Envy?

[Casey_03]

I titled this thread envy because I suspect that after I write my thoughts, someone might suggest this is nothing but envy. But I wonder if others on here can relate, and I am guessing that many can. I can no longer stand 99.9% of people. Why? Because so many people are ignorant of what it means to really suffer and be on their own in this world. I am so sick of talking to acquaintances/colleagues/friends and explaining that I am having a difficult time only to have them say something like, "Well, can't you just go home?" or "You're being dramatic, just have your family help you." Some people do not have homes, or anywhere to go if shit hits the fan - I'm one of them. Some people don't have family, or their family cannot help - I am one of them. I can no longer tolerate sheltered people who have it easy and think that because they live in this safe little bubble, so does the rest of the world and anybody who says otherwise is just being emotional or dramatic. I have always avoided sheltered people and been drawn to those who have struggled or been tested in some way, but in recent months the divide is becoming more and more obvious. I should clarify, some people who are sheltered and have had great lives are still incredibly wise and understanding of the world -- I have no problem with them. I have a problem with people who project their sheltered notion of the world onto everyone else and assume everything is easy. Is this envy? I guess part of it might be, though part might also just be that i find it really difficult to relate to people like this, and they to me. Does anyone else have this issue?

 

[Sideways]

Damn those normal people with perfect lives!! Oh, no wait - the people that I know, and I mean really know, not just 'superficial' know...none of them would qualify as normal. And their life ain't nothin like mine, but it'd be rough for me to say that they're living 'suffering free' lives. It's different suffering, sure, and I think I got more than my share maybe, but 'everybody hurts...sometimes'.

If you met me, and we had a coffee and a chat - I look pretty 'normal', I talk it, I walk it, I can pull off being the Normal Master. No way am I gonna let you get any hint that I'm anything but the very definition of 'Normal'. But clearly, when I let you in under the BS exterior, there's a whole lotta suffereing going on that you can't see.

I don't think what you're describing is envy - it's just mythical. The 'Normal' person, who never experiences suffering, based on my experience, is a complete myth. The rest of the world don't understand & they say the wrong thing, but no one on the planet is completely Normal and completely without suffering.

 

[Pretty Hurts]

i don't sense anything envious about the feelings you've described.

i can relate. i don't like to talk beyond the surface with most people. to be honest, i don't think most people really care about the suffering of others as long as they are content with their own lives.

 

[Casey_03]

@Ragdoll Circus I understand what you mean, but I'm not referring to "normal" people. I actually don't think the idea of normalcy has anything to do with it. That's not what I'm saying. I mean specifically people who live in a bubble and have never had to fend for themselves -- people who, if anything goes wrong, can always turn to their parents for assistance. I know several people like that my age, in my city, with the same profession. I don't consider them normal or think they have perfect lives, as you said -- I consider them sheltered in the sense that they always have something to fall back on. Specifically, one of these people yesterday jeopardized my job and then, when I confronted him and asked how he could do that, knowing that I have a baby on the way and literally no one to help me with it, he just said, "I'm sure if you get fired someone in your family can help you out." No, actually I don't have anyone to help me. I resent the fact that people with strong support systems assume everyone else has such support. To me, this is incredibly ignorant, and a specific type of person says such things -- one who himself has never been faced with serious difficulty in life, who doesn't understand that there are some matters that are literally life or death. I know several people around my age - 30 - who are not normal in any way and clearly have their own difficulties and hardships in life -- but who have a safety cushion. THAT is what i'm referring to, not normalcy or "perfect lives." Nowhere in my post did I even use the word " normal," so i'm not sure where you have gotten that impression. If you read to the bottom, I also clarified that I don't think all people with good lives are like this, just that there is a certain subgroup within the wider group -- as I said, people who "project their sheltered notions" onto other's lives and think everyone has the support that they do.

 

[Friday]

Envy? Covet or desire what they have? Nope. I paid too high a price to shed my ignorance, and value far too highly the freedom it's bought me.

Jealous? Also no. I'm completely unthreatened of what I have being stolen from me.

Alternately amused, enraged, disgusted, or frustrated, on the other hand... Often :P

 

[Sideways]

I'm gonna put it out there - I read your other thread and I felt disgust and outrage in equal parts at the way you have been treated. I had nothing that I felt would be helpful to contribute, and it was one of those posts where the pain was thumping out of the screen at me - real, justified pain - and I was speechless. Frustrated that I had nothing, literally nothing, that I could offer to help. Your story has definitely not gone unnoticed at my end.

