Structural Dissociation And 'chatter' And Subsequent Answer

[Tinyflame]

My question is, are any of you able to tap into a 'knowing voice' or a 'knowing something' that lets you know with clarity and certainty what triggered a reaction? How do these answers come to you?

Yes definitely @shimmerz , but I don't know to call it a 'voice' exactly, yet it is a knowing-thought & 'directive', kind of?

How do I explain? There's the 'aha'-moments like @BlueOrange said. But there are rare times when I 'hear' (yet not 'hear', exactly, yet I do) like an intuitive thought but it's phrased 'to' me, not 'from' me, or with a hopefulness or courage or 'wisdom' or what-have-you not characteristic of me.

It's not specifically related to triggers, though it could be, & not something I can call upon but just comes to me, rare times but for a long time (maybe for 20+ years).

Come to think of it, it's always positive, or not quite all within my understanding, but never negative. Like the latest one was 'choose counter-intuitively'.

 

[scout86]

I was raised to be fearful of psychiatrists, psychologists and institutions.

The kind of cute thing with my T is, he seems to be concerned not because I'm "hearing voices" but because he's worried I might, someday, use that expression around the "wrong" person. At one point, when he was relocating and it looked like I might seek out someone else to work with, he gave me a fairly serious talk about "being careful what I say to people in his line of work." LOL So, I think he agrees with you!

 

[Chava]

Yes definitely @shimmerz , but I don't know to call it a 'voice' exactly, yet it is a knowing-thought & 'directive', kind of?

It sounds like what some people call our inner witness, "witness consciousness", or just awareness. It's a good thing...it's what helps us not be swamped and trapped in the trauma experience.

@shimmerz , it sounds like a helpful voice. Do you feel it as another "part"? It probably is, but a helpful part that can stand outside the trauma experience and help you understand the present, and also integrate what is happening. I think of this as what I learn in therapy. That you have a flash of a voice, is maybe just how that witness part of you is represented...it "speaks" in whatever way will grab the attention of your present part, or all of your parts, so you can create a coherent understanding of the experience. Something like that ????

Come to think of it, it's always positive, or not quite all within my understanding, but never negative. Like the latest one was 'choose counter-intuitively'.

Mine too. "Soul" doesn't seem right, but it's like my higher consciousness. It's outside the trauma, and yet not dissociated (if that makes sense). There used to just be a critical and damning witness/voice (that probably wasn't the same thing, but rather over-rode the more compassionate witness part). But now it's more like an inner parent, or just higher self, that can actually have some compassion for myself.

This is maybe way off the topic. But I do feel it as the part of myself that can pull me back on the rails. I needed that this morning and that part actually.

 

[shimmerz]

he gave me a fairly serious talk about "being careful what I say to people in his line of work."

My T told me this years ago as well. I have finally taken him seriously during this move back to Canada. I am and will be careful what I say about me. I was WAY too open (although it is hard not to be when one's reactions were like mine back in the day) about what was happening with me. People don't get it.

I think this is a little more like what I was trying to say

but I don't know to call it a 'voice' exactly, yet it is a knowing-thought & 'directive', kind of?

I said a 'voice', but it is not an external voice from the cosmos that is speaking to me..... it is instead a sudden 'ah-ha' as @BlueOrange mentions. The 'verbage' is clear.... and it does come to me in words ..... and it is a particular type of thought that says 'pay attention because this is important'. It is so hard to describe it in words.

 

[shimmerz]

Do you feel it as another "part"?

Yes, I think it is. Very similar to what @Ms Spock spoke about in another thread about an inner helper (????). Not sure if it was called that but definitely a guide that is incredibly clear and helpful. If I were to describe the part I would say she is the 'knower' of how to wade my way back to health. She knows what my triggers are and when the thoughts come to me it seems like those thoughts were in the reptilian brain and are coming up to consciousness. I would almost call her my 'integrator'.

Jeez, it is so hard to find the words for this stuff. I know you guys will understand better than anyone, but I really don't know if I am being clear enough. I was just trying to see, through this posting, if any of you ever had experienced something like this.

I really want to thank you all. I know it may have been a struggle to respond. I am very appreciative of your efforts.

ETA:

This is really well put. Thank you @Chava

That you have a flash of a voice, is maybe just how that witness part of you is represented...it "speaks" in whatever way will grab the attention of your present part, or all of your parts, so you can create a coherent understanding of the experience. Something like that ????

This is very much how it feels. A 'flash' but a helpful and knowing flash.

 

[Chava]

If I were to describe the part I would say she is the 'knower' of how to wade my way back to health.

