I think God's character is very misrepresented. Although I don't think I know or understand much, it's like hearing a good friend or someone you know bad mouthed, or yourself when your intentions are great, or someone try to wreak someone's marriage with whisperings, or incomplete info (and that could come from within or without 'religion', or from people with or without beliefs). Add in free-will, evil or sin, and the interconnectedness of people (& the environment), and there's lots of potential of harm (or good). But you go, woah, that person has no idea. And feel badly, simply because it's the opposite.
But one has to go by their experiences, perhaps looking farther reaching than just the aftermath. Not sure if God-or-no God anyone can escape suffering, but I have found some things to be too coincidental for coincidence. No matter what, we become who we are. In my case, I try to choose the God I know must be, based on what good I have received, often that I can't explain.
My sister says free will is the problem, why give people free will, when they choose such terrible things? But there can be no love without freedom to choose it. And the freedom to not choose it, to say I don't believe in God, or I believe in something else, or I believe in it or something, but I don't want it. I think even people don't want 'forced' love- or it's not love at all. I think anyone with or without a belief can twist things to what they believe, but it doesn't change whatever is true. Personally, I see God as love. If God loves absolutely everyone absolutely. and yet knows what they're doing with their free will,, including if they're abusive, it must be very heartbreaking to know what they do to each other with that free will. How many felt moved to stop abuse and didn't, or what have you? None of us know. But I don't believe God is indifferent. If he was human, a better term might be exhausted. :( I do think God would rather have very big solutions, not band-aids. If you love someone that's what you want too. Stop all abuse, yes, but heal everyone involved. But I don't think God is against anger towards Him, as I don't see him as egotistical, demeaning, or harsh (that is not love). It's just honest, which I'd like to think He prefers, in the name of vulnerability and intimacy. I don't see God as a God of harm(ing), which means He'd have to find a way to help those who are harmful, too. I suppose volunteering to be entirely demeaned and abused and eventually murdered, He has shown (if you believe He exists) that that's how far His love will go. And to me, to hang in there, as He 'gets' it. Easter will follow Good Friday. But hopefully we can help each other, versus harm, or be indifferent, or exclude. Love a lot.
Just my 2 cents though. (I remember pennies, we don't have them anymore. :laugh: )
ETA, won't say more, but one more thing occurred to me: I recall hearing a saying many many years ago, ~''many diabolical nets are thrown to wrench the faith from hearts'. It didn't say, wrench their faith in God, or their pocketbooks away, or anything else, it said faith. And that could come to the question, 'Who do you say I am?' Not who does your neighbour say, or whatever. And more specifically, who or what do you put your faith in? And I don't think there's a wrong answer to that. There's only a personal answer.
I think it's safe to say, we've all seen or been subjected to diabolical things by their gruesomeness or nature, and have heard of many more, if we were lucky enough to have not witnessed or endured them ourselves. But what anyone believes, including believing God doesn't exist, has to be personal. And I think is good. Because I think (personally) every good quality that comes from that- fighting for justice, accountability, stopping abuse, etc- is also one of God's characteristics. So maybe one person for eg typifies gentleness, but another courage, another strength. And doing good, no matter what beliefs, is the end game, and I think God's goal too. (That's what I meant and missed the edit. ? ).
Like Oskar Schindler ('Schindler's List'); he didn't believe in God, though he came to, or at least wasn't following as such (womanizing, drinking, gambling, indifferent, etc etc), but those qualities, choices, and (non) beliefs perfectly situated him and made him capable of saving many lives, and which would have never been possible without it. So not-believing, fully qualified him to do something most wonderful, that many others never have could have.
But one has to go by their experiences, perhaps looking farther reaching than just the aftermath. Not sure if God-or-no God anyone can escape suffering, but I have found some things to be too coincidental for coincidence. No matter what, we become who we are. In my case, I try to choose the God I know must be, based on what good I have received, often that I can't explain.
My sister says free will is the problem, why give people free will, when they choose such terrible things? But there can be no love without freedom to choose it. And the freedom to not choose it, to say I don't believe in God, or I believe in something else, or I believe in it or something, but I don't want it. I think even people don't want 'forced' love- or it's not love at all. I think anyone with or without a belief can twist things to what they believe, but it doesn't change whatever is true. Personally, I see God as love. If God loves absolutely everyone absolutely. and yet knows what they're doing with their free will,, including if they're abusive, it must be very heartbreaking to know what they do to each other with that free will. How many felt moved to stop abuse and didn't, or what have you? None of us know. But I don't believe God is indifferent. If he was human, a better term might be exhausted. :( I do think God would rather have very big solutions, not band-aids. If you love someone that's what you want too. Stop all abuse, yes, but heal everyone involved. But I don't think God is against anger towards Him, as I don't see him as egotistical, demeaning, or harsh (that is not love). It's just honest, which I'd like to think He prefers, in the name of vulnerability and intimacy. I don't see God as a God of harm(ing), which means He'd have to find a way to help those who are harmful, too. I suppose volunteering to be entirely demeaned and abused and eventually murdered, He has shown (if you believe He exists) that that's how far His love will go. And to me, to hang in there, as He 'gets' it. Easter will follow Good Friday. But hopefully we can help each other, versus harm, or be indifferent, or exclude. Love a lot.
Just my 2 cents though. (I remember pennies, we don't have them anymore. :laugh: )
ETA, won't say more, but one more thing occurred to me: I recall hearing a saying many many years ago, ~''many diabolical nets are thrown to wrench the faith from hearts'. It didn't say, wrench their faith in God, or their pocketbooks away, or anything else, it said faith. And that could come to the question, 'Who do you say I am?' Not who does your neighbour say, or whatever. And more specifically, who or what do you put your faith in? And I don't think there's a wrong answer to that. There's only a personal answer.
I think it's safe to say, we've all seen or been subjected to diabolical things by their gruesomeness or nature, and have heard of many more, if we were lucky enough to have not witnessed or endured them ourselves. But what anyone believes, including believing God doesn't exist, has to be personal. And I think is good. Because I think (personally) every good quality that comes from that- fighting for justice, accountability, stopping abuse, etc- is also one of God's characteristics. So maybe one person for eg typifies gentleness, but another courage, another strength. And doing good, no matter what beliefs, is the end game, and I think God's goal too. (That's what I meant and missed the edit. ? ).
Like Oskar Schindler ('Schindler's List'); he didn't believe in God, though he came to, or at least wasn't following as such (womanizing, drinking, gambling, indifferent, etc etc), but those qualities, choices, and (non) beliefs perfectly situated him and made him capable of saving many lives, and which would have never been possible without it. So not-believing, fully qualified him to do something most wonderful, that many others never have could have.
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