But for me, I have never in my life seen anything good come from comparing pain, suffering or, for that matter, privilege.

My post above was written with your particular situation very much at the front of my mind. The point is not to diminish your suffering in any way, it is intended as a redirection. I hope (and very much would like to believe) that, despite how humanity has treated you (which, no way can I comprehend that), humanity will also come to your aid. In a way, humanity is coming to our aid just via this forum.

In that regard, I believe (just a belief, maybe it's bogus) that trying to remain open to others - they way we perceive them and are perceived in turn - is an ally when we are at our worst.

There are monsters in this world (that I can say for sure, & you've copped way more than your due when it comes to monsters) - but sometimes, in our haste to protect ourselves from more pain, shut out some of the most compassionate people walking amongst us. We need them. And they don't always come from the places we expect.

I get it if none of this resonates with you - you're in a place that I can't fathom, so there's no reason to think the same doesn't apply the other way. One thing for sure - there is no shortage of compassion at my end, just wishing I could shine a bit of light on things that maybe don't help so much...:unsure:

 

[Casey_03]

@Ragdoll Circus It does resonate with me and it means a lot, I agree with you -- I don't think the shitty treatment I've experienced should eclipse the good of people. I don't think it has. And I hope my post didn't imply that I have given up and am closed off to people, or bitter. I actually really don't want to seem bitter, and I don't think I am. I'm definitely angry. But I guess it's a pet peeve of mine when people take things in their life for granted, especially things like family and strong support systems -- which is what I think many of my friends and acquaintances have been doing. I'm just seeing it more now that I'm really really really in a bind. It's like people refuse to believe that someone's life can be this bad ... and when they refuse to believe it or say things like, "oh, just have your family send money" ... it makes me feel like they don't recognize what i'm going through or don't believe me. It's very frustrating. And I don't mean to say that people with privileged lives are better than people who have suffered -- not at all. I've known some really amazing people who came from privileged families and wealth, with great families, who still had more wisdom and compassion than others who have had it rough. I suppose it's really the lack of empathy that I'm getting at here -- people who cannot or will not see that someone else's situation is different that theirs and try to see it from their perspective.

 

[Sideways]

A little bit of bitterness right now would be pretty understandable.

That said (I've said it before, and I'm loving saying it again!) - Anger is fantastic! Rage, rage until it exhausts you. To quote, er, someone else, "when I'm angry, it's because I know I'm worth being angry for". And you are very definitely worth being angry for:)

 

[Atomic]

The way I look at this is that we are all, whether privileged, supported or not, shit end of the deal - only there by circumstance of birth. By a couple of people who created life. If one of them was damaged, we had a 50/50 chance depending on which one was stronger.

It's the sheer luck of the draw.

I'm adopted, so I get to look at my life as it is vs what it could have been. I love my birth family, but am so glad they handed me over to people who had a clue. Not perfect (nobody is) but I got a chance.

 

[Ronin]

I love @Ragdoll Circus ' words on anger. Words to live by.

Cough, to topic, yes. Can't tell you what you're feeling, up to you to determine.

In my life, envy doesn't really concern me that much. I don't want what they have - I want what I have & want, better, and them out of my way as I work on it, but that's different from envy.

Jealous, I don't tend to be, because that's a loss of energy I can be putting to getting to my darned goals instead. Envy & jealousy are basically two strangers I rather stay strangers with. Any time I don't, I know I'm doing it wrong.

 

[Tinyflame]

A lady I know said a young girl she knows (friend's dtr) was flaky & carefree, clueless until her baby got & fought cancer for 3 years (they're doing well now). She said "good, it smartened her up". (I said) I think differently, maybe God wanted her to have those initial days, knowing what she would have to struggle with later.

I always think, even anyone can get ptsd at any time.

(But I don't speak about stuff to clueless/ angry ones.)

 

[EveHarrington]

Maybe feel a little bad because they have an inability to see the whole picture? They only see slices of reality.

I sometimes complain about where I am in life, but I am eternally grateful that my eyes are wide open and I can appreciate the many facets of human existence, even if I have no personal experience with them.