Can't Take Other Sufferers Seriously?

[Monuco]

Here's the thing, i don't have any opinion on people who work or not. I've been somebody who couldn't work and now I am somebody who can work. I've been somebody who has tried to have relationships, and now I am somebody who avoids any social contact at all.

I've experienced childhood sexual abuse and emotional neglect, and I've experienced teenage rape and adult trauma of different types.

Some people experience symptoms that effect their ability to work. Some people experience symptoms that effect their ability to maintain social contact. Either way, it effects peoples lives.

There is no explanation or measurement that is going to bring any more understanding. That's just not a helpful way for you or for me, or for anyone.

 

[Edije]

I only read the first page and a half.

On the outside I probably look like I'm 'high functioning'' too. I hold down a health professional job where I'm on call twenty four hours a day seven days a week. I can be called out and have to deal with potentially life threatening emergencies at any day (though thankfly are rare in my line of work). I'm sure toy colleagues and clients I look like I have it totally 'together'.

But the real truth is - ALL I can do is work. It is my coping thing. When I'm not at work I'm in my pajama's. in front of the tv or computer. I have no social life, I rarely leave my house unless its for work. I have no close friends or family. I am in relapse from an eating disorder - daily I starve myself, binge on large amounts of junk food and stuck my fingers repeatedly down my throat to vomit up everything I eat. Multiple times a day, every day.

Doing that and working enables me to AVOID my PTSD. I'm too terrified to deal with the painful memories head on - so I work and binge and so nothing to avoid any triggers.

I have periods of severe depression and feeling suicidal. I won't be hospitalised though BECASUE even the psych system see me as 'too high functioning' - doesn't matter how awful I feel or how severe the depression or desire to end my life - they see my ability to go to work and don't take me seriously.

Just like those in my work environment - what you see of people on here through their posts is only ever a fraction of who they are. Please don't judge them for being able to work.

As others said - IT'S NOT A COMPETETION - all of us are on here BECASUE we suffer and struggle or have done.

For that fact alone we should SUPPORT each other instead of be 'jealous' if some manage their symptoms or have achievements.

 

[Ehare]

Then perhaps there can be a PTSD forum where people simply have PTSD and have a common aim to get better. Not where people are comparing how bad or good trauma or symptoms of PTSD are. And certainly not where people join together to divide people into those who can be taken seriously and those who can't

Well said.

I would appreciate it if you could see it from my side

The point is that there was no consideration shown to how others would feel by the original post. And it seems you are saying that people have no right to respond to it with their own feelings.

Its fine to explore ones issues but it is kind to show consideration at the same time and take ownership of them. If we want others to respond in a way that discusses the issue neutrally then it is wise to frame the issue neutrally and with consideration right from the start. Noone responded in a harsh or abusive way regardless of the tone of the first post.

Everyone has a right to their own feelings and one of those rights is a right to a response where something is said that is judgemental.

 

[Ehare]

I AM repeatedly trying to apologise for thinking in a way that obviously upsets you and to resolve the bitterness.

I just read a little more of what you wrote.

This is just an observation here and one I mean kindly. Please ignore if it isn't useful. I think you have a good heart. It seems to me that you have a lot of insight and understanding. Then it almost seems that others having their emotions or reactions feels like an invalidation of yours. In other words you start off from this self aware place but then someone else stating how they feel and they react feels like a threat or invalidation of yours to you even when it isn't being said in that way.

I find that if I discuss my less than ideal feelings or reactions as a concept rather than wording it in a way aimed at others then it takes -the whole too-ing and fro-ing away from the conversation.

It then allows you to process and work through your thoughts and reactions without it getting sidetracked.

The key is whether someone has really done something that we think they have done. Mindreading and projection are the enemies.

Example: The original poster did make a judgmental statement about sufferers. Sufferers in general are therefore responding to something factual.

On the other hand if we are responding to something that we FEEL or THINK others are doing it is totally different. It is unfair if we falsely put actions or intentions on others when they are not true and are about us not them.

Yes, a lot of us do this a lot or a little. We need to be able to speak about and find a way through it. But we need to accept that it is about us. If we discuss it in a way where we are taking ownership then others won't resent it in the same way.

Reacting to and feeling things about something someone has done or thought is totally different to reacting to and feeling things about something that the person has not done or thought.

Its Ok to discuss the latter but we need to own it and show consideration of others natural responses to it.

I wish I could explain it better but am hoping it is understandable. Feel free to ignore.

 

[Jikec]

Thank you. I did recognise this in myself many, many posts back and tried to back off of it all but found myself in a position of defensiveness almost immediately afterwards. Now again I recognise is it again and feel foolish. Interestingly I rarely recognise that I feel anything, let alone that I recognise what it is that I feel, even if it is retrospectively so that's something I can go away and attempt to learn from. Also I would like to point out I only ever said I felt or I thought all my views are purely my own opinions whether misguided or not.

I do still feel that the OP was misunderstood in some aspects. I also think that all people make judgements of others both positive and negative, although some more than others and some do it maliciously, I personally don't think that's what the OP meant.

But I'm done, I'm out, I'm exhausted - I'm putting my hands up and walking away because I don't want to argue or fight any more. I don't want to and never did want to upset anyone and every time I did I took it badly and I should have walked away earlier from it. I don't know why I felt so compelled to come back and try and make myself heard more clearly after each time I perceived I was thoroughly if not entirely misunderstood and why the hell I kept it up knowing full well that this and other real life problems were upsetting me so much I needed to consider hospitalisation because of my state of mind. I'm sorry if I've upset anyone or caused anyone else such distress.

