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Compulsive Lying

  • Post starter Post starter Cizumu
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OP you mention difficulty connecting to common concepts & auditory issues quite a bit -

Is there anything that helps you accomodate in communication, in regards to auditory issues?

Sensory overload & auditory processing hardships are quite difficult spots to be in and I can see how not being able to understand, much less process, information directed toward you can easily get on a person's nerves and make for a wish to toss all the input out, just to reduce the overwhelm and not be in distress because of this.

So I'm wondering whether or not is your relating to society style related to reduction of stress needs, basically. Asking as I don't want to assume, just considering it a possibility, the bone of the issue not being about empathy & relating whatsoever but about a very deep distress because of sensory overwhelm.
 
the bone of the issue not being about empathy & relating whatsoever but about a very deep distress because of sensory overwhelm.

I'm not the OP but I'm wondering how this connects...or how you are thinking it connects. I can see maybe a shut down due to it and then just not caring. But what about lying and manipulating out of boredoem? Or, are you thinking the OP may feel bored but actually is overwhelmed?

I'm sorry for the questions as I am very curious and intrested. I'm the one that has been insiting that the bone of this is empathy so just very intrested.
 
Or, are you thinking the OP may feel bored but actually is overwhelmed?

Part of it. What I'm thinking is the, to hearing & well processing hearing population, simple input can be too much for a brain that just doesn't process that all too well, leading to the need to disengage (think of, parallel, stress cup already too full and 'little things' being huge addition because language & its social meanings is damned complicated and not understanding for one gestures that typically go with some languages as just nonverbal components of the language can be easily interpreted as threatening, ditto facial expressions if you just see the person looking 'angry' and don't know what they're saying is just stressing something non-threatening, and such)

& That 'boredom' may be a convenient way to describe just about any state of 'I tuned out and couldn't get myself to be interested in anything'.

The lying and manipulation may not have that much with personality per se. Coping styles aren't necessarily a personality trait. I asked what I asked because I'm thinking of what is it that's being coped with.
 
That 'boredom' may be a convenient way to describe just about any state of 'I tuned out and couldn't get myself to be interested in anything'.
Given what you've said about your APD, I'm really inclined to think this is the case.

I wonder what would happen if you entered a conversation with a truth instead of a lie. So, you get 'bored', and decide to lay something on the conversation - but you tell a truth. If you imagine doing that, what feelings/concerns/thoughts come up?
 
Given what you've said about your APD, I'm really inclined to think this is the case.

I wonder what would happen if...

I have entered conversations with a truth, but usually it's a truth so bizarre, people think it's a lie. An example would be, "I remember my first time I fell off a tree. 50 ft barren old tree. Climbed to the top to find a bird's nest, the top was thinner than my wrists. It was a windy day and I broke through so many branches, my back looked like it got welts for a whip." or sometimes I'll keep it very simple such as, "Nah not a big fan of coffee. Never liked the taste, but I'd love to smell it -- that I enjoy. I love the sounds and smells of making it, but the taste is just horrid."

For me, telling the truth is so short lived.. that at least with a lie I can entertain myself in my head. Conversations may be short but I'll think, "Did they really believe that?" as I'm watching their body language and how they are reacting. If what I said made them uncomfortable, upset, curious, etc. It gives me something to watch and pay attention to.
 
OP you mention difficulty connecting to common concepts & auditory issues quite a bit -

Is there anything that helps you...

I am not sure if you are familiar with APD (Auditory Processing Disorder) so I'll give a brief explanation of how I personally experience it.

Subtle noises such as sniffing, clocks ticking, breathing, scratching, etc., are noises that sound "loud" in that although they may be quiet, I can still hear them clear as day. As the ambience noise increases, especially when combined with a few or handful of loud noises, it really feels like I cannot process anything I'm hearing or reading. It sounds like someone is speaking in a foreign gibberish. Sometimes I can understand that they're saying, "Look at the red car over there by the woman." but I can't truly understand. An example could be you know japanese words. If someone were to tell you a word in japanese, based off your knowledge, you can confirm and/or agree that it is a real japanese word, but you have no idea what it means. It is sort of like that. You know it's a word, but you have no idea and sometimes it sounds like they're all.. jumbled together.

When it's even worse, i can't read. It's the same concept. I will be reading the same lines over and over, word by word, but it will not process. So I'm stuck listening to loud nonsense and people shuffling around. It's annoying and I can't do anything. Attempting to focus just makes it worse, and so I usually don't bother and listen to music. I've stopped making attempts unless I absolutely had to or wanted to. (such as trying to understand a friend or interesting material) yet it usually does not help or improve the situation other than making me even more frustrated because it feels like I'm missing out on something more.

