Dom Violence How to move forward and set boundaries

[Friday]

MOD NOTE : I’m moving this thread from the Supporter Section to Trauma & Stressors. Whilst there are many people with PTSD who are also abusive? (Just like any other disorder or condition will have people who are also abusive.) As this does not appear to be the struggle you’re facing, leaving this thread here is both tacitly supporting a lie you’ve been told to justify your ongoing abuse, and isn’t giving your the best possible support for the struggles you are facing.

If you, or anyone else reading this, would like to discuss ^^^this^^^ please do NOT reply to this post, but use Contact Us

Thanks!

 

[Movingforward10]

I should add that she has the stomach issue about once every few months and usually it's external stress and not me

To answer your question about what on particular looks like you being an abused person justifying her abuse of you, I've just selected a few quotes from the section in your post where you are responding to me

This example above ^^. This is you highlighting she has a legitimate health issue. But, a health issue is something for a medical person to help her with and she needs to seek out. This issue is being used as justification for her behaviour. It isn't one. You accepting that it is is you being manipulated and groomed into her lies to keep you feeling compassion for her. "If only you behaved better she wouldn't be in pain and have this issue." Is the message and lie. When actually "if she sought medical help and changed her lifestyle or emotional responses then her stress levels would reduce and she wouldn't be in pain" is way more likely to be the truth.

also don't just "disagree" and often I'm manipulating like I said above to try and downplay some mistake I made

This again is another example. When someone is scared of another person and treading on egg shells, being totally honest is going to be met with abuse. So you might say a version of the truth to try and defuse the situation. That is then met with abuse and further manipulation. And this becomes a cycle.
You aren't manipulating here. You're being abused and trying to adapt behaviour to reduce abuse. Although you don't see it as you believe her lies. It's always your fault right? You behaving in wrong ways that upset her that's the abused mindset.

(procrastinating on filing taxes until last day,

This is ok. This is normal! We all do this. Why would this be a bad thing? You got it done. And it's your responsibility. She's using every day things to blame you.

not remembering her cleanliness protocols e

Again, this is ok. We all clean differently. If something like a cleaning ritual sends her off then she needs to address that. It's her trigger to manage. Not for you to adapt behaviour.

rather than full on apologizing and not making any excuses

You don't have anything to apologise for really in the examples you have given. She is using elements of truth, twisting them and making them way bigger, to manipulate and abuse you. These are classic abusive behaviours.

That's what is triggering to her and causes her to lose it

Again, her triggers are for her. If she loses it , it is for her to work on that. Not for you to adapt your behaviour so that she doesn't lose it. Because no doubt the goal posts change all the time. You adapt in way A and then she springs up way B needs doing. And then way C. And then a version of way A. So that you can never win. Never do it right. And the abuse continues.

as when we were working through my betrayal and the things I did behind her back I kept arguing and downplaying and it became a huge trauma point for her.

You didn't actually betray her. This has been used as the justification for her behaviour. And has been blown up into something massive when it wasn't.
A sign of a very unhealthy relationship is one where the same issue is argued about over and over and over again. A healthy relationship there is an argument , both sides hear each other, apologies made, each is understood and it is over. Never to be argued about again as the issued is resolved.

I say the above by being in a healthy relationship for 20 years. And having been in a coercively controlling one for 5 years before that. The controlling behaviour is always in an element of truth which is why it works so well to manipulate reality. And your compassion for their wellbeing is manipulated and abused. The mix of those things make you adapt your behaviour, and try and behave in a way that keeps them ok by abandoning yourself. And the deeper and longer it goes on for , the more normal it gets and the abuse gets worse bit by bit, but that's hard to see when you are in it.

 

[Abstract]

.. .when she had beaten me up one morning and ... but she ended up being arrested ...

the point of physical abuse. Thankfully, the physical part has gone from almost daily to 2-3 times a month and will usually just be some slapping and choking when it used to be punching, scratching, and drawing blood.
.....
started pulling my hair as I had so much anxiety over her anger and yelling at me.
....
She slapped me for...

... and being abusive towards her.

This is what it comes down to. And your feelings of being responsible for her emotions and behaviour are another classic sign of someone being abused. They all tend to come together in a neat parcel.

And yet you describe yourself as being abusive.

Do you want to say what they arrested her for? What were the charges.

If you had a son and he was in this situation what would you think?

 

[abovedown]

This is what it comes down to. And your feelings of being responsible for her emotions and behaviour are another classic sign of someone being abused. They all tend to come together in a neat parcel.

And yet you describe yourself as being abusive.

Do you want to say what they arrested her for? What were the charges.

If you had a son and he was in this situation what would you think?

@scruffybiscuit I somehow totally missed that she has been choking you (!). It might make sense to keep some kind of diary when and how she has been abusive towards you (with pictures of the bruises, cuts etc). Even if you don't want press charges or go to police, it would be a good evidence for yourself what has been done to you and when.

