General I Think I've Got A Name For It Now... Childhood Emotional Neglect.

[macca]

And even stranger, it didn't occur to me to talk to them about it.

Yes! That was me too!

I like to say that my (mom especially) just "Disappears" unpleasant things.

My Mum was a master at that too. On a lighter note, I'll tell a funny story about that, amongst all this serious stuff. Once she was in the car with me when some guy cut me off, and before I could stop myself I swore - my Mum NEVER swears - she ignored that too, and for once I was grateful for it, even though it was awkward!

 

[Eleanor]

When my first marriage was breaking up, my now-ex thought I was having an affair (I wasn't) and he emailed it to my parents and brothers. I insisted he email a retraction, which he did. And I was (for once) grateful, because I knew with 100% certainty that NO ONE in my family would ever bring it up unless I did!

Clearly, there is a kind of peculiar adaptiveness to this "disappearing" thing, but the price is far to high. It is like...you have to keep disappearing things and eventually yourself. I finally figured out that my folks are alcoholics (of the serious drinks in the evening to get to sleep sort) and my mom is clearly using medication to control her mood. They are benign, once you know what NOT to expect from them. If you expect something other than glossing over, you will get hurt. That's what I've learned.

 

[EverOnly358]

The irony in this, a little child who does not want to be any trouble to anyone, a teenager that still cant ask for anything, years of taking care of others every need and expecting nothing in return, particularly from a passive aggressive husband, can turn into a disabled woman that is a burden on all (me).

This is me, too. I'm terrible at asking for help and when I try it's an utter disaster almost every time. I know I'm doing something wrong, but I have no idea what that something is! I guess two things make me feel better... 1) Knowing now that there's a reason, that my needs were ignored as a child so I never really learned how to express my needs and emotions (this is so much better than what I believed before... that I was defective and worthless) and 2) That the world seeks balance... I've catered to my family's every need for over 16 years... now I need extra care and understanding; I need a turn. Just thinking that helps me. It's hard though, because I have so thoroughly trained everyone around me that I have no needs and no one needs to waste their time on me. I don't know how to change their minds, now that I'm starting to believe I'm worth better treatment than that.

As for the questionnaire, I scored 22/22. And even while looking at it, I'm thinking to myself, "No, I'm probably just making a big deal out of nothing..."

I doubt my own thoughts and feelings, and tell myself I'm making too much of a big deal out of how my childhood was! I think we do it, because we are so used to being undermined and subtly invalidated, that it has become our default mode!

Me, too, to both of these quotes!!! I just want to say, it makes me feel better that I'm not alone in feeling this way. I really just thought I was the only one.

Do any of you struggle a lot with self-care... eating, drinking water, getting exercise, getting sleep, etc.? Because sometimes I have such a hard time feeling like I even deserve food or water or anything, it's such a struggle. I know it's not helping my overall health to ignore these things... but still there are times I can't convince myself I'm worth it. I dunno. Does anyone else experience this? Has anyone found good ways to combat this? (Or is it just me???)

D123

 

[macca]

@D123 I don't usually struggle with eating or drinking, but I often ignore my need for sleep, and have a very bad habit of ignoring pain.

 

[Eleanor]

Do any of you struggle a lot with self-care... eating, drinking water, getting exercise, getting sleep, etc.?

Yes yes yes. My poor T must get so tired of reminding me to take care of myself. Here is what I am doing now, I am not thinking about me as "me" I am thinking about me as "L's mom" or about me as a kid (inner child). Those I seems to be able to take some better care of.

In meditation class several years ago the first instruction was to "sit comfortably." I was, needless to say, very uncomfortable through the whole thing. I went up to the teacher after the class and said "Ok, I know this is going to sound dumb, but, when you say "comfortable" do you mean Actually Comfortable. Like, Really Comfortable, like, as in nothing hurts even a little?" And she, very patiently, said that that is just what she meant. No physical discomfort. At all. It was a shocker to me. I'd spent the whole class noticing all the ways in which I was uncomfortable that I never usually noticed. I wondered what other whole areas of discomfort I just habitually ignore or discount...

 

[Cyrene]

Do any of you struggle a lot with self-care... eating, drinking water, getting exercise, getting sleep, etc.? Because sometimes I have such a hard time feeling like I even deserve food or water or anything, it's such a struggle.

I sleep way too much (side effect of the depression, likely as not), so I'm okay in that regard...sort of. I guess sleeping too much is, in its own way, a lack of self-care, lol.

Food, though...I've noticed that lately (the past couple of years) I feel like I don't deserve to ask my parents to get certain things I like or want to try from the grocery store, or to cook certain things that I want since I've gotten sick of the same stuff over and over again. I feel like I shouldn't ask them to "waste money" on me (this is actually also my rationale for dragging my feet on asking them to possibly pay for therapy again) when I'm such a useless lazybutt around the house, and I also feel like it's high time I learned how to cook things myself. The problem is that I hate being out of my room (the rest of my house simultaneously bores me and makes me feel uncomfortable), so bothering with spending enough time and energy futzing around in the kitchen is a challenge. Many times I just end up not eating much or even eating at all. So when I'm not sleeping, I get by on copious amounts of Mountain Dew instead. :confused: I'm getting a little better about drinking water with it, at least, though it means that I have to constantly go to the bathroom. Oops.

(Addendum to the food thing: My mom has actually asked for suggestions on what else to cook, because she's mentioned that even she gets tired of eating/cooking the same thing. But she's never followed up on any of my suggestions and though she has a bunch of exotic cookbooks, I've never seen her crack those open before. Just one of many things my mother hasn't followed up on...)