Yes, I have this. I don't have words/labels for parts of myself, but I probably connect most to the concept of a witness consciousness...or that part of my self. Yes, very helpful. I feel like for years it was totally smothered or "offline". Nothing but sheer hatred "voices" (now that I think of it I used to hear more damning voices, like just "I hate you" or "f*ck you"....still do sometimes, but the helper part is less of a voice and more oriented towards noticing things/triggers and responding in helpful ways...it sees the trauma experience stuff more clearly, as it is sort of outside of it and able to observe.

It "speaks" mostly in noticing and responding. But it helps the trapped part also find language...like this morning I felt sick, pukey. I also felt a little trapped. It helped to notice these feelings but also notice they were connected to some trauma stuff. So the helper part took steps to help me not feel so sick. Didn't deny the sick feelings at all, actually helped notice and define them, then respond. So it's weird how it actually has words and helps describe the trauma, but for the purpose of seeing my trigger stuff for what it is and responding to the current states in ways that help me move out (this morning needed to call therapist briefly, take a shower, take some meds, rest a little more, move a bit...sick feeling gone)

 

[shimmerz]

it sees the trauma experience stuff more clearly, as it is sort of outside of it and able to observe.

Yes! ^^^^^ This! Like this part wasn't involved so can see solutions to things that I normally can't see.

Back in the day when I was going catatonic, I would sleep sometimes for days...... and defrag.... my brain sorted and reorganized my life based on new information (hard to explain). At the end of the catatonic state I would alight like nothing ever happened and this 'knowing' would direct me as to what had gone on. For instance I would drop because I saw a particular paint colour (yep, paint colour) ..... things would rearrange in my head and when I awoke.... within moments it would 'tell me' what had triggered the event (that was the colour of the spare room at the house).

Just a flash.... a quick statement.... loud, clear..... and there is an emotional tone to it. One of decisiveness. I just knew (and know) to trust it. This part knows WTF it is talking about somehow.

 

[Chava]

Very good to have that part! (I respond intensely to colors sometimes too, btw...I can also use them to pull me somewhere safer...not sure where that came from).

Did you have times when this "voice" wasn't there? Like I know when I was most self-destructive, self-hating, and also in and out of anorexia treatment and alcohol rehab, this part was non-existent, or buried. I think it's a big reason why I needed a good therapist...to uncover this inner part that could help me. I think it was always there...probably it just didn't feel "valid" so I erased it for years or never let it develop into something useful until more recently.

 

[Digz]

My 'knowing voice' can sometimes be really hard for me to find, depending on how far gone I am, but I do have a sort of knowing voice, I guess.
For me, I find that my knowing voice will generally come out more easily when I am writing. For some reason I'll change states more easily when I write and if I start writing and there's an issue, usually, that 'knowing voice' will begin writing about it. It's usually the only way I can get to know what the trigger is and what's going on. Although, I'm getting better at recognising for myself now after 6 years training! lol
My other knowing voice is my husband. He tends to know I've been triggered and by what quicker than I do. He often laughs that he knows me, better than I know me. Too true. Some parts of me are very foreign at times!

 

[shimmerz]

Did you have times when this "voice" wasn't there?

I am not really certain. I didn't know I had been traumatized at all for the first 45 years of my life. I do recall when this most recent trauma happened I had, what I called at the time, 'a creepy calm' voice telling me how to protect myself. I remember wondering during this stage how I knew what I knew about defending myself to stay alive. It seemed odd to me as I didn't feel I had any frame of reference for the situation but I really seemed to know how to play 'mouse' in the 'cat and mouse' game somehow. I am thinking perhaps that this was that voice..... I just hadn't been attuned to it. Didn't know how to utilize it properly.

So it wasn't just about healing.... it knew how to keep me safe too.

 

[shimmerz]

probably it just didn't feel "valid" so I erased it for years or never let it develop into something useful until more recently.

I think this makes a really great case for trying to bust out the shame thing. You may be right. If I am reading this properly, it may well be that the critic drowns out the helpful voice.

 

[Sideways]

I think this might sound invalidating, which isn't the intention because I think our "internal dialogue" (heads up: seems to be a therspist-friendly term for it!) often keeps us safe...and human!

But I've done a lot of group-based therapy with people with mixed mental illnesses and I think that a lot if people, not just ptsd-ers, would relate to a lot of this conversation. I think it's pretty normal, and more to the point, pretty healthy.

Every now and again I like to check myself and ask, "is this part of my illness, or is this just the human condition?" I find that can be reassuring and make me feel less 'freak of the week'.