 

[scruffybiscuit]

Have you considered marriage counseling where you could discuss your situation and decide what to do with your situation?

We tried this early on a couple months after I confessed to her. After our first session they said she needed to work on patience and I needed to work on listening and my communication (I'm a pretty bad listener and it takes a while sometimes for me to get what she's saying). Later that week my wife was going through my computer while still uncovering my betrayal and found I had mentioned my ex 70+ times in work chats and mentioned her less than 10 times. That led to a big fight where she gave me a black eye. I texted it to the marriage counselor and later confessed that I had done so. She made me text them back asking them to delete and had me send pictures of bruises on my wife's arms that I had caused from pushing her away and holding her arms back when she kept trying to hit me. They texted her a bunch asking if she was ok and we cut contact with them. This incident led to my wife not trusting me more and us never talking to a marriage counselor again and she won't ever consider it.

How do I help someone to stop abusing me? Or How do I stop downplaying what I did and accept that I deserve to be abused?

Do you see how both of these questions are deeply problematic?

I agree but also realize that I do a lot of things that are morally wrong (lying/downplaying) and throw fits where I get upset sometimes after our multiple hour long sessions talking about what I did wrong cause me to express my frustration to her and say things I regret (usually minimizing her trauma and telling her to get over it etc). I need to work on this and need to fix this. She doesn't abuse me unless I first lie or make excuses for my actions.

That is then met with abuse and further manipulation. And this becomes a cycle.
You aren't manipulating here. You're being abused and trying to adapt behaviour to reduce abuse. Although you don't see it as you believe her lies. It's always your fault right?

I don't know here.... I find it really hard to see that she's manipulating me. She is pretty straightforward. Today we had a fight where we were talking and she asked me if I we could talk about flights for a trip. I said I didn't think she wanted to do the trip anymore as she had said earlier before breakfast when I asked about it that she didn't want to talk about it. She said that what she had said is "I didn't want to talk about it before breakfast" and then I said I thought she said she didn't want to talk about it at all and that's what I heard. We went back and forth a few more times and then she got upset that I was getting defensive instead of just talking about the trips in the first place. She told me to stand up and stand in front of her to discuss this (what we always do when she needs to "talk" to me when I've done something wrong). I said that was abusive and stormed off. Later when I came back we talked about how it wasn't abusive for her to ask me to stand and talk so that she has my attention because I don't listen well. She had me act out the conversation again and had me record it and play it back to myself to show how defensive I was about not talking about the trip instead of just answering her question in the first place and talking about the trip.

Again, this is ok. We all clean differently. If something like a cleaning ritual sends her off then she needs to address that. It's her trigger to manage. Not for you to adapt behaviour.

She has OCD (pretty sure it's containment OCD but undiagnosed) and we have talked about the rituals thousands of times and I still make mistakes sometimes. This is an area where it's not just me that can trigger the anxiety and so I think this one is a bit different as others have triggered her here too.

Again, her triggers are for her. If she loses it , it is for her to work on that.

I agree she has to work on this, but I also need to not trigger her when I know what could trigger her. A few days ago she got really upset at me as I got frustrated that we spent 2 hours talking through something I did that triggered her and said that she needed to "own her anxiety" and it wasn't mine to manage. It came out differently and what I meant is that she owns how she reacts when she's anxious and she's responsible for her actions. Instead I ended up having to spend 2 more hours talking about how I caused all of her anxiety when I betrayed her (she never used to have anxiety before that) and that I am responsible for supporting her and caring for her when she's triggered. She was really upset that I was blaming her for us having to talk about her triggers when I'm the one that caused her to have triggers in the first place with my actions and now I don't even want to console her when she is triggered from things I do.

You didn't actually betray her. This has been used as the justification for her behaviour. And has been blown up into something massive when it wasn't.

How did I not betray her? When we first met she felt I had baggage and said she'd give me space to get rid of it. I said I didn't have baggage (ended up being a huge lie). I then ended up lying about doing work for and loaning most of my money to my ex for her business. I told her a very light version rather than reality. In the meanwhile, I was cheap to my wife on our dates and she paid when my ex hadn't paid. I also had talked up my ex's business and didn't really show much interest in my wife's career/job. All of this came out in the first year we were dating, when I confessed my lies from the first few months and then my wife started digging into what was going on (looking at credit card statements etc). Then a couple months later my ex went crazy and started harassing her online and started a frivilous lawsuit against my wife and lied in court. All of this completely broke my wife and caused her the trauma she has never healed from. She was always a sweet, rule following, gentle person and having this all happen to her was too much. She does a really good job moving forward but then there are triggers from me that cause fights.

Do you want to say what they arrested her for? What were the charges.