I don't exercise, either. Fortunately (knock on wood) my health is currently cooperating with me to the point that it doesn't look like I have to exercise. But I know I have very low flexibility and endurance, and my diet is horrendous, so at some point I'd like to change that. But...just can't bring myself to start trying... :(

 

[Abstract]

They are benign, once you know what NOT to expect from them. If you expect something other than glossing over, you will get hurt. That's what I've learned.

The big problem Eleanor is that little children don't have that prerogative and they rely on their parents for some essential parts of their development. That reflection back and recognition of your feelings and individuality is what builds your self. It is like the missing element that links up everything in us and helps us be whole and manage to function in the world. So even though you can now wisely (well done by the way!) recognise that you are not going to get what you need at home and look elsewhere you are still stuck with the longer term patters and after effects of the deficit from way back when!

It totally makes sense that you would end up in relationships where your emotional needs are not being met.

It was a shocker to me

This is the very most fundemental thing that goes wrong in my opinion. Essentially emotional and other types of neglect result us being profoundly disconnected. I remember doing autonomic training and being freaked out completely for much the same reasons.

It sounds like you are making a lot of connections recently and that is wonderful as is sure to speed you along to increased happiness.

I didn't exist

Its bordering on delusional macca. Terrible.

Everyone's stories are horrible. And the nasty thing about this stuff is that it is insidious and hard to put your finger on it. Like they said in the article. And that it leaves us feeling non human and invisible or disconnected and without value.

 

[Eleanor]

And the nasty thing about this stuff is that it is insidious and hard to put your finger on it.

Right, because it is about what DIDN'T happen. Over and over and over again. So there is literally nothing to put your finger on.

So now I kind of live in fear of "what am I just missing?"

I love love love coherence and logic in my understanding - and I wonder where the gaps are? If that makes any sense.

 

[Abstract]

So now I kind of live in fear of "what am I just missing?" I love love love coherence and logic in my understanding - and I wonder where the gaps are?

I understand both of these. Sometimes I think we need to go with what the emotions are telling us even when there is no exact memory. The emotions tell a story. Th other helpful thing I find is looking at the present behaviour of your parents and listening to what that says about possible reactions in the past. One of my t's was very good at making me do that.

Maybe also look at what you can remember being there and then see what you find is missing that you would expect to remember.

I don't recall my mom even talking to me about it. And even stranger, it didn't occur to me to talk to them about it.

This says an enormous amount.

 

[Eleanor]

I was traumatized in childhood by not being comforted after witnessing scary events

I cannot imagine treating my grown (step and adopted) daughters like this! Or even my big strong Army officer son in law! Much less my precious 7 year old girl. The lack is Important. And yet when I was young it felt... entirely normal and natural. I was just On My Own.

I thought I was just too independent, but I suppose that can't be true at small ages, 4, 5, or 6, etc.

I grew up with the notion that my parents were doing everything they could to be loving parents,

Nope. Definitely not. It is partly a function of the times I think, people nowadays just KNOW much more about child development, and while there is a lot of knowledge and attention paid to motor and cognitive development, and a little to social development, the stuff on emotional development is still tough to find and sketchy.

And even while looking at it, I'm thinking to myself, "No, I'm probably just making a big deal out of nothing..."

Yeah, I feel like that a lot... It is definitely an established habit.

It's hard though, because I have so thoroughly trained everyone around me that I have no needs and no one needs to waste their time on me. I don't know how to change their minds, now that I'm starting to believe I'm worth better treatment than that.

"If it was trained in, it can be trained out." so says my old horse trainer. He should know. He spent a lot of time "fixing" people's horses and then sending them back only to have their owners undo all his work. Sigh.

It helps, I think, to be clear. To announce a course change, and then be clear about what you do need. Easier said than done, (HAHAHAHAHA) but still, true I think. I have a terrible time even knowing what a "need" is. I get past Maslow's hierarchy and I'm out. So I have to look up lists on the web. CNVC has a couple of good ones.

(((((((((((all))))))))))

Nice not to be alone. And this is something I suspect sufferers of childhood abuse and supporters generally share.

 

[Tinyflame]

Yes I (thought?) I was On My Own too Eleanor. ((((((((Eleanor)))))))

I guess we have to even recognize it, to begin to change it.

What do you mean, as per 'supporters' Eleanor? :confused:

 

[Eleanor]

Well, my pet theory is that people fall in love with others who are just as screwed up as they are, but in an opposite way. So if one has issues about, say, control, you will almost certainly fall in love with someone who has the same issue, but the opposite coping strategy. So if I deal with my control issues by being mostly out of control, and letting others call the shots I will fall in love with someone who always keeps themselves and those around them on a very tight rein. The problems come when one of us tries to get better and moves toward the other position, almost never at the same pace as the other person. If we both grow the relationships flourishes. If not, we break up or suffer. It is positively uncanny how we human beings can recognize our issues in people we've never met before. If this theory is true, the it implies that those of us who choose to get into relationships with PTSD sufferers (knowingly or unknowingly) almost certainly have the same "issues" but opposite ways of coping.

In my own case I can review the history of my major friendships and romantic relationships and I ALWAYS (except once) pick people who suffered abuse in childhood. Spooky. But, I thought I Wasn't Abused so what is this all about? If CEN counts as a kind of abuse (which I'd say it certainly does, at least for everybody else, but maybe not so much in my case:whistling:;)) Then... I guess I was, and so the issues are the same. For me the biggie that I knew about when we got together was abandonment. His too. Apparently there are others I was unaware of. Having my feelings matter for one. Martydom script for another. I could go on...