News Another Shooting In The Us

[The Albatross]

And yes guns repulse me because they KILL people FULL STOP.

Bull spit. PEOPLE kill people. Full on stop. Always have, always will. No matter how many laws are passed to keep weapons of choice out of the hands of it's population. Said my piece... and I'm quite finished with it.

 

[Queen Boudica]

Bull spit. PEOPLE kill people. Full on stop. Always have, always will. No matter how many laws are passed to keep weapons of choice out of the hands of it's population. Said my piece... and I'm quite finished with it.

And guns make it a lot easier

 

[Philippa]

I was going to point that out, but you beat me to it Albatross. The gun may deliver the bullet, but it's the intent of the person to do harm to another that kills them.

If they are used just for hunting then it's not a problem, but when unstable people who don't know how to feel powerful any other way get hold of a gun, then it's got trouble written all over it. There are a lot of really unstable people out there, not just in america I know, but america is where they can be easily bought. I heard you can buy bullets at K-mart for goodness sake.

 

[Loner]

1 I also acknowledge that I was speaking of society as a whole when I said people are being dumbed down...so that wasn't just aimed at you, though I may not have made that clear. I think people EVERYWHERE are becoming dumbed down by all the influences that are bombarding us all on a daily basis.



2 I see what you are saying, and yes, I cannot know what life in America is like as I've only visited there briefly. I do communicate with friends from america fairly often though, and they have told me some pretty messed up stories to do with personal experiences with the health care system over there.





3 In the country here, people own guns, but city folk and country folk tend to view each other with an air of the strangeness.


4 Whilst I did not have the same environment growing up...I was coddled in a "safe" town, where we could leave our doors wide open all day without the threat of strangers just walking in and robbing us or raping us. The whole concept of walking around with a gun in my holster is frankly so alien to me...but I get that it's just normal for you guys.


5 When I was a child, this was not so prevalent. There was McDonalds sure...but now we have so many of these fast food places, and they are everywhere. We are heavily influenced by American culture, and it's killing our kids. It's killing your kids too. People who are living low income lives, with mouths to feed can't afford whole foods so they buy fast food every day for their kids...breakfast, lunch and dinner. I've watched documentaries about it...and had this confirmed by other highly intelligent american friends I keep in regular contact with. Are they all lying
?

I've number the points of your post that I want to respond to.

1 Maybe peopel are just dumb? Maybe there have always been dumb people?

2 Ive heard horror stories about the health care in Canada too, like having to wait a year for an ACL surgery. No system is perfect.

3 If people look for ways in which they are the same they will find them, if people look for ways in which they are different, they will find them. If non guns owners look at gun owners through the lens of 'those nuts...' that viewpoint will be reinforced. Its basically a bigot's mindset, although we are all guilty of it to some degree.

4. Your town wasnt safe, it just had the illusion of being safe. Perhaps far safer than many places, but it wasnt safe because no where is safe. I can almost guarantee you that there were people in that town completely capable and even will to violently rape others and to inflict hard merely for enjoyment's sake.

5. Fast food isnt actually cheap. It seems so a meal at a time but it isn't. I had a roomate a while ago who ate out 3 meals out of every day. He came home and found me cooking chili, and commented how good it smelled so I offered him a bowl, as he was eating he remarked he would love to eat like this all the time but he just couldnt afford it. I explained to him that if you chose your ingredients right, and took the time to cook for yourself, you could have healthy, filling, tasty meals, often for about 1/3 of the price of fast food. A couple lbs of ground beef, some italian sausage, mushrooms onions garlic, tomato sauce, pasta noodles. This adds up to maybe $20 in an amount that can feed an entire family for two meals, and is really easy to make. The same money would feed them once at mcdonalds. The other interesting thing is that roommate made better money than I did, but smoked cigarettes, drank every night almost, smoked a lot of pot, and went out to movies and such, then complained about never having money. Also, at least here, I really can't understand why anyone would EVER eat mcdonalds. There are 'decent' fast food places that are in the same cost braket. Five Guys is somewhat healthy, then there are mexican chain places that actually have some nutritional value.

 

[Loner]

I learn these things to see all sides and try to understand cultural issues... I would expect you to possible know the above basics before shooting off about gun laws when referring to Australia. The country has walked the path America have... except we stopped it as a nation because of the issues.

Thats not exactly true, Aus never had the level of gun ownership America has, it was far lower when you guys decided to get rid of them, and didn't you already require registration?

 

[The Albatross]

Lizio I care more about my freedoms and rights, including the right to bear arms against my own government and revolt if they every try to become a monarchy or dictatorship... than I do about whether it's too easy for a damn criminal to commit a crime.

 

[Loner]

And yes guns repulse me because they KILL people FULL STOP. Not because they are icky as you so condescendingly write.

So cars cigarettes fast food and all the plastic stuff that gives you cancer also repulses you? Oh but those have a 'legitimate' purpose, oh but so do guns, oh but you don't 'approve' of guns legitimate purposes because they repulse you, and so on and so on....

You know what kills people? Life. Life kills everyone. Its a terminal condition.

 

[Philippa]

I've number the points of your post that I want to respond to.

1 Maybe peopel are just dumb? Maybe there have always been dumb people?

Oh that's definitely a factor. I just think we are devolving even more as a species. We seem to be getting dumber every day.

2 Ive heard horror stories about the health care in Canada too, like having to wait a year for an ACL surgery. No system is perfect.

I've heard plenty in my own country. A woman in my class had the wrong ovary removed two months ago! I've heard it happened to an 85 year old woman too, except they took the wrong hip out to be replaced. It happens all the time. Plenty of successes though as well. Doctors are human...but in general, we don't have to wait nearly a whole day to be attended to, even if we are dying or in extreme pain.

4. Your town wasnt safe, it just had the illusion of being safe. Perhaps far safer than many places, but it wasnt safe because no where is safe. I can almost guarantee you that there were people in that town completely capable and even will to violently rape others and to inflict hard merely for enjoyment's sake.

Did you notice the inverted commas I put around the word safe when I made that statement? I know all too well that nowhere is safe. I'm a survivor of sexual assault. Most parents are under the illusion that it was a safe place to raise kids. Back then it was relatively safe, and I made it through to 18 with the doors unlocked most days without anyone ever walking in and taking something, or getting raped. Maybe we were just lucky?

5. Fast food isnt actually cheap. It seems so a meal at a time but it isn't. I had a roomate a while ago who ate out 3 meals out of every day. He came home and found me cooking chili, and commented how good it smelled so I offered him a bowl, as he was eating he remarked he would love to eat like this all the time but he just couldnt afford it. I explained to him that if you chose your ingredients right, and took the time to cook for yourself, you could have healthy, filling, tasty meals, often for about 1/3 of the price of fast food. A couple lbs of ground beef, some italian sausage, mushrooms onions garlic, tomato sauce, pasta noodles. This adds up to maybe $20 in an amount that can feed an entire family for two meals, and is really easy to make. The same money would feed them once at mcdonalds. The other interesting thing is that roommate made better money than I did, but smoked cigarettes, drank every night almost, smoked a lot of pot, and went out to movies and such, then complained about never having money. Also, at least here, I really can't understand why anyone would EVER eat mcdonalds. There are 'decent' fast food places that are in the same cost braket. Five Guys is somewhat healthy, then there are mexican chain places that actually have some nutritional value.

I've tried to say the same thing to my american friends. I've been a student before, on poor street, and still managed to eat really nutritious food, just by buying things like polenta, and being a bit creative, rather than 2 minute noodles. I've somehow managed to stay pretty healthy and eat well for the last 15 years, and I have not been rich by any stretch.

It's a matter of understanding what foods are actually good and what are full of crap, and then finding the ones that are cheap, and they are out there. So yeah, I agree with you there.[/quote]

 

[Queen Boudica]

You know what kills people? Life. Life kills everyone. Its a terminal condition.

Fantastic argument. Great debating skills.

 

[Philippa]

Well, we are all dying at every moment, so he's not wrong. I'm not sure it holds much water in the gun debate though? The fact that we are all dying does not mean we should help the process along.

 

[Loner]

Fantastic argument. Great debating skills.

Slightly better than saying 'great debating skills' with sarcasm right? It actually is a far more profound point than you probably realize as accepting the world is an unsafe imperfect and dangerous place is essential to being at peace with the fact that crazy people do crazy things.

Fact is you oversimplify things by saying guns kill people so they are bad. Lots of things kill people and still have some valuable purpose, as do guns.


Phillipa, I didn't notice the quotes around safe. I realized when I said that, that given the site we are on, it was pretty likely you were all to aware of that fact. I'm sorry. I wish every victim of violent rape had had a gun and the willingness to use it.

 

[Philippa]

I just wish I didn't get in the car with him in the first place...but wishing it doesn't make it happen. Thanks for the sentiment though.