Domestic violence charge after I called them hoping to get her a mental health check after she said some things about being suicidal and got really mad at me that morning. They said she seemed fine and I showed them my bruises and asked them to please take her for a mental health check and made them promise not to arrest her. They then arrested her for it....

 

[Movingforward10]

You're in this really deeply.

It's totally not ok and not normal to have her make you stand and talk for hours about minute little things. Everything in your post is abuse by her of you. And how you justify every single thing is showing how ingrained her brain washing (as this is what manipulation is) has become.

You came on here for a reason. As you know you're struggling with her behaviour/abuse.

What do your friends and family say about this relationship?

Do you have a therapist to talk this through?

 

[abovedown]

You're in this really deeply.

It's totally not ok and not normal to have her make you stand and talk for hours about minute little things. Everything in your post is abuse by her of you. And how you justify every single thing is showing how ingrained her brain washing (as this is what manipulation is) has become.

You came on here for a reason. As you know you're struggling with her behaviour/abuse.

What do your friends and family say about this relationship?

Do you have a therapist to talk this through?

Agreed it seems she is treating you like a misbehaving child. What if next time she feels the urge to punch or choke you she could be the one to stand next to a wall or some other place of her choosing to calm down?

@scruffybiscuit what if the roles were reserved and she would be the one who loaned most her money to her ex, hiding it from you and her ex would have sued you? Would you still think that it would be ok to punch or choke her? Would it make sense to make her to stand next to a wall of you are having a bad day? Or would all these be counterproductive to actually solve your issues and move on with your lives?

 

[scruffybiscuit]

What do your friends and family say about this relationship?

I haven’t had any real conversations about anything with anyone outside of her, her mom, and coworkers since 2020

It's totally not ok and not normal to have her make you stand and talk for hours about minute little things.

I know but these things happen all the time (me arguing about stupid things, not following expectations about things we agree to etc). Eventually she needs to talk so she can trust it won’t happen again as I’ve failed her and she needs to feel safe

what if the roles were reserved and she would be the one who loaned most her money to her ex, hiding it from you and her ex would have sued you?

I would get over it and move on… I agree but she thinks about things differently than me and feels much stronger about what is right/wrong

Still trying to figure out what’s abusive from her and what’s me being abusive

 

[somerandomguy]

Still trying to figure out what’s abusive from her and what’s me being abusive

All the abuse is from her.

 

[abovedown]

I know but these things happen all the time (me arguing about stupid things, not following expectations about things we agree to etc). Eventually she needs to talk so she can trust it won’t happen again as I’ve failed her and she needs to feel safe

What would need to happen in this relationship in order you to feel safe? Would it be possible for you to rekindle your relationships to your family and friends?

 

[Movingforward10]

haven’t had any real conversations about anything with anyone outside of her, her mom, and coworkers since 2020

Why is that?
I wasn't surprised to hear this and was expecting this answer. Being isolated is a common thing for someone who is being abused on a relationship.

Maybe a step forward is getting some friends of your own and having social experiences away from her. Is that something you are interested in? Remember, you don't need her permission to have friends or hobbies. And if she says you do: then that is another sign of her abuse of you.

I’ve failed her

Nope! Why are little things, that everyone does, failure of another person.
I went shopping and bought myself some treats but not my partner. That was thoughtless of me and I realised that. Was it me failing her? Not at all!
It wasn't kind. It wasn't caring. But it was a moment. And that's ok. I'm human. I make mistakes. I don't need to stand against a wall or stand for hours whilst she berates my failing. I apologise. I pop out and get her a treat. She accepts. We all move on. .

The fact she is using any tiny little thing that you did or an imagined thing that you did as failing her. Is abuse.

I agree but she thinks about things differently than me

Keep that part of you that agrees there. What is it that you agree about? Forget her needs for a moment.
What is it you agree about?

And then, why are you accepting her behaviour?


Her behaviour is really really worrying and serious. It's her abuse. Have you ever choked her? I suspect your answer is no.
And just an absolutely awful reminder: choking someone can kill them. That's the risk she is prepared to take when she has done that to you, or when she does that again to you. If anything is failure here: it's her failure to consider any part of your welfare in those moments when she is doing acts that could be fatal for you. It's that serious.
I suspect this is something you don't want to hear and might want to avoid thinking about. But putting it out there anyways.

 

[abovedown]

Nope! Why are little things, that everyone does, failure of another person.
I went shopping and bought myself some treats but not my partner. That was thoughtless of me and I realised that. Was it me failing her? Not at all!
It wasn't kind. It wasn't caring. But it was a moment. And that's ok. I'm human. I make mistakes. I don't need to stand against a wall or stand for hours whilst she berates my failing. I apologise. I pop out and get her a treat. She accepts. We all move on.

This! We are make mistakes but in a healthy relationships we deal with them and move on. I believe it would do you good to get more people In your life. Also maybe you could consider taking more time for yourself. Are there any hobbies you used to enjoy but dont have had time to do lately?