 

[Ehare]

The ones where people post about being super high functioning (bragging?) and in the same (virtual) breath complain about life..... It just makes me question how these super high functioning people can have PTSD when they are so unaffected. I just walk away. I hate being judged.

The way I see it you saw the OP as saying that he made these judgements because he had people in his real life that had judged his symptoms.

I agree and saw that too but the quoted statement stands and there is no explaining that away.

I think where it went wrong for you is that you could not accept that those answering had a right to be offended and then it seems you somehow ended up seeing others offended feelings as judgement of your life. It may well be that those projections were kicking in all the time for you.

Personally I have never judged anyone who was not working as not trying hard enough or anything else. I have also never assumed that those who are working don't really have PTSD. Other than myself of course. Whatever I do I find a way to judge.

I think if you had acknowledged that right of those answering to have their feelings and continued to discuss your own feelings in the way you started then you wouldn't have ended up going around and around and I am guessing getting very upset by all this.

If this is a pattern with interactions with others it might be really helpful reading through the thread again when you feel better and then discussing it with your t.

I think all of us have probably been horribly judged in real life by various people because of our symptoms and it is horrible.

You are not a bad person for judging others and you are not a bad person for having PTSD symptoms. Its all just about taking ownership and working through it.

 

[Ida]

Thirdly it is judgement of Trauma. CBT is not recommended for those who have complex trauma as it is too abrasive and frequently retraumatising. Proved to me in real terms rather than statistics for the second time in my life by this.

There is a heated discussion going on in here, which I don't wish to be a part of. But I wanted to comment on this.

I have complex PTSD(not a legal diagnose, I know) from severe and complex traumas throughout all of my childhood and then repeatedly in my adulthood. And CBT is helping me immensely! It IS very, very hard, but it's helping. I found other kinds of therapy only scratching the surface OR re-traumatizing me without helping me.

I think it's more about finding the right therapist. Mine do adjust the sails a lot depending on how much I'm coping with at the moment.

 

[Ehare]

I agree. I think it is again a sign of not letting others have their own experiences. Many people with complex trauma find CBT helpful. Personally I didn't find it that helpful but dismissing something that helps many (and a lot of those have both dissociative disorders and complex trauma) is not something any of us should do. It is exactly a representation of the type of cognitive distortions that CBT helps.

 

[Ofu]

At first I was a bit defensive wondering if I may be one of those people you speak of, as I am high functioning ...now. I worked damn hard to get there though. And then I wondered whether, as someone else said, you just perceived these people as 'bragging' about it, and perceived the tone to be condescending when it may have been just generally sharing where they are at, and you felt bad because you weren't there yet? That's totally understandable. It would be a hard thing for someone struggling to read about someone else being in a really good place.

I've wondered if lots of people feel that way about me, as I don't seem to get much in the way of feedback from most people here any more. Maybe they feel they cannot relate to me any more, or it's as you say, they perceive me to be bragging or worse, bullshitting or in denial about being better. I don't think I am in reality...I just thought that I have the right to also share where I'm at and hopefully have some people be happy for me, without getting too jealous. Maybe that's too much to hope for though?

 

[Zekudis]

No, Ofu, DON'T stop sharing about this! (I'm not the thread starter, but I really need the hope I get from people like you.)

 

[Aril]

Thanks Zekudis. I think that is why I still come back...to give you that hope because things do get better and you WILL be able to be more functional at some point.
Don't give up.

 

[Kija]

I am the OP, and just so there's no confusion, every time I have posted, I have stated "I am the OP" or something along those lines. I saw this post pop back up to the top and completely forgot that I had written it.

My feelings are still very much the same, although I am in a much better place at this time. I guess I wasn't very good at articulating myself when I started this thread, but it is what it is. It is hard for someone like me who has hit the rock bottom of rock bottoms (read, I was almost dead, and for all intents and purposes, I SHOULD be dead) to read about people who have a lot more in life and then give the woe is me line. I'm not saying it is necessarily HERE, but that is how I feel and no, I am not going to apologize for it. I mean at this point I can only WISH that I could work, yet I know others complain about how shitty their lives are even though they are able to hold down jobs, relationships, families, the whole shebang. So I guess what I am saying is that it is HARD for me to give sympathy to those who don't realize that they have positives in their lives and can't see that its not all bad. WHEW, 3 pages later and I finally was able to say what I really mean.... That even though things may be shitty, you've still got positives in your life so don't give me this song and dance about how your life is so tough when I literally have nothing. Its sort of like expecting the homeless person to be able to empathize with the rich family up on the hill that won't be able to go on their yearly vacation to Tahiti. Yes, flame me if you will, say I am projecting, or whatever, and that I don't want to change, but this is you projecting on me. I am aware of what I am feeling, I was brave enough to post it (albeit anonymously, but then again, even the regular forums are anonymous in that nobody knows anyone), and get judged for being judgmental when the truth is that judgment is everywhere. I never said that I am happy with things being like this, or that I don't want things to change, but people interject their own meaning into my words and twist what I say. Rather than ask for clarification, assumptions are made and we all know what happens when you assume... (I'm sure the assume thing will be turned around on me, so please, no need, I know what you're going to say...) Flame me if you will for not being able to empathize, but it is what it is and that's just how I am.

So please, go tell that homeless man that he is defective for not empathizing with the rich people who can't go on vacay this year.