Can You Pray?

[Tessa]

I can empathise. I think it is the terrible numbness of trauma which cancels out feelings. I have struggled for years with this and having psychologists who don't believe in God has made it harder.

Footprints would be true for many of us. Perhaps we have given many times to others and just now,we need to be carried ourselves.

Hugs
Tessa

 

[anni]

Seedling,

I didn't pray either, for a long time but maybe it was different-I think I was scared he wouldn't hear me 'again'. Like where the hell was he when I needed him? Maybe I was sulking or maybe, like Tessa said, it was the emotional numbness. I'm with you, though, in that I MISSED it. I did a fair amount of yelling at God, but one can't quite call that praying.

It's been a lovely thread, hasn't it? I think I'll always have been the kid who grew up in the church-gain comfort from so much even though I do not go anymore. The faith stayed.I don't know what I'd have done without it, actually, or at least am scared to think of where I'd be without it. I'm very lucky- my T was a Lutheran minister first, so knows where my head is mostly-what a find!

Pretty sure prayers don't have to have words. Feeling anything, I think, deeply, is a prayer when there's faith. Gratitude-well who are we gratefull to, if not to God? I think it's heard. Love for the children- I'll bet that's heard, too, and acknowledged. Songs can be pure prayer, I think, as can stopping to help a stranger in trouble. I'm not sure God cares much for form and structure, or even words if we have intent and feeling, but that might just be some wierd personal perspective, who know? It feels like he's there, in those moments. Your groan is all emotion, from the heart in pain so he hears you. I'm sure your words will come back so you feel something when you pray formerly again, it's just that I'd have to think you're doing it all the time anyway, without words or maybe even knowing you're doing it.

 

[Deleted member 6617]

This is really an awesome thread Seedling. Guess I couldn't help throw my little bit of thought into it.

Prayer for me is conversations with God. It is like talking to my deepest confidant throughout the day. It is not only asking for help for myself or others, it is thanking and recognizing when it is there. It is praising for the things throughout the day that touch my soul. It could be the beauty of the world around me, or the hug of a friend, or a strangers random greeting of good wishes, anything big or small. I have even on several occasions thanked him for putting someone going 5 miles UNDER the speed limit in front of me, know it was saving me from a speeding ticket. I believe in a God who is all around me and with me always. I don't always FEEL His presence, but by faith I know He is always present. So I talk to Him, I cry to Him, I yell at/to Him, I groan to Him, I confide in Him, I laugh, I beg, I plead, I praise, I thank....well, you get the idea.

Hope this made some sort of sense.

PH

 

[LSNP]

I quit going to church. I felt like JOB, though not as strong. I felt like God abandoned me....

Pray? Used to all the time.

I am just mostly angry now.

 

[seedling]

Thanks to everyone that gave their perspective on this. It affects us all so differently but seems to hit the same spots.

For me, the conversation with God (thanks Pottershand) is not possible right now. I feel that God is there, I think that he cares and is helping me but I'm not able to be connected on this end. It surely is the strangest thing. I don't even feel angry with him. (ha ha, just wait:) ).

I read an article about a very independent older man that learned to say "why not me" instead of "why me" when he got Parkinsons and had to ask for help all the time. He felt he was learning things he never had before even though he had a terrible illness.

I feel grateful for being fortunate to have a wonderful husband, good family, and helpful caring friends to help me right now. I also have health insurance (though somewhat limited) that can pay for therapy and I found a great T (who's also Lutheran like I am).

To make up for the lack I feel in not being able to feel connected to God, I'm now using all my little impulses as my prayers, or my groans etc.. Every time I feel like "this would have been a time I would have prayed" I think of just one word like "help", or "thanks" and that's it. I does supply some of the same comfort and I feel less desperate about missing it. It keeps me from always throwing myself against that wall and experiencing the disappointment. It's the lack of the feeling of the "energy" of the connection to the Universe.