On top of that, I also have a speech impediment. I learned the english language later in life because I was adopted and did not speak my first english words until around age 3 or so. Not only that, but I was neglected and learned most of my words from documentaries and whatever I picked up on. When I am nervous enough, I don't talk at all. I've gotten better at that, but when I was younger, people used to think I was a mute. I stutter and slur. My stuttering is more like "phrase stuttering" meaning I'll say, "What- what about- what about wee.. tr-try walking, umm, this way......or.... wherever you want t-to go, I guess.." I also tend to have inappropriate pauses and pace in my speech.

Another thing that's really annoying is that I have a hard time articulating what I want to say. I can text all of this, but I can't verbally speak the way I think or write. I don't know what it is. If given a phone or piece of paper and pen, I can write what's on my mind down on the paper, but once I have to verbally say it.. it get's excessively simplified sometimes. So much so, that even though I type and write like this all the time, if I read aloud what I just wrote, it doesn't sound like me because I'm not used to talking like that.

One more thing that is part of my speech. My friend calls them "verbal tics" but they're not really verbal tics. Basically, as I'm talking, I'll sometimes try to force a word out when my brain is still lagging behind, so it comes out as some.. noise.. and not even an identifiable word. Or sometimes when I can't think of a word, but I'm in that moment, I'll just sputter out a random expressive noise. these noises sound like gibberish, not actual... imitation noise. If that makes sense.. So I make these words "sounds" = "eff..nyeh.." I don't do these imitation sounds = "ca, ca (as if trying to say cat)" or animal/machine sounds.
 
@Cizumu, would it help you to form a comfort zone out of that, the words that are accessible & in a sound environment that's comfortable / calming you down, is it possible to make speech more comfortable first and work toward having more forms of it accessible as automatic responses?

(Not sure it's doable / not everything is retrainable or for everyone and neuroplasticity has its limits, and that's pretty okay. Just thinking how much is it possible to learn a new and add, and how much is a hard limit you simply can't go past. Apologies ahead if this is phrased offensively, I mean no disrespect, just thinking aloud.)

& As to telling the lie as it's more creative, but you can do that with truth too? Creativity and amusement aren't dependent on truths/lies, you can well be truthful in conversations, revealing as much or as little as is safe for you at the time, while entertaining yourself by everything else in your head; the other person wouldn't know that either way, if it's just 'fun' you need.

You don't need to spin people's sense of reality with things that are outright a lie.
& You have a difficulty with sounds. Imagine for some people, it's reality they struggle with. Lies, where truth is expected or a common standard, make living in a world and trusting anything at all, this much harder.
 
@Cizumu, would it help you to form a comfort zone out of that, the words that are accessible & in a sound environment t...

No you did not sound offensive at all. I will look into that :) It was suggested by the one who evaluated me, to go to speech therapy to at least try and lessen the stuttering and some other therapist(can't remember name) to help with my WM(working Memory) and understanding speech. They've even suggested hearing aids which are definitely affordable.(Sarcasm).

Some days I am just fine with staying quiet and in my mind. Again, all of this lying is not 24/7. Some days if I'm talking to a few people that I don't really know or care for, I'll say a few white lies or nothing at all. If I'm with my close friend, then I can talk for hours to her without telling a single lie.

But some days, it's like my mindset switches.. I'm not sure if you saw my other comment, but when I change my mindset a bit, I feel like my confidence level is at 100% and people are just puppets. Pull their strings in a certain way and they'll fall. I don't want to spend too much time talking or thinking about it since last time I did, my mindset actually changed and it was very hard to watch my tone for the rest of the day since I was in the in between(limbo) of going back and forth. Which is reminding me, my tone of voice, my posture, the way I talk, expressions.. they're different and my friend has noticed it. I sound a lot more confident, but not the good kind. Almost like a "narcissist" (not actual medical term. She means I'm a confident jerk towards other people sometimes and it's impulsive.)
 
Lies, where truth is expected or a common standard, make living in a world and trusting anything at all, this much harder.

Re-reading your message and this quote reminds me about how I see the world which is that, "You can't trust everyone," or very select few and this may be due to how I act towards others. When I was younger I spent a lot of time with adults as my parents didn't want me around kids(also had no friends) and so I spent a lot of time around fake adults that couldn't care less if they got together or not. They'd all gossip about the one that just left, then when the other left, they would gossip. They'd talk badly about someone.. yet, when everyone is back, they all appeared genuine. That's what started my curiosity. Wondering if these people were really good at acting, were they lying about their animosity or were they faking their appreciation for the other person. I eventually learned how to identify the differences and when someone actually despises another person, despite what they say. I saw this as a way to survive the world and know who I can trust and who I can't. Spending majority of my childhood/developmental years around these kinds of people and abusive parents, I'm sure, has definitely affected how I perceive the world to this day and impede's my ability to feel empathy for others that I don't even know or care for. (may also be due to my paranoia)

Thinking how people can easily trust a stranger, to some degree, kind of baffles me. Whether if you trust or not, a stranger.. there's no benefit other than safety. If you don't trust a stranger, you're less likely to feel some sort of connection and put yourself in a vulnerable state. But if you easily trust a stranger, that stranger might end up killing you because you let them get too close.
 
I don't want to spend too much time talking or thinking about it since last time I did, my mindset actually changed
I'm familiar with that switch / do the kind of switching quite usually, depending on the company and what we're doing at the moment, though - you can still slide in and out; find what concrete beliefs you have in both mindsets, how you view yourself, trust, truth, and other people, what makes you consider them as something else, what supports your conclusions they're playable like puppets and what goes against it, what are the first thoughts that come to mind in that mindset and out of it.

Things like that: Different, even if complex, mindset is something that can be paced down to little pieces & those pieces can be restructured into something else, and something that doesn't cause distress, to self nor others.
 
1. Yes I am still very interested in psychology and I enjoy reading about how the mind works, how it gets affected by c...

How about you tell your friends (honesty here), that you have noticed a tendency to lie as a coping mechanism and with that big TRUTH out of the way, will lift your guilt that sometimes you do feel.

As for boredom and those lies, maybe you need to find something else to do in your lifetime. Like a new hobby to occupy yourself and it will help with self-esteem issues. You may be able to lie less because you are doing something of interest and staying mentally busy with the challenge of it.

I honestly believe we all can lie to some extent, and l understand you in doing it to amuse yourself, but doing something more sensory based like martial arts, musical instrument, foreign language would force you to get out of your head and into a "living space" where lies don't carry so much significance.

The first step on your journey, tell her the truth. If there is some discomfort, that is the start of empathy. If continue on concerned with her reaction, more empathy. So don't run away, tell her.
 
Personally I am guessing your past and the people around you and how they acted is probably relevant. They turned reality and truth on its head. Like a house of crazy mirrors. What is your guess on that?

It almost sounds to me as if you decided that caring was unhelpful/weak/ ? and so you developed a lack of empathy for people. And that those around you were so untrustworthy and gameplaying that it didn't occur to you that normal interactions with people would be wise or useful to you. Or are your thoughts different? Your friend isn't gameplaying and is trustworthy so she is challenging your world view. You are connecting to her in an authentic way. Maybe?

It sounds like you got into a pattern of gameplaying where you test people and set them up to see how they react. Like a perpetual experiment. Poke this one that way and see what happens. How do you feel in relation to their reactions? If they act in a worse case way what do you feel? And if they act in a better than you expect way how do you feel? What gives you the most satisfaction? What do you expect? Also, could some of this be an indirect expression of rage? Sometimes past harm to us creates wells of rage and it can come our indirectly in our relationships with others (or for some with themselves) at times. Is there a need to see an impact and if you do see one what is your reaction to it?

Maybe the auditory issues form a backdrop and add to the sense of separateness from others. I can't see how it would cause the empathy issues but it must probably would create more sense of isolation and lack of connection to others. Is that possible or what do you think it brings up most predominantly? It definitely sounds exhausting and isolating.

Do you think there could be a tendency to avoid feeling connection as that brings with it more sense of vulnerably or investment. Nothing authentically invested sometimes means nothing potentially lost. What is the feeling behind the behaviours if you can find it.

Personally I don't think the lying needs to come from anxiety. It could come from certain unconscious beliefs or patterns of relating to people. It could come from an attempt to create an impact of others or the world. Or many other things. Including anxiety of course. What do you feel is your relationship with the emotion/state anxiety? If you look at the key basic emotions we have then which are you predominantly aware of? Joy, excitement, sadness, anger, irritation, content, emptiness etc. The other useful way of analysing these things that I have come across is to look at emotions firstly in terms of high or low energy and then secondly as negative or positive. Whether we see some as negative or positive is again often down to our created world view.

What character traits do you think you have associated with strength? Which ones do you think you have associated with weakness?


Oro
 
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