess... but then I am curious too, and want to have ALL the data... So, hard to draw this line, not knowing what I don't know...

How do you keep the boundaries, how do you not let his needs and wants and the PTSD take over?

I work with my T. I try to maintain (oh how Epic a FAIL here) a life of my own. But then I am a mostly single mom too, so ... I always seem to be at the mercy of someone's needs. But we have started being really good about letting me take Friday evening and some of Sat. AM to myself. So carving out "me" time is a good good thing. I am MUCH calmer since we started doing this.

 

[p-no]

Bear and Eleanor,

Thank you both!

I am working on a reply to what Bear said and I always take a lot of time doing so because of English not being my native English and especially wanting to ensure as best I can that I am actually saying what I really do want to say! So, need some more time. (And a little "warning": It is going to be looooong. :))

Eleanor, I will also need some time to reply to yours; there are some things I'd like to comment on that need some more thinking. But this struck me right now and although I am sooooo hungry :hungry:, I want to comment.

My H's traumas are not (so far as I or he knows at this point) sexual, however, and that might well be a significant difference.

Just saying: my sexual traumas (several throughout my life) are by far the lesser ones (with regard to processing, not wounding me)! I would even say that it was fairly easy to process those and "file them". They really are (but those from my former marriage, but simply, because I haven't had time to process them yet; they are minor though, for me; it's different when you can approach something like this after years of therapy and as an adult).

So, what I'm saying is, I don't think that that makes a difference per se. I have by far the most trouble with those around me, my family, simply not caring to the extent of complete neglect that at one point was supposed to kill me and easily could have killed me. By far more difficult to deal with. For me.

Just saying.