It's great to be on here and figure things out. I'm sure this has been worth at least one therapy session and I have so much other crap going on, this is not on the high priority list there. :)

Aaahh Anni, singing is one of the things that still can fill my soul right up - I can feel that. Also listening to music, any kind. What a gift.

LSNP - my pastor did mention Job to me when this all started. I'm not sure how strong Job felt when he was going through it, as he was a human being it was probably easier in retrospect.

 

[seedling]

Don't know if anyone will get the wrong idea about what I meant above about the guy with Parkinsons but I will elaborate what I got out of his attitude.

I didn't mean that we can all just look on the bright side and everything will be grand. What I got from his situation is that I'm part of the human race, this physical existence etc.. and what would exempt me from suffering? What lets me off the hook? So: why not me? As so many others suffer untold losses, griefs etc, why not this one for me. It seems to be an integral part of living in this world and I have been blessed with support to endure it even.

 

[anni]

I don't know about anybody else but I got pretty tired of hearing about poor Job. Hearing someone else's awful story doesn't help, and he's been gone for a really long time, too. I have to say thank GOD my father didn't mention him. though, which I might have expected given the fact that he was a minister. My minister at the time did keep talking about suffering, and how it was good for one's soul in the end, Sigh. My T made me feel a lot better about that whole thing because he knew my minister and said he married his hair shirt, as it were. At any rate, I just do not believe suffering is part of God's plan for any of us, and does one thing to further the progression of one's soul.

I hope you do get your connection back, seedling. Have you ever tried the 'old' prayers, like we all knew as children, or things from the old liturgies? Just was thinking perhaps going back to a time when that connection was automatic would perhaps spark something for you.

 

[seedling]

Maybe I'd be able to sing one of the old ones, they keep changing them though. Have to look in the old books. Actually singing some of the liturgy might be a good idea.

Still have been practicing my one word/partial thought praying. Sending up what I can. Like the mute person looking skyward. If no sound comes out at least I open my mouth :). I think God knows what I mean.

I never got the Job thing much. Maybe it does more for those not suffering so much. No, I don't think suffering is part of the plan for betterment. Unless it's to better others to not let it happen.

Reminds me of this. My dad gave me a book by a Zen student called "To Shine One Corner". It's little short stories and sketches about experiences with the Zen master. In one, the student is crying and asking him why there is so much suffering in the world. He looks at her, smiles, and says "No reason." This comes to my mind every now and then.

 

[Tinyflame]

I could be really wrong but I think the whole point of Job was simply to try to show that he had enough trust to ultimately not blame/ give up on God entirely because of (their) relationship- he kept asking questions that didn't have answers because he didn't see God's relationship to him as that way.

Like if you loved your spouse and believed they loved you too, and they did something you didn't understand but hadn't heard their explanation yet, but in the meantime you still believed it must be be for some 'good' reason that you didn't understand or know of yet (because you continued to believe your spouse loved you/ you chose to trust in that and them), despite what seems like all potential evidence to the contrary.

 

[seedling]

Yes Junebug, I totally agree with you on that one and I like that part of Job's story. He just kept his faith.

My pastor did use the side of it that dealt with losing everything and then gaining it back. I could appreciate this lesson in it too - that losses that are catastrophic may be temporary or a path to something else. I think the faith against all the evidence is a more powerful lesson for me right now and I'm not sure if most people think about this one when they think about Job.

I like the way you put it with the spouses :)

 

[anni]

That was awfully good, Junebug. My problem has alway been growing up in the church, being so familiar with these stories and people you'd start wondering about THEM, themselves, outside of whatever the story might be. Job bothered me even as a child, since I just couldn't understand all that darn patience. It didn't make sense! It's the intent, of course, and think you put the whole thing to bed beautifully.

I was a dreadful minister's kid. Dad tells me on a regular basis I still am.

 

[Tinyflame]

Dear anni, lol- you are so sweet, don't you know that's the Best Kind? :)

-You have the heart of an angel- I wouldn't worry about